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View Poll Results: White Sox Over/Under of 83.5 Wins, what say you?

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  • Over

    2 66.67%
  • Under

    1 33.33%
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  1. #1
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    Official Offseaon Thread for your 2023 Chicago White Sox

    What will the White Sox organization do following this underperforming season?

    Does LaRussa stay in his job?

    Does Hahn stick around and grow stale in his post?

    Do the White Sox stand pat and blame injuries for their underperforming roster and leadership?

    Does Reinny continue to be in charge of all matters?

    I've crossed out this team for 2022. I don't care a bit about what happens to this team and manager going forward. There is no magic switch for this team whatsoever. If they win going forward, it will be luck as far as I am concerned.

    So, what do you guys think is needed to turn this team around in 2023?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bird of Prey View Post
    What will the White Sox organization do following this underperforming season?

    Does LaRussa stay in his job?

    Does Hahn stick around and grow stale in his post?

    Do the White Sox stand pat and blame injuries for their underperforming roster and leadership?

    Does Reinny continue to be in charge of all matters?

    I've crossed out this team for 2022. I don't care a bit about what happens to this team and manager going forward. There is no magic switch for this team whatsoever. If they win going forward, it will be luck as far as I am concerned.

    So, what do you guys think is needed to turn this team around in 2023?
    Season isnít over yet. Obviously we are underperforming. Until we are eliminated from making the playoffs, itís a bit premature. We will have plenty of time to discuss the off-season when the time comes.

    As for Tony, thereís zero chance heís back if we donít make it to the ALCS.

    For Hahn, they might give him more time with a different manager, but itíll probably be up to him if he wants to stay. Being that heís the one that constructed this roster of never ending DHís, I donít think teams will be trying to steal him.

    Whatís needed to turn this team around? Hitters that understand situational hitting. An upgrade at 2B. Either Colas or a veteran lefty bat who can field to play RF. Giolito needs to be way better. Our system has potential future replacements at SS, 2B, 3B. We can use a Lefty Starter. We need to DFA and eat Grandals cost and get a good defensive catcher who can at least have a pulse hitting. Bullpen should be deep AF next year.

    Iíd think long and hard about when the right time to trade Anderson is. We have his heir apparent about a year and a half away. We can replenish our system trading Anderson.

    Giolito is probably a hold since his trade value is at an all time low, and he is young enough to figure it out.

    Moncada isnít worth trading either. His defense is elite, so if we can get the right bats in the lineup and push him to the bottom of the order, not really worth dumping him.

  3. #3
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    I thought about a post like this as well, but agree ... it's a little early.
    TLR absolutely has to go when the season is over, end of story.
    Put some money in a 2B, promote Colas and bring in a LHP please, Rodon or whoever.
    Grandal has to go, everyone can see that.
    I also would like to see Abreu brought back, but I wonder what the hell he is thinking.
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muttman73 View Post
    I thought about a post like this as well, but agree ... it's a little early.
    TLR absolutely has to go when the season is over, end of story.
    Put some money in a 2B, promote Colas and bring in a LHP please, Rodon or whoever.
    Grandal has to go, everyone can see that.
    I also would like to see Abreu brought back, but I wonder what the hell he is thinking.
    Abreu loves the White Sox. White Sox love their 1Bís. He will be back. His defense is still miles better than Sheets or Vaughn. Other then the DPs, heís still one of our best hitters.

  5. #5
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    1B

    White Sox are set at 1B for a while. Abreu will likely get a 1 year 2nd year player option or 2 year 3rd year player option deal. Behind him we have Vaughn and Sheets long term, and further down the line Wilfred Veras who's 19 years old.

    2B

    We have a bunch of young options in the system. Romy, Sosa, Yolbert, Rodriguez. If we don't think Romy/Sosa/Yolbert are true starters in the majors next year, you go out and sign someone. Only FA I really see worth holding the young guys back is Adam Frazier. If you look at SS's that could move to 2nd, there is Andrus and Iglesias. I think the guy that ends up the long term high upside guy is Loidel Chapelli Jr.

    SS

    Anderson is a star SS locked in til 2025. Behind him is our top prospect Colson Montgomery and all the young 2B I listed above. Say we do a semi rebuild/retool next year if we don't make the playoffs this year, then I would absolutely explore trading him this offseason. It's when his value will be it's highest ever. You can argue bringing back a guy like Andrus short term, trading Anderson to the NL for a big prospect package, and grooming Montgomery to be our Full Time SS in 2024.

    3B

    Moncada's bat is a huge disappointment, but his glove has been elite lately. He's locked in til 2026, with minimal trade value so he will be our 3B in 2023. Behind him you have Montgomery is he shifts over to 3rd, or Bryan Ramos who is still pretty young but has some solid upside. Then there is Wes Kath behind him.

