To win the last game you have to have a star who can play up to the big game

[valade16]

Missing the point twice in the space of a few minutes. Next post couls get you a new personal record.

Why did you feel the need to talk about Lebron here?I certainly didn't bring him up.
Heck, I even let the argument that he's the only one with a losing record slide

What do you mean let it slide. As if you were ever gonna argue against its context

I didn’t miss your point. Nobody did. Bron sucks without star teammates. That about sums it up.


But please, tell me which players you were referring to in your response to me

[NYKalltheway]

I was referring to the guys you only use stats to talk about, ignoring the context of those stats.

And no, I don't say that Lebron sucks. That's just your biased processing because if someone doesn't rate a player as you like or as you're bombarded by the media, immediately they're a hater.
I was called that 10 years ago when it came to Kobe GOAT or top 5 considerations. I still don't view Kobe as a top 5 player and he's marginally a top 10 player depending on parameters used. And I rate Kobe ahead of Lebron. So, boo hoo?

Maybe if you weren't as triggered whenever you saw my posts and genuinely put an effort to read them you wouldn't feel this way. Same applies to a few others. But there's a group of members that's incapable of that since they're Lebron fans since forever and were calling him GOAT since 2011. Don't be part of that group, if beneath you.

[valade16]

I was referring to the guys you only use stats to talk about, ignoring the context of those stats.

And no, I don't say that Lebron sucks. That's just your biased processing because if someone doesn't rate a player as you like or as you're bombarded by the media, immediately they're a hater.
I was called that 10 years ago when it came to Kobe GOAT or top 5 considerations. I still don't view Kobe as a top 5 player and he's marginally a top 10 player depending on parameters used. And I rate Kobe ahead of Lebron. So, boo hoo?

Maybe if you weren't as triggered whenever you saw my posts and genuinely put an effort to read them you wouldn't feel this way. Same applies to a few others. But there's a group of members that's incapable of that since they're Lebron fans since forever and were calling him GOAT since 2011. Don't be part of that group, if beneath you.

Then you weren’t referring to me. To be clear: I have never said LeBron is the GOAT. Very few have. You just have to pretend like that’s what everyone is saying so you can rationalize your views because saying “you’re just one of those LeBron fans who thinks he’s better than Dominque Wilkins” sounds objectively ridiculous.

If you were arguing LeBron isn’t the GOAT you’d have a leg to stand on and be thought a reasonable poster. But that isn’t what you’re arguing. You are arguing Bron isn’t close to top 10, likely isn’t top 20, and is below Nique. That’s why virtually everyone here thinks you’re a joke or a troll.

[NYKalltheway]

Erm, no?

I said if I were basing on talent and skill alone then Lebron wouldn't rank highly.

But since it's an all time ranking and career, longevity and accolades play a role, he's definitely a top 10 consideration. But I have 15-20 top 10 considerations and I'm struggling to put Lebron ahead of 10 of those, so he's outside my top 10. Whether he's 11-14-16-20 or whatever, is another story.
The 10 guys I have ahead of him:
Michael Jordan
Larry Bird
Magic Johnson
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Hakeem Olajuwon
Bill Russell
Shaquille O'Neal
Tim Duncan
Jerry West
Wilt Chamberlain


Then there's Moses Malone, Julius Erving, Oscar Robertson, Kobe Bryant, Charles Barkley, Karl Malone and Elgin Baylor with a legitimate argument as much as Lebron has. And Steph Curry is getting there, too. And a few others, excluding your favorite go-to argument, Dominique Wilkins.

The only reason people rate Lebron highly is due to the prisoner of the moment fallacy. And the propaganda surrounding Lebron. I've never seen Duncan being debated as the GOAT yet he's had more reason than Lebron during his prime. I've seen Kobe leapfrog ahead of Duncan and Shaq mostly because he was "the new Jordan".

You wanna argue Lebron is #2, argue all you want. But at least do it right. Until then, I'll have a lot to object about that viewpoint. Wanna argue him #8, be my guest. I'm still finding it tough to call him the 3rd best SF behind Bird, Dr J and Baylor. He's probably made the cut, but barely.
Why? Because I value peak, talent, hustle, innovation, skill and the "it" factor a lot more than vague stats and lack of fundamentals that just get by as a result of weaker rules. Because that's what a product of Lebron's decorated numbers are. And his rings aren't as valuable as you(plural) wanna make them.


If you only look at the skillset and assume you can get 10 year's of prime from a player, you wouldn't draft Lebron ahead of Bird or Dr J. No serious GM would. You only say this now because you know Lebron played 20 seasons whether the others played 10 and 15 respectively. Hindsight, not skillset, gets you to make that call. Give the other guys equal medical conditions and it's not even a discussion... At least between Bron and Bird. With Dr J there can be a claim but there's still a gap.

[More-Than-Most]

I was referring to the guys you only use stats to talk about, ignoring the context of those stats.

And no, I don't say that Lebron sucks. That's just your biased processing because if someone doesn't rate a player as you like or as you're bombarded by the media, immediately they're a hater.
I was called that 10 years ago when it came to Kobe GOAT or top 5 considerations. I still don't view Kobe as a top 5 player and he's marginally a top 10 player depending on parameters used. And I rate Kobe ahead of Lebron. So, boo hoo?

