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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zmaster52 View Post
    I thought Brodie sucked?

    Doesn’t change that Alderson was the one to promote Bryn.
    He does suck, but Brodie did promote. Try to keep up.

    Do you think the scouting in this franchise has been its achilles heel? It's the only thing that is keeping this franchise afloat.

    Again, Cronyism has to do with giving someone a position they aren't qualified for.


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  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zmaster52 View Post
    The whole reason Beane is being suggested is because of his familiarity with Alderson, not because of his qualifications….IMO at least.

    Beane IS qualified but I don’t think that matters much. Might not be the best example of cronyism.

    Hiring Bryn Alderson is however, cronyism.


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    Unfortunately, that's pretty typical of professional sports. You hire people you know. That's why it's hard for anyone to break into the ranks of coaching, or especially the front office. It's fair to say "cronyism" in that sense, but at least in Beane's case he's a damn good baseball man. Whether that would even matter to Alderson is a separate question, but definitely one worth asking since winning in Oakland and winning in New York are two entirely different propositions.

    It's a meme among us Bills fans that every FA signing or coaching hire has to have some kind of ties to the Carolina Panthers, since our coach and GM came from there. Maybe players aren't the best example of it, but it speaks to how much familiarity, perhaps rather than fraternity, drives these signings/hirings.

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeGamer81 View Post
    Unfortunately, that's pretty typical of professional sports. You hire people you know. That's why it's hard for anyone to break into the ranks of coaching, or especially the front office. It's fair to say "cronyism" in that sense, but at least in Beane's case he's a damn good baseball man. Whether that would even matter to Alderson is a separate question, but definitely one worth asking since winning in Oakland and winning in New York are two entirely different propositions.

    It's a meme among us Bills fans that every FA signing or coaching hire has to have some kind of ties to the Carolina Panthers, since our coach and GM came from there. Maybe players aren't the best example of it, but it speaks to how much familiarity, perhaps rather than fraternity, drives these signings/hirings.
    You seem to get what I’m saying.

    Beane is absolutely qualified but like you said, sports is about hiring your friends and people you know more so than it is about making more connections.

    I was just saying that the next POBO will likely have to fit that certain criteria of being familiar with Alderson, mainly because it would be easier to vet. Not to mention, being well respected, having a good background in scouting x player development, and having a history of success…all qualities that Beane possesses.

    Cronyism doesn’t take into account qualifications or know how. That being said, being ushered to the front of the line and being given more consideration than others candidates regardless of baseball acumen, is a form of cronyism.

    Beane has been uber successful in Oakland but who knows if he can retain that success here, or if he’s become too complacent and hasn’t evolved as an executive, which is a fair criticism. Especially considering the A’s have good regular season success, but have lacked in the postseason. Epstein and Brian Cashman also fit this bill IMO. Not saying they can’t change with a change of scenery but, it’s not like they’ve invented anything so groundbreaking.

    The Mets missed out on Bloom and Friedman years ago so it’s likely that they’ll want to right that ship in some regard…with the A’s and Rays being considered similar clubs in how they’re built and run. Beane would be a good guy to fix that and immediately gain respect. Would he leave Oakland and stop his bidding for Liverpool/get out of that deal which would technically make him a Red Sox affiliate? He’s got a lot going on so who knows what he would want to do. Still, Beane coming aboard would immediately instill respect…but we said that with Sandy coming back, right?

    Not too many guys available right now. I would definitely prioritize Stearns, with somebody like Antonetti/Chernoff behind him. Then Beane, then Epstein. It’d be nice to snag two new names from different organizations…ideally, we hire Stearns as POBO and he hires somebody like Billy Owens/Bobby Heck as GM. I think the more successful minds from different analytically savvy organizations, the better.

    Went a bit off on a tangent there but going to what you said about it being a meme, I’m constantly bashing Sandy and co similarly to that meme. I was happy to have Sandy back and would still like him here with some kind of role but, he’s too old and disconnected. We were all saying how it was going to be such a big culture change, and how getting rid of the Wilpons would rid this team of ****** people.

    And in some capacity, that happened. Mets fired the guy who tried to fight minor leaguers, and other people guilty of sexual harassment or other ********. Still, the vetting process was awful and it absolutely showed when Porter was hired, then the scrutiny behind Bauer harassing women online, and then all the on field stuff, too. So it wasn’t the Wilpons that were 100% the problem, everybody on the Mets hire ups has a hand in this, so we shouldn’t act as if they’re perfect. I don’t really care now, it’s mostly just a meme. I actually understand cronyism in this case because well, Porter and Scott presumably didn’t have any relationship with Sandy and look how that turned out. There might just be an overall hesitancy to having either people you don’t know, or people who aren’t well known around the league.


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  4. #79
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    In all works of business, managers; directors & executives hire people they used to work with because they know they can do a great job. There is no cronyism involved, they are looking for the most competent people to fill out their team.