    C

    Grandal is shot as a Catcher. We would probably be better off eating his contract next year rather then wasting that DH spot on him. Zavala isn't really the future IMO. No one else in our system really screams starting Catcher either. I'd probably go after Contreras this winter. Hackenburg is probably our highest upside guy in the minors right now. I don't know much about Perez, but we will probably find out soon.

    OF

    Robert is here a while. Whether he sticks in CF or not we shall see. Eloy is also here a while, but I'd think about trading him this offseason if he finishes strong. He's more of a DH to me, but I'm happy to have Vaughn as the primary DH until Abreus starts slipping defensively. Sheets as a backup Lefthanded DH/RF/1B is plenty of depth. If we can get good value for Eloy, I'd do it in a heartbeat. Only way I change my mind is if we move on from Abreu, move Vaughn to 1B, and Eloy to DH where I think he can be a star. As long as he's our LF'er, I'm not happy. Between trading Eloy and Tim, you can get 6+ solid prospects including a couple high upside guys. If we do trade them, that signals a semi rebuild/retool so more trades will come. Colas starts the year in the Majors next year. I'd have him up in September this year if it was up to me. We can use Pollock 1 more year to feel out the OF, and hopefully Cespedes progresses by next year and can maybe join the OF.

    SP

    Resign Cueto, 1 year 2nd year player option. Cease/Cueto/Lynn/Gio/Kopech is our rotation to start 2023. Gio doesn't have the trade value so you keep him and hope that he performs in a contract season. If we aren't competing for a playoff spot at the deadline, but he's pitching well, he now has legit trade value again. I'd look to move him and maybe even Cueto if it can get us more prospects. While we are at it, lets move Lynn as well. He's not a part of the future. Again if we aren't a legit playoff contender, we might as well build the **** out of our system. From there you move Davis Martin into the rotation and maybe a guy like Stiever if he's healthy. Now you are in a Full Rebuild and not Retool. We can probably stretch out Lambert to be a starter in 2024 in this scenario.

    RP

    Hendriks/Graveman/Bummer/Diekman/Kelly/Crochet/Lopez/Lambert is our 8. If we get to the point where it is a legit rebuild, you move Hendriks who will bring us some good talent back. You can move Graveman while we are at it. Move Lopez to closer. We will be stretching out Crochet how we did Kopech in 2021, get him ready to be a full time starter in 2024. Then your rotation looks like Cease/Kopech/Crochet/Lambert/Martin. I'd try to get Vera up in our BP in 2023 if we are emptying the tank, and use him in long relief to stretch him too. By 2024 he could be in a Kopech/Crochet bullpen role or he could be in the rotation.

    If we miss the playoffs this year or exit in round 1 or 2, Tony won't be back next year. It would take a competitive ALCS or WS appearance to save his job. He is gone by 2023 no matter what either way.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muttman73 View Post
    I thought about a post like this as well, but agree ... it's a little early.
    TLR absolutely has to go when the season is over, end of story.
    Put some money in a 2B, promote Colas and bring in a LHP please, Rodon or whoever.
    Grandal has to go, everyone can see that.
    I also would like to see Abreu brought back, but I wonder what the hell he is thinking.
    The core of this team offensively is rotten. Whoever the GM is I think has to blow this 40 man roster up. I don't care a rip about who says and goes right now, even Abreu. But they need to put everyone on the team up for trade purposes. The guys who absolutely have to go are Moncada, Grandal, Engel, Pollock, AND Garcia. Of the pitchers, Ruiz, Kelly and Giolitto need to be jettisoned. Of the following; Robert, Jimenez, Sheets, Abreu and Vaughn, pick three and trade two. Burger AND Colas fill two starting positions. Anderson stays and if agreeable think about moving him to enter field where there is less wear and tear on him.

    They need, then to trade for a starting two way 2nd baseman, a starting catcher, and a left handed hitting right fielder.

    I **** can the entire coaching staff and hire a young fire brand as their manager. Let him bring in his own pitching coach but I would strongly recommend retaining Katz.

    I also would totally **** can the entire conditioning staff and while at it take a look at what teh hell they are using in their minor league system. I have never seen so many out of baseball shape young men as phycially unfit as these clowns are. When a 37 year old man (Abreu) outrun guys he is 10-15 years older than and another old guy in Cueto, able to throw 7-9 inning games at will and field his position well, these young a-holes ought to be ashamed of themselves.

    This team has needed a frequent diet of *** chewing and embarrassment if necessary for a long time. LaRussa is and has been a fraud for a long time. Enough.

