Is Ohtani a must sign?

[Kinkotheclown]

I'm a little surprised at some of the responses. Most of us here are always saying to sign the best players and then we talk about how we missed on some players. Bottom line for me is when signing a player is he going to make the team better. On the business side the club looks at what is the ROI for this player.

Doc mentioned all of the positives in the player. I can't think of anyone other than Aaron James Judge that can equal or give Ohtani a run for his money when it comes to hitting. On top of that he is also an ELITE pitcher. The question to ask is do you move around your roster for a player of this caliber to come in? Answer to that is yes BTW. Who would you rather DH? If you want a round robin of DH to give guys a slight break just give them the entire day off and use them off of the bench. I rather the production from Ohtani batting.

I would absolutely give him a 50MM a year contract and not look back. This leads into the ROI...He is the first MLB player with 4 million Instagram follower and currently at 5 million. Think about the international dollars this dude could bring in.

Compared to the salaries of Rendon, Correa, Turner, Machado, Bogarts, Devers, etc he would probably net a higher contract then them and then you add in the pitching. Look at Scherzer, Cole, Verlander, Strasburg, Degrom contracts he would net a higher contract than those players as well.

I would give Ohtani a contract.

40-45 per and get rid of Stanton? Yes.

Now if money is a non issue and they would be willing to sit or waive a guy like Stanton? Sure, give him 50.

The other issue that I look at is injury potential. If you lose him for any reason, you've lost a TORP and your DH..

[dayners81]

Ohtani is probably the best talent in baseball. He's not in the conversation for the best pitcher, he throws every 6 days which throws off your rotation. He doesn't pitch a normal TORP type innings load and we all know every pitcher is one pitch from TJS
.
He is probably the best DH, but is a DH worth 30m plus a yr?

40-45m per I would offer him a deal, 50-60m per and well over half a billion, pass

[EnochRoot]

I 100% disagree with that statement . That is my honest opinion. I think he is an exceptional good pitcher and an exceptional hitter.
He is the most unique player. I do not believe he is the best. I feel that to be the best, you need to be the best at your position and that does not include DH. There are a quite a few players I would take over him.

Trout is still the best in the game. Given the choice of one of those two in their prime, I will choose trout every time.

I do agree that they shouldn't make deals contingent on Judge's feelings but I do think they need to tread respectfully. By all reports, he took less than he could have to play for the Yankees. I do think that turning around and give someone 50% more is a slap in the face.
Ohtani for 40-45? Ok. 50-60? No.

He pitched a 2.33 ERA last year, struckout a league leading 11.9k/9 and had a 1.01 WHIP. That's not in the conversation for best pitcher (dayners81's words, not yours)? That's crazy.

For the record, the reason the Angels DH him is because they refuse to risk losing him to injury in the field. An interesting gambit for the Yankees to take would be to make him their starting LF, and use him as a RP / spot starter. He's got a freakin cannon for an arm.

[EnochRoot]

....and Judge is chopped liver? He is the leader and captain of the team. His thoughts and feelings matter. Imo Judge would have no issue welcoming Ohtani. He wants to win.

If memory serves he was the AL MVP and led the world in almost every offensive category last season.

2017 AL Rookie of the Year
2019 Wilson Def Player
2021 All-MLB Team 1
2022 All-MLB Team 1
2022 AL Hank Aaron Award
2022 Major League Player of the Year
2022 AL MVP

and that my friend is just the tip of the iceberg! He's a 3X silver slugger winner, Leader in overall WAR and Offensive WAR, the list is exhaustive.

Judge is in the conversation as one of the best players in baseball. No argument from me.

[Kinkotheclown]

He pitched a 2.33 ERA last year, struckout a league leading 11.9k/9 and had a 1.01 WHIP. That's not in the conversation for best pitcher (dayners81's words, not yours)? That's crazy.

For the record, the reason the Angels DH him is because they refuse to risk losing him to injury in the field. An interesting gambit for the Yankees to take would be to make him their starting LF, and use him as a RP / spot starter. He's got a freakin cannon for an arm.

I said he was an exceptional pitcher! I just don't think he's the best all around player.
For the life of me, I don't know why they don't play him at 1B. If they did that and he was good, then it's a different conversation.