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  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zmaster52 View Post
    You seem to get what I’m saying.

    Beane is absolutely qualified but like you said, sports is about hiring your friends and people you know more so than it is about making more connections.

    I was just saying that the next POBO will likely have to fit that certain criteria of being familiar with Alderson, mainly because it would be easier to vet. Not to mention, being well respected, having a good background in scouting x player development, and having a history of success…all qualities that Beane possesses.

    Cronyism doesn’t take into account qualifications or know how. That being said, being ushered to the front of the line and being given more consideration than others candidates regardless of baseball acumen, is a form of cronyism.

    Beane has been uber successful in Oakland but who knows if he can retain that success here, or if he’s become too complacent and hasn’t evolved as an executive, which is a fair criticism. Especially considering the A’s have good regular season success, but have lacked in the postseason. Epstein and Brian Cashman also fit this bill IMO. Not saying they can’t change with a change of scenery but, it’s not like they’ve invented anything so groundbreaking.

    The Mets missed out on Bloom and Friedman years ago so it’s likely that they’ll want to right that ship in some regard…with the A’s and Rays being considered similar clubs in how they’re built and run. Beane would be a good guy to fix that and immediately gain respect. Would he leave Oakland and stop his bidding for Liverpool/get out of that deal which would technically make him a Red Sox affiliate? He’s got a lot going on so who knows what he would want to do. Still, Beane coming aboard would immediately instill respect…but we said that with Sandy coming back, right?

    Not too many guys available right now. I would definitely prioritize Stearns, with somebody like Antonetti/Chernoff behind him. Then Beane, then Epstein. It’d be nice to snag two new names from different organizations…ideally, we hire Stearns as POBO and he hires somebody like Billy Owens/Bobby Heck as GM. I think the more successful minds from different analytically savvy organizations, the better.

    Went a bit off on a tangent there but going to what you said about it being a meme, I’m constantly bashing Sandy and co similarly to that meme. I was happy to have Sandy back and would still like him here with some kind of role but, he’s too old and disconnected. We were all saying how it was going to be such a big culture change, and how getting rid of the Wilpons would rid this team of ****** people.

    And in some capacity, that happened. Mets fired the guy who tried to fight minor leaguers, and other people guilty of sexual harassment or other ********. Still, the vetting process was awful and it absolutely showed when Porter was hired, then the scrutiny behind Bauer harassing women online, and then all the on field stuff, too. So it wasn’t the Wilpons that were 100% the problem, everybody on the Mets hire ups has a hand in this, so we shouldn’t act as if they’re perfect. I don’t really care now, it’s mostly just a meme. I actually understand cronyism in this case because well, Porter and Scott presumably didn’t have any relationship with Sandy and look how that turned out. There might just be an overall hesitancy to having either people you don’t know, or people who aren’t well known around the league.


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    It's not cronyism as it is more so nepotism. That said, Beane is as much accomplished as Alderson is and has a longer track record of producing consistently good results. Yes, familiarity helps but its easy to hire Beane on his own merits. That prior relationship just gives Alderson and Cohen a better idea of what Beane's philosophy is. That's what presumably gives him the inside track.

    I don't know what the Mets do but if Beane passed, it wouldn't break my heart. I'm not overly interested in Alderson's input in baseball matters anyway so perhaps hiring someone else allows for him to take a much lesser role.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by iceman49 View Post
    what has beane ever won?

    no thanks
    He's only kept a low payroll team competitive every year with many playoff appearances. Yea, no big deal. Why would we want to see what he could do when he actually has money to spend.

    Your takes are among the worst I've ever seen on any message board in the history of the world.

  7. #82
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    Megill is starting to remind me of Gsellman a couple of years back. Had a decent stretch until the league figured him out. Might be better in the bullpen honestly.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    Megill is starting to remind me of Gsellman a couple of years back. Had a decent stretch until the league figured him out. Might be better in the bullpen honestly.
    Funny, I was thinking the same thing, albeit more with Lugo.


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  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    Megill is starting to remind me of Gsellman a couple of years back. Had a decent stretch until the league figured him out. Might be better in the bullpen honestly.
    Yeah kind off.

    I am willing to let him fight for the 5th spot next year, maybe the fact that he has pitched more than he has ever could be a reason why he has been bad as well.

    But him and Walker have just been allowing an insane amount of homers.


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  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sick Of It All View Post
    Yeah kind off.

    I am willing to let him fight for the 5th spot next year, maybe the fact that he has pitched more than he has ever could be a reason why he has been bad as well.

    But him and Walker have just been allowing an insane amount of homers.


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    Idk where the homers thing comes from. Mets pitchers need to attack the top of the zone and spin the ball better/work on control. Idk.