  7. #7
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    I was curious about how Moncada measured up to all of the other 3rd basemen in baseball and he is worse than even I thought he is. Moncada was in the lowest 10 percent in virtually every hitting category among all major league 3rd baseman. in contrast, Burger was in the top 3rd in the same hitting categories and higher in the extra basehits,Slugging, and OPS categories.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bird of Prey View Post
    I was curious about how Moncada measured up to all of the other 3rd basemen in baseball and he is worse than even I thought he is. Moncada was in the lowest 10 percent in virtually every hitting category among all major league 3rd baseman. in contrast, Burger was in the top 3rd in the same hitting categories and higher in the extra basehits,Slugging, and OPS categories.
    It's been a down year but he still somehow has a 0.5 WAR.

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  9. #9
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    This team has a lot of talent. Unfortunately they have a lot of guys that are 1B/DH types.
    The coaching and conditioning staff all need to be replaced. I like Boston and Katz, but the bozo at 3B and the hitting coach are useless. I won't waste any more words on TLR.
    I'd trade Giolito and look to move Burger and Sheets. I like both of those guys but there simply is no room for them. Cueto should be brought back and a LH starter is a must.
    Last edited by Muttman73; 08-25-2022 at 01:31 PM.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by blams View Post
    It's been a down year but he still somehow has a 0.5 WAR.

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    Yeah, WAR includes defensive consideration, in my opinion it weighs it too heavily but that is for stat mavens to argue. All I know is the Moncada is a wasted out and isn't fixable hitting left handed. He needs to go down to the minor leagues and see if he can be returned as a right handed hitting 2nd baseman because he is standing in the way of a potentially good major league 3rd bagger in Burger.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bird of Prey View Post
    Yeah, WAR includes defensive consideration, in my opinion it weighs it too heavily but that is for stat mavens to argue. All I know is the Moncada is a wasted out and isn't fixable hitting left handed. He needs to go down to the minor leagues and see if he can be returned as a right handed hitting 2nd baseman because he is standing in the way of a potentially good major league 3rd bagger in Burger.
    Heís saved 4 close games in the last week and a half on defense alone. Last night with the bases loaded he made a great play on a ball up the line and gunned the guy at 1st saving 1-2 runs at least. Last week he did this multiple times on shots between 3rd and SS. Burgers defense cost us 2 games in a 3 game span before he got hurt. I get hating Moncadas bat, I do too, but you put way to little emphasis on defense.

  12. #12
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    On a team with a bunch of poor defenders, they can live with Moncada.
    I don't know why he forgot how to hit a baseball, but he can still catch and throw one.
    I'm not sure how long his current contract is, but at this rate - he can walk away when it's over.
    Until then, until the kid in Birmingham or whoever else shows up - it's his job.
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muttman73 View Post
    This team has a lot of talent. Unfortunately they have a lot of guys that are 1B/DH types.
    The coaching and conditioning staff all need to be replaced. I like Boston and Katz, but the bozo at 3B and the hitting coach are useless. I won't waste any more words on TLR.
    I'd trade Giolito and look to move Burger and Sheets. I like both of those guys but their simply is no room for them. Cueto should be brought back and a LH starter is a must.
    Sheets is showing real progress in becoming a legit left handed power hitter. He has got his BA over .250 despite being hampered by LaRussa's stupid line-up fetishes. Right now, next to Abreu, I'd take him over anyone else on the team to put the bat on the ball in RBI situations against a right handed pitcher.

    As for Burger, he was considered the best hitting prospect in the entire draft when the Sox got him and they have got to give him a good chance which under LaRussa he hasn't. It would be one thing if they had even an average starting 3rd baseman but they don't. Moncada is a terrible hitter, especially left handed. .190 hitters in baseball are not starters. The Sox have two of them in Moncada and Grandal. The fact that whoever puts the White Sox roster together for this team actually penciled in Moncada, Grandal, and Garcia into their starting line-up should have been fired a long time ago.

  14. #14
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    I like Burger, he has shown - in limited appearances - that he can hit. He has also shown that his defense leaves something to be desired. IF the Sox did not have 4 DH's on the roster I'd love to see him there. I also suggested a few months ago that he MIGHT be a candidate to switch over to 1B. Even then, Vaughn is better, and he isn't going anywhere. I like Gavin Sheets a lot, but (see above) there is nowhere to play him. Oscar Colas is the future in RF.
    On a team with shaky D all-over, Burger and Sheets best role for the White Sox is trade bait. There is nothing I'd love to see more that those two plus Giolito flipped to Pittsburgh, Arizona or maybe the Cubs for some young talent. Will it happen???
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  15. #15
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    Like it or not, the 2023 lineup "is most likely" going to look like this:
    LF - Eloy
    CF - Robert
    RF - Colas
    3B - Moncada
    SS - TA
    2B - GET A 2B!
    1B - Abreu
    C - Seby (HELP NEEDED)
    DH - Vaughn

    OF - Pollock
    INF - Leury
    OF - Engle
    C - HELP
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