[johnnyi]

I said he was an exceptional pitcher! I just don't think he's the best all around player.
For the life of me, I don't know why they don't play him at 1B. If they did that and he was good, then it's a different conversation.

He's been protected. He seldom pitches or doesn't pitch against a lot of the best teams and when he does, his ERA is significantly higher. I did the research a while ago and the only decent team that he pitched against was the Astros and that's because they are in the same division. He avoids the Yankees ever since he got bombed by them, he avoided series with the Mets and Braves and Dodgers, etc. He's great, but his team also protects him and picks his spots.

[EnochRoot]

He's been protected. He seldom pitches or doesn't pitch against a lot of the best teams and when he does, his ERA is significantly higher. I did the research a while ago and the only decent team that he pitched against was the Astros and that's because they are in the same division. He avoids the Yankees ever since he got bombed by them, he avoided series with the Mets and Braves and Dodgers, etc. He's great, but his team also protects him and picks his spots.

This is nonsense. Seriously, do you believe your own words here?

[EnochRoot]

I said he was an exceptional pitcher! I just don't think he's the best all around player.
For the life of me, I don't know why they don't play him at 1B. If they did that and he was good, then it's a different conversation.

I think it's folly to assume the chore of the Angels' franchise decisions. 1B would be a great spot to stash him in his later 30s, though. What blew my mind is the fact so many Yankee fans are eager to run this guy down. That's just so hilariously stupid/shortsighted.

[Kinkotheclown]

I think it's folly to assume the chore of the Angels' franchise decisions. 1B would be a great spot to stash him in his later 30s, though. What blew my mind is the fact so many Yankee fans are eager to run this guy down. That's just so hilariously stupid/shortsighted.

If Otahni and his role is a chore, I certainly don't want him.

I understand your points but I don't see anyone "running him down". If me saying that I don't think he's the best player in the game is running him down, that leaves an extremely wide berth for, what is considered, running him down.

I have seen posters say no thank you but that was because of the suggestion of 50-60 mil
No one suggested, he isn't a fantastic player.

I also think some may be looking from a perspective of the tax threshold and what they think is realistic.
Yes, they have a bunch of money off the books next year.

But if you sign him, it will be a 10 year deal. Let's say 50 per.

Cole 36 per through 2028
Rodon 27 per through 2028
Stanton (average it out with the Marlins donation-) 26 per through 2027
Judge 40 per through 2031

If you add Otahni?

That's 179 per for 5 players, for 4 years.

I agree with whoever posted about the potential revenue brought in by Otahni but it doesn't change the fact the Yankees will be paying a huge tax and likely with a 50% penalty because it will be over the threshold for more than 3 years.

In effect, those 5 contracts will cost 50% over their value, to the club.

I would love to see Otahni as a Yankee. I don't think it's realistic I don't see Hal signing off on that.

Can the Yankees afford it? Hell yes. They can easily afford it. I just think Hal's bottom line is as tight as his bottom.

[johnnyi]

Luxury tax rates in baseball.

30% on the amount over $230 million but less than $250 million;
42% rate on the amount over $250 million but less than $270 million;
75% rate on the amount over $270 million but less than $290 million;
90% on the amount above $290 million.

If the Yankees pay $179 million for those 5 players and $150 million to $200 million for the other 21 players on their roster, then we are talking about a payroll of $330 million to $380 million. Then by my calculations using the luxury tax rates above , there's another $67.4 million to $112.5 million. So we would be paying between $400 million to $500 million on MLB players' salaries and penalties, prior to paying our minor leagues, scouting and other organizational costs. Then, don't forget that we want our Japanese import in 2 years for $200 million and early extensions on players like Dom, Volpe and Peraza and possibly other prize free agents.

So many people are saying that the Yankees print money and they make something like $600 million per year and they shouldn't have a budget, but everyone has one, even Elon Musk.

I manage money for a small company every day of the week and while other companies are failing left and right, it has been in business more than 40 years. We examine every piece of equipment that we buy, lease or rent to determine whether it makes economic sense. We examine the payroll cost of every employee we hire, including benefits. We examine every job that we bid down to the tiniest cost. We negotiate everything and we walk away when the perceived value is less than the cost. The Yankees and other organizations do this 100 times over, whether fans like it or not.