Maybe if you weren't as triggered whenever you saw my posts and genuinely put an effort to read them you wouldn't feel this way. Same applies to a few others. But there's a group of members that's incapable of that since they're Lebron fans since forever and were calling him GOAT since 2011. Don't be part of that group, if beneath you.

why do you people argue with someone so out of touch and so ignorant when it comes to statistics all to help his bias of old players? This dude just openly admitted lebron isnt a top 10 player ever LMFAO. This is his basketball knowledge lol

[More-Than-Most]

Erm, no?

I said if I were basing on talent and skill alone then Lebron wouldn't rank highly.

But since it's an all time ranking and career, longevity and accolades play a role, he's definitely a top 10 consideration. But I have 15-20 top 10 considerations and I'm struggling to put Lebron ahead of 10 of those, so he's outside my top 10. Whether he's 11-14-16-20 or whatever, is another story.
The 10 guys I have ahead of him:
Michael Jordan
Larry Bird
Magic Johnson
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Hakeem Olajuwon
Bill Russell
Shaquille O'Neal
Tim Duncan
Jerry West
Wilt Chamberlain


Then there's Moses Malone, Julius Erving, Oscar Robertson, Kobe Bryant, Charles Barkley, Karl Malone and Elgin Baylor with a legitimate argument as much as Lebron has. And Steph Curry is getting there, too. And a few others, excluding your favorite go-to argument, Dominique Wilkins.

The only reason people rate Lebron highly is due to the prisoner of the moment fallacy. And the propaganda surrounding Lebron. I've never seen Duncan being debated as the GOAT yet he's had more reason than Lebron during his prime. I've seen Kobe leapfrog ahead of Duncan and Shaq mostly because he was "the new Jordan".

You wanna argue Lebron is #2, argue all you want. But at least do it right. Until then, I'll have a lot to object about that viewpoint. Wanna argue him #8, be my guest. I'm still finding it tough to call him the 3rd best SF behind Bird, Dr J and Baylor. He's probably made the cut, but barely.
Why? Because I value peak, talent, hustle, innovation, skill and the "it" factor a lot more than vague stats and lack of fundamentals that just get by as a result of weaker rules. Because that's what a product of Lebron's decorated numbers are. And his rings aren't as valuable as you(plural) wanna make them.


If you only look at the skillset and assume you can get 10 year's of prime from a player, you wouldn't draft Lebron ahead of Bird or Dr J. No serious GM would. You only say this now because you know Lebron played 20 seasons whether the others played 10 and 15 respectively. Hindsight, not skillset, gets you to make that call. Give the other guys equal medical conditions and it's not even a discussion... At least between Bron and Bird. With Dr J there can be a claim but there's still a gap.

what did lebron do to you? He cant hurt you anymore

[KnicksorBust]

I definitely think Tatum can be that guy.

[Scoots]

If I were basing on talent and skill alone then Lebron wouldn't rank highly.

Someone has to use this as a sig.

[Scoots]

what did lebron do to you? He cant hurt you anymore

LeBron is a better troll.

[Hawkeye15]

LeBron right? He's the only one with a losing record when playing that last game.

Would love to see what LeBron's numbers are in elimination games. I imagine they are excellent. But, you can't control who you have on your team (even when you think you can).

To put it into perspective, of the 10 finals he made, if you replaced LeBron with a replacement level player, does that team even sniff round 2, let alone the playoffs? Like if we removed MJ from the Bulls, do they make the playoffs? Oh wait, we know they do and win a round without him..

Context...

[Hawkeye15]

What do you mean let it slide. As if you were ever gonna argue against its context

I didn’t miss your point. Nobody did. Bron sucks without star teammates. That about sums it up.


But please, tell me which players you were referring to in your response to me

Not sure there is any player with more wins with less help than LeBron though. Ever. Not from a star perspective. I get he is 4-6 in the finals, but when we starting drilling into why, 5 of those losses are totally justified, and he negates it with his Cleveland win.

These all timers with multiple chips, how many times were they not favored, or complete underdogs? Not often, I can promise you. Like has Steph Curry won a ring without being the heavy favorite? We know he lost one. Or two actually. We know both Bird/Magic lost series as very heavy favorites before they even sniffed the finals.

[valade16]

Someone has to use this as a sig.

He legitimately doesn’t get that this belief is the problem, not some clarification that makes it better.

[ewing]

hes also the goat that puts up the goat numbers in those final games

when basketball becomes 1v1 that is when rings will matter

Winning doesn’t matter but individual stats do. Got ya


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[valade16]

LeBron right? He's the only one with a losing record when playing that last game.

What do you mean by last game? LeBron is 6-2 in Playoff Game 7’s. He is 2-0 in Finals game 7’s.

[NYKalltheway]

What do you mean by last game? LeBron is 6-2 in Playoff Game 7’s. He is 2-0 in Finals game 7’s.

Last game of the season ≠ Finals Game 7