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  1. #241
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    Jun 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by KobeOwnSU View Post
    I had to [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23] lunch is on me in the future


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Well, it was kind of on me......blech... LOL

    "...prone to stoogery.".

  2. #242
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
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    South Dakota
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfe-Raider View Post
    Yeah, 'cause it is always a great idea to dig up something that was said in the past instead of enjoying success. Let's pick on those who supported He Who Shall Not Be Named. That'll be fun...or maybe we can find something better to do, something better to say or something novel about how this team is turning the corner FINALLY.
    I'm safe, I wasn't here back then!!!!

  3. #243
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    Apr 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfe-Raider View Post
    Dang it Kobe, you know what you just did...you know!

    I just had lunch....it was good going down.....

    You must come up with a detailed course of penance. If it is any way too light I will be forced to issue one myself or maybe Eric can do it.
    Look at the bright side, you were able to enjoy it twice!!!!!

    That's right, I'm a glass half full guy.

  4. #244
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    Apr 2008
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    The Bay Area, CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by krsonekth View Post
    Look at the bright side, you were able to enjoy it twice!!!!!
    Or like my uncle used to say, if you're the type that likes a good bowel movement, three times!

  5. #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by RaiderLakersA's View Post
    Or like my uncle used to say, if you're the type that likes a good bowel movement, three times!

  6. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by krsonekth View Post
    Look at the bright side, you were able to enjoy it twice!!!!!

    That's right, I'm a glass half full guy.
    Your positive vibes are infectious.

    "...prone to stoogery.".

  7. #247
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Inland Empire
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    88
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfe-Raider View Post
    Your positive vibes are infectious.
    Don’t worry, they’re working on a vaccine for that. 😮

  8. #248
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
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    2,260
    Quote Originally Posted by mmbt View Post
    The '16 defense was pretty lousy, but with one difference-making DPOY level player. This year's defense has far fewer weaknesses to attack, and while there's no Mack we also aren't sitting around waiting for one guy to save our butts on D, multiple guys have stepped up at various times.

    The offense ... well certainly the OL was better back then. Pass catchers have been a big upgrade ... Amari was explosive but inconsistent, Crabs was consistent but had limitations. I much prefer Waller and the 3 young WRs.

    We have better RB talent this year, but had better run blocking then.

    DC was really good that year, but at that point he was still susceptible to more brain cramps and WTF throws than he is now. And he's become much more confident at throwing it downfield than ever before ... he's pretty much the best deep passer in the league this season.
    You can look at different metrics for the defense. Yards/game and points allowed/game is the general metric. However, yards per play many believe is a stronger indicator of overall defensive performance -- albeit I see Expected Points Contributed by All Defense as a more holistic measure but I digress.

    If you look at points allowed: the 2016 Raider defense ranked 20th, the 2020 defense ranked 30, and the 2021 defense ranks 22nd so far (per www.pro-football-reference.com/). You may say that the 2016 defense was better just by this metric.

    Now let's look into yards per offensive play. Raider 2016 defense allowed 6.1 y/p, (31st). The 2020 defense allowed 6.0 y/p (26th). Through 7 games the 2021 defense is allowing 5.2 y/p (5th). For a comparison, the most recent "elite" defense is the 2015-16 Broncos that allowed 4.4 y/p (1st). The Broncos did not have the lowest points allowed that season.

    To highlight your point, the 2016 Raiders defense was overall, subpar to bad. There was a reason why Mack won DPOY. However, that is a bad model build your defense on.

    The 2021 Raiders defense is arguably the best defense they have had in almost 2 decades. A competent defense is something that many of us have been wanting for a long time.



    "..And then the Raiders drafted the Knight in Shining Armor Prince Quarterback. Then they went on to win the Super Bowl. All the women in the kingdom cheered and they lived happily ever after...""

  9. #249
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    Sep 2012
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    I'm not a big fan of stats. There are usually missing angles to what is presented. Throwing that aside, anyone who has watched the games over the last few years, one can see that this year the pass rush is there, very few missed tackles, turnovers are better. Points allowed, especially over the last two games kind of skews the numbers, simply because they went conservative.

  10. #250
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    Quote Originally Posted by bulldog2683 View Post
    To highlight your point, the 2016 Raiders defense was overall, subpar to bad. There was a reason why Mack won DPOY. However, that is a bad model build your defense on.
    Your analysis goes a bit off the rails here. The DPOY criteria isn't limited to a player's performance relative to his team, but rather the comparative performance of all defensive players around the league. The argument can always be made that if the Raiders had better players around Mack, he still wins DPOY, because then the other team can't afford to commit 2-3 guys to slow him, or game plan away from him as much.

  11. #251
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    Oct 2013
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    548
    Quote Originally Posted by RaiderLakersA's View Post
    Your analysis goes a bit off the rails here. The DPOY criteria isn't limited to a player's performance relative to his team, but rather the comparative performance of all defensive players around the league. The argument can always be made that if the Raiders had better players around Mack, he still wins DPOY, because then the other team can't afford to commit 2-3 guys to slow him, or game plan away from him as much.
    Mack would have stood out on any team that year. But there's no doubt that without him the 16 defense would not have been appreciably different than last year's epic pile of suckage. But it is unusual for a DPOY to come from such a terrible D, which speaks to how great he was.

    This year the D isn't perfect, but it makes plays. The tackling is as reliable as i can remember it being in years, the pass rush is good, and we aren't having blown coverages several times a quarter.

  12. #252
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    Jan 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by RaiderLakersA's View Post
    Your analysis goes a bit off the rails here. The DPOY criteria isn't limited to a player's performance relative to his team, but rather the comparative performance of all defensive players around the league. The argument can always be made that if the Raiders had better players around Mack, he still wins DPOY, because then the other team can't afford to commit 2-3 guys to slow him, or game plan away from him as much.
    Think you misinterpreted. I was agreeing with the original statement of "The '16 defense was pretty lousy, but with one difference-making DPOY level player." As in yes, there is a reason why Mack won DPOY because he was a difference maker. So not sure how that is off the rails.



    "..And then the Raiders drafted the Knight in Shining Armor Prince Quarterback. Then they went on to win the Super Bowl. All the women in the kingdom cheered and they lived happily ever after...""

  13. #253
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    Jan 2007
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    2,260
    Quote Originally Posted by dbacknick View Post
    I'm not a big fan of stats. There are usually missing angles to what is presented. Throwing that aside, anyone who has watched the games over the last few years, one can see that this year the pass rush is there, very few missed tackles, turnovers are better. Points allowed, especially over the last two games kind of skews the numbers, simply because they went conservative.
    Of course. They should always be taken in context, with a holistic approach, and clear methodology. I am not a fan of the beat writers that post random stats that do not really mean much. @JoshDubowAP is notorious for this.



    "..And then the Raiders drafted the Knight in Shining Armor Prince Quarterback. Then they went on to win the Super Bowl. All the women in the kingdom cheered and they lived happily ever after...""

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