[Webslinger]

Ohtani might be the most valuable player in baseball. His contribution as a potential cy young and mvp could be invaluable. The only way he doesn't win an mvp every year is if someone hits 62 home runs. With that said I wouldn't give him 60 million, that's just silly.

[PJO34]

Ohtani is a difference maker. He may not get 60m per year, but he's worth it. If every owner had to put all their players into a bucket and choose teams again, the first player chosen would be Ohtani.

Sure, he pitches on a six day schedule and he DHs more than he plays the outfield, but who cares? The team that signs him will be doing it for the playoffs, not the regular season. That team, probably the Dodgers, will easily get to the playoffs Ohtani or not, but will use him in game one and then will have him pitch on short rest like the Japanese team did.

If I were Hal, I will pay whatever I had to to sign him (assuming he could be laured to the east coast).

If we had Ohtani the last five years, we would probably have won at least two World Series titles.

Imagine...in 2024

DJ 3rd
Judge RF
Ohtani DH
Stanton LF
Rizzoli 1st
Volpe 2nd
Dom CF
Trevino C
Peraza SS

As a playoff lineup.

[johnny ny]

Ohtani is a difference maker. He may not get 60m per year, but he's worth it. If every owner had to put all their players into a bucket and choose teams again, the first player chosen would be Ohtani.

Sure, he pitches on a six day schedule and he DHs more than he plays the outfield, but who cares? The team that signs him will be doing it for the playoffs, not the regular season. That team, probably the Dodgers, will easily get to the playoffs Ohtani or not, but will use him in game one and then will have him pitch on short rest like the Japanese team did.

If I were Hal, I will pay whatever I had to to sign him (assuming he could be laured to the east coast).

If we had Ohtani the last five years, we would probably have won at least two World Series titles.

Imagine...in 2024

DJ 3rd
Judge RF
Ohtani DH
Stanton LF
Rizzoli 1st
Volpe 2nd
Dom CF
Trevino C
Peraza SS

As a playoff lineup.

he is not worth it to shatter a team payroll and put them in a higher tax unless you are steve cohen worth over 16 billion.. no team is going to pay that extreme price for ohtani..

[johnny ny]

Ohtani is a difference maker. He may not get 60m per year, but he's worth it. If every owner had to put all their players into a bucket and choose teams again, the first player chosen would be Ohtani.

Sure, he pitches on a six day schedule and he DHs more than he plays the outfield, but who cares? The team that signs him will be doing it for the playoffs, not the regular season. That team, probably the Dodgers, will easily get to the playoffs Ohtani or not, but will use him in game one and then will have him pitch on short rest like the Japanese team did.

If I were Hal, I will pay whatever I had to to sign him (assuming he could be laured to the east coast).

If we had Ohtani the last five years, we would probably have won at least two World Series titles.

Imagine...in 2024

DJ 3rd
Judge RF
Ohtani DH
Stanton LF
Rizzoli 1st
Volpe 2nd
Dom CF
Trevino C
Peraza SS

As a playoff lineup.

have the angels even made the playoffs with ohtani?

[johnny ny]

If Otahni and his role is a chore, I certainly don't want him.

I understand your points but I don't see anyone "running him down". If me saying that I don't think he's the best player in the game is running him down, that leaves an extremely wide berth for, what is considered, running him down.

I have seen posters say no thank you but that was because of the suggestion of 50-60 mil
No one suggested, he isn't a fantastic player.

I also think some may be looking from a perspective of the tax threshold and what they think is realistic.
Yes, they have a bunch of money off the books next year.

But if you sign him, it will be a 10 year deal. Let's say 50 per.

Cole 36 per through 2028
Rodon 27 per through 2028
Stanton (average it out with the Marlins donation-) 26 per through 2027
Judge 40 per through 2031

If you add Otahni?

That's 179 per for 5 players, for 4 years.

I agree with whoever posted about the potential revenue brought in by Otahni but it doesn't change the fact the Yankees will be paying a huge tax and likely with a 50% penalty because it will be over the threshold for more than 3 years.

In effect, those 5 contracts will cost 50% over their value, to the club.

I would love to see Otahni as a Yankee. I don't think it's realistic I don't see Hal signing off on that.

Can the Yankees afford it? Hell yes. They can easily afford it. I just think Hal's bottom line is as tight as his bottom.

if steve cohen wants ohtani next year ohtani will be a ny met..