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  1. #1081
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    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    I'm still not following. The vaccine has shown to be overwhelmingly effective and safe to the 4 billion people its been given to. Where you're getting your information from is incorrect.
    You are telling people to take a vaccine that has not been approved by the FDA, for a disease where we don't know where the hell it came from and you're surprised that people are little hesitant? That's my point.

  2. #1082
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    Quote Originally Posted by nessythegreat View Post
    You are telling people to take a vaccine that has not been approved by the FDA, for a disease where we don't know where the hell it came from and you're surprised that people are little hesitant? That's my point.
    It has been approved under emergency circumstances and will be fully approved by the FDA in January (as is being reported). Where the virua comes from has no bearing on how well the vaccine works against it. We know its out there. We know the effects of the virus and how many people its killed. We also know we have a vaccine that has been given to billions of people with little side effects and that it overwhelmingly protects against the more serious symptoms of the virus.

    What else do you need to know? This isn't a hesitation thing on any end besides people's ignorance or their choice to put personal freedoms in front of their health and the health of others.
    Last edited by metswon69; 07-21-2021 at 07:58 PM.

  3. #1083
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    Quote Originally Posted by nessythegreat View Post
    You are telling people to take a vaccine that has not been approved by the FDA, for a disease where we don't know where the hell it came from and you're surprised that people are little hesitant? That's my point.
    We had the genome for the original flavor coronavirus sequenced in like April of last year. Knowing whether it came from a pangolin in a wet market or some bat droppings at a seafood market or leaked out of a lab doesn't change our observed knowledge of the virus and how it works. This is a massive red herring.
    Last edited by natepro; 07-21-2021 at 06:54 PM.

  4. #1084
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    Quote Originally Posted by natepro View Post
    We had the genome for the original flavor coronavirus sequenced in like April of last year. Knowing whether or came from a pangolin in a wet market or some bat droppings at a seafood market or leaked out of a lab doesn't change our observed knowledge of the virus and how it works. This is a massive red herring.
    Actually, knowing where the hell it came from is incredibly important in stopping future pandemics, especially if our taxes are going to the funding of the lab it leaked from. But even if it's zoonotic it's still important to know how this happened.

  5. #1085
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    Quote Originally Posted by ciaban2.0 View Post
    Actually, knowing where the hell it came from is incredibly important in stopping future pandemics, especially if our taxes are going to the funding of the lab it leaked from. But even if it's zoonotic it's still important to know how this happened.
    I was pretty clearly not talking about stopping future pandemics.

  6. #1086
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    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    It has been approved under emergency circumstances and will be fully approved by the FDA in January (as is being reported). Where the vaccine comes from has no bearing on how well the vaccine works against it. We know its out there. We know the effects of the virus and how many people its killed. We also know we have a vaccine that has been given to billions of people with little side effects and overwhelmingly protects against the more serious symptoms of the virus.

    What else do you need to know? This isn't a hesitation thing on any end besides people's ignorance or their choice to put personal freedoms in front of their health and the health of others.
    Have Billions been vaccinated? Also, are you including those faulty *** Chinese vaccines that have at best like a 50% rate of success, or are you only counting like J&J AZ etc?

  7. #1087
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    Quote Originally Posted by ciaban2.0 View Post
    Have Billions been vaccinated? Also, are you including those faulty *** Chinese vaccines that have at best like a 50% rate of success, or are you only counting like J&J AZ etc?
    Worldwide, yes, 3.73 billion shots have been given.

  8. #1088
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    Quote Originally Posted by natepro View Post
    Worldwide, yes, 3.73 billion shots have been given.
    Is that all vaxes or just the western ones that work well?

  9. #1089
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    Quote Originally Posted by ciaban2.0 View Post
    Is that all vaxes or just the western ones that work well?
    Looks like it is whatever vaccine that country has available to it.

    Tracking Coronavirus Vaccinations Around the World https://nyti.ms/2Yqfz92

  10. #1090
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...es-ccdh-report

    Look at the people there and see that several of them identify as democrats (including RFK Jr).

    I don't think the political party matters. I think we are generally failing to communicate about the vaccine across groups.

    Some of them are doing it for notoriety, and some are doing it to scam people, and some, I'm sure, think they are helping save people. But they are not all republicans by any stretch.