    Problem with the rotation is that it’s all 5th starter guys, after deGrom. I’m fine with Carrasco, Megill, Peterson, and Walker as 4/5 starters…but the Mets really need a good 2/3 if they wanna get anywhere


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  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zmaster52 View Post
    Idk where the homers thing comes from. Mets pitchers need to attack the top of the zone and spin the ball better/work on control. Idk.

    Problem with the rotation is that it’s all 5th starter guys, after deGrom. I’m fine with Carrasco, Megill, Peterson, and Walker as 4/5 starters…but the Mets really need a good 2/3 if they wanna get anywhere


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    Well they have a really good number 3 in Stroman and hopefully Carrasco pitches better next year, but I’ll have him as a 4.

    The question is how do they get a number 2? Just can’t go to the toilet and pop one out.

    Also if Syndergaard stays he will be limited to innings next year, so dude will pitch like 150 at most.


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  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sick Of It All View Post
    Well they have a really good number 3 in Stroman and hopefully Carrasco pitches better next year, but I’ll have him as a 4.

    The question is how do they get a number 2? Just can’t go to the toilet and pop one out.

    Also if Syndergaard stays he will be limited to innings next year, so dude will pitch like 150 at most.


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    With the exception of Scherzer , who is not coming to the Mets , there is no number 2 out there to be had . No team is going to trade a pitcher who could be a number 2 starter.

    Wheeler would have been a perfect number 2

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brooklyndave View Post
    With the exception of Scherzer , who is not coming to the Mets , there is no number 2 out there to be had . No team is going to trade a pitcher who could be a number 2 starter.

    Wheeler would have been a perfect number 2
    I don't think it is as bad as many portray. When things look the worst, many think the worst. But IMO, I see better things for the rotation next year, barring injuries. Degrom is the Ace. You have Stroman, who I think is the #2 or it could be Syndergaard, innings notwithstanding. I believe Carrasco is much better than what he has shown this year, chalk it up to injury. So there you have 1, 2, and 3, with Tijuan as the #4.

    Then again, maybe the Mets don't sign stroman. Still, Syndergaard would be #2, Carrasco 3, and Tijuan 4. It would be nice to have a lefty in the rotation, maybe Peterson comes back. Luchesi is gone for a while, so that doesn't work. McGill obviously starts next year in the minors. Rich Hill, whom I like, might be re-signed by the Mets, but I would rather see him as a long man in the BP.

    Of course, the Mets still have to score runs.

    I wonder if a lot of this has to do with the psychology of the team and its manager. Maybe we need a manager who pushes the players more. Again, we also did hear from the DWI GM that the players, in his opinion, were not following practices, such as healing from injuries and so forth, and probably more, like not following the advise of coaches, etc., perhaps.

    I don't know where that comes from and how that started, but maybe it has something to do with the new players this, specifically Lindor. I'm not down on Lindor, I'm speculating. Lindor being, at least perception wise, an allstar player, management may have given him more rope than they should have. And maybe the raccoon incident and the firing of Chili Davis are symptomatic of that, who knows. I think we need a take charge manager and a take charge GM going forward. This team seems to be dead at this point.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sick Of It All View Post
    Well they have a really good number 3 in Stroman and hopefully Carrasco pitches better next year, but I’ll have him as a 4.

    The question is how do they get a number 2? Just can’t go to the toilet and pop one out.

    Also if Syndergaard stays he will be limited to innings next year, so dude will pitch like 150 at most.


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    Depends if they re-sign Stroman. Which I think happens.

    Even if they do, they need one more arm behind him. Greinke, Scherzer, or Verlander could be perfect. Had on a short term but high AAV deal. Greinke in particular, I’d like to see. (Verlander’s my favorite but still coming off TJ)


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  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    It's not cronyism as it is more so nepotism.
    No, it's cronyism. They get used interchangeably sometimes, but nepotism generally refers to the hiring or privileging of relatives, whereas cronyism means doing so for friends and associates.

    To Z's point, I'm not sure hiring Beane makes vetting easier for Alderson. They haven't worked together in years, and after this last fiasco Alderson and the Mets are going to have to completely revamp their process. Actually, I kind of hoped Alderson would be let go as well just for that reason - and also because he sucks, but his poor hiring alone should have been enough to get the boot. So maybe the benefit of this mess is that Alderson won't just assume anyone's a safer pick because he knows them. Maybe this will broaden the search...especially if the new process uncovers some less-than-savory things about his pals.

    I just don't want to get too excited about the hire. I know what will disappoint me, but I don't think anyone is a sure bet to turn the franchise around. Alderson is a snake, as far as I'm concerned, and Cohen is a complete wild card. Just on a baseball level, I'm sure the people we've talked about are smart and skilled enough to get the job done, but adding in those factors, like Alderson's inability to hire the one position he was brought in to hire (which makes you wonder if he wasn't angling for it the whole time) and Cohen's idiotic tweets (which presumably speak to him being an annoyance in the front office, as well) I will have to wait and see before I get my hopes up.

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