    Minorities make up the largest group of unvaccinated, and minorities generally vote Dem. It's not a partisan issue at all.
    Gopher beat me to reposting my earlier post. But what you’re saying is not true.

    More unvaccinated identify as Republican than Democrat (49% to 29%) and white people are the majority (49% to 14% black and 19% Hispanic). Those numbers become even more pronounced among the “definitely will not take the vaccine crowd”, where it is 67% Republican (to 12% Democrat) and 70% white (to 5% black and 11% white).

    You are right in that there is a left wing anti-vaccine contingent, but it’s always been relatively small National speaking. If it were only left wing anti-vaxxers we’d have hit out vaccination targets a long tome ago. It is the influx of Trumpers and conservative anti-vaxxers that are driving the shortage.

    This is further illustrated in the fact there is a strong correlation between conservative states and counties and lower vaccine rates than liberal states and counties.

    But I understand your need to both sides everything.

  11. #1091
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Gopher beat me to reposting my earlier post. But what you’re saying is not true.

    More unvaccinated identify as Republican than Democrat (49% to 29%) and white people are the majority (49% to 14% black and 19% Hispanic). Those numbers become even more pronounced among the “definitely will not take the vaccine crowd”, where it is 67% Republican (to 12% Democrat) and 70% white (to 5% black and 11% white).

    You are right in that there is a left wing anti-vaccine contingent, but it’s always been relatively small National speaking. If it were only left wing anti-vaxxers we’d have hit out vaccination targets a long tome ago. It is the influx of Trumpers and conservative anti-vaxxers that are driving the shortage.

    This is further illustrated in the fact there is a strong correlation between conservative states and counties and lower vaccine rates than liberal states and counties.

    But I understand your need to both sides everything.
    Okay, certainly plenty of idiots to go around.

    Still it's a poll, and republicans love to be proudly stupid in polls.

  12. #1092
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    Okay, certainly plenty of idiots to go around.

    Still it's a poll, and republicans love to be proudly stupid in polls.
    Well it’s not just a poll. To what do you attribute the strong correlation between conservative areas and lower vaccination rates?

  13. #1093
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    Quote Originally Posted by ciaban2.0 View Post
    Actually, knowing where the hell it came from is incredibly important in stopping future pandemics, especially if our taxes are going to the funding of the lab it leaked from. But even if it's zoonotic it's still important to know how this happened.
    Agree from a future prevention perspective, but it is a straw man if not a red herring when it comes to the efficacy of the mRNA vaccines.

  14. #1094
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Gopher beat me to reposting my earlier post. But what you’re saying is not true.

    More unvaccinated identify as Republican than Democrat (49% to 29%) and white people are the majority (49% to 14% black and 19% Hispanic). Those numbers become even more pronounced among the “definitely will not take the vaccine crowd”, where it is 67% Republican (to 12% Democrat) and 70% white (to 5% black and 11% white).

    You are right in that there is a left wing anti-vaccine contingent, but it’s always been relatively small National speaking. If it were only left wing anti-vaxxers we’d have hit out vaccination targets a long tome ago. It is the influx of Trumpers and conservative anti-vaxxers that are driving the shortage.

    This is further illustrated in the fact there is a strong correlation between conservative states and counties and lower vaccine rates than liberal states and counties.

    But I understand your need to both sides everything.
    Just because there are 2 sides to an argument doesn't mean they are both equally weighted or valid. The anti climate change side is devoid of any scientific foundation and is purely wrapped in economic interests. By definition there are two sides of the flat earth argument also. One is actually wrong and one is demonstrably proven to be correct. The flat earthers, anti science, anti-vaxxers are one big overlapping venn diagram

  15. #1095
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Well it’s not just a poll. To what do you attribute the strong correlation between conservative areas and lower vaccination rates?
    Partisanship its known Biden REALLY wants to hit certain targets (he wanted to hit 70% by July 4th) and all someone has to do for him to fail is nothing. Its the easiest thing in the world that probably explains why so many of the Republicans who are unvaxxed are under 30.
    If your young Covid and healthy covid is SIGNIFIGANTLY less dangerous, so if I can "trigger" Biden by doing litterally nothing then why not?
    If Trump were still pres you'd see lots of dems unvaccinated for the same reason.

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