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  1. #256
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nunuu View Post
    Well it is pretty much his last chance at being a legit starting QB, its not like he has any other choice.
    As far as choice, he could be the insufferable egostistical me first guy that psd faithful has defined him to be.

    Instead he literally proves otherwise but instead of “hey, good for him, maybe it’s not as it appeared” it’s the opposite.

  2. #257
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    Quote Originally Posted by BDawk4Prez View Post
    As far as choice, he could be the insufferable egostistical me first guy that psd faithful has defined him to be.

    Instead he literally proves otherwise but instead of “hey, good for him, maybe it’s not as it appeared” it’s the opposite.
    I thought it was some of his teammates , coaches and Philly media that defined him .

  3. #258
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    Quote Originally Posted by surf and turf View Post
    I thought it was some of his teammates , coaches and Philly media that defined him .
    Anonymous players and media.

  4. #259
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    Carson Wentz: The QBs, QB

    Quote Originally Posted by QB_Eagles View Post
    He got benched and traded. Not sure how much self-reflection is needed after that to conclude you gotta change some things.
    Sure it’s a kick in the face but it’s not uncommon for people to stay the same way thinking they aren’t the problem in similar situations.

    You’d think a pretty selfish egotistical QB like PSD thinks Carson is would be one of those that refuses to change…

    And to add, According to reports the Eagles wanted to keep him so it was more so writing on the wall. It’s not like they bench and traded him solely because he sucked.
    Last edited by koldjerky; 06-16-2021 at 10:49 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack of Blades View Post
    I don't consider Brand New indie. I consider them ****ing awesome and don't belong to a genre.

  5. #260
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    Quote Originally Posted by koldjerky View Post
    You’d think a pretty selfish egotistical QB like PSD thinks Carson is would be one of those that refuses to change…
    Why? That makes no sense.

    If he refuses to change that would be worse for his ego, because then he'd again be a Bottom 5 NFL starting QB.

    I expect him to be better btw, because not changing is not an option.

    Quote Originally Posted by BDawk4Prez View Post
    Too late, QBEagles has already done his best to **** on that as well.
    **** on that? Acknowledge reality rather.

    What about Wentz outright stating the issues that he had, which I spent half a year arguing with you that he had? No comment on that?

  6. #261
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB_Eagles View Post
    Why? That makes no sense.

    If he refuses to change that would be worse for his ego, because then he'd again be a Bottom 5 NFL starting QB.

    I expect him to be better btw, because not changing is not an option.


    **** on that? Acknowledge reality rather.

    What about Wentz outright stating the issues that he had, which I spent half a year arguing with you that he had? No comment on that?
    Please show me where I argued against the criticism.

    I said repeatedly he had issues, he also wasn’t solely to blame. Both are true.

  7. #262
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB_Eagles View Post
    Why? That makes no sense.

    If he refuses to change that would be worse for his ego, because then he'd again be a Bottom 5 NFL starting QB.

    I expect him to be better btw, because not changing is not an option.


    **** on that? Acknowledge reality rather.

    What about Wentz outright stating the issues that he had, which I spent half a year arguing with you that he had? No comment on that?
    He was an mvp candidate doing it his way as well. Why would he change if he was having success then?

    This is about him getting better, like all qbs. It was a bad season for many reasons.

  8. #263
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    Schrödinger's Wentz! He was bad but he's also a MVP.

  9. #264
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB_Eagles View Post
    Schrödinger's Wentz! He was bad but he's also a MVP.
    He was an mvp candidate and had a bad 1/2 of a season.

    Oh no!!!!!! The book is written!

  10. #265
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB_Eagles View Post
    Why? That makes no sense.

    If he refuses to change that would be worse for his ego, because then he'd again be a Bottom 5 NFL starting QB.

    I expect him to be better btw, because not changing is not an option.


    **** on that? Acknowledge reality rather.

    What about Wentz outright stating the issues that he had, which I spent half a year arguing with you that he had? No comment on that?
    Because he thinks he’s not the problem? Quite a few said he was arrogant and played hero ball trying to be the best player because he’s arrogant and egotistical. I don’t think it’d be easy for an arrogant or egotistical person to admit they’re the problem.

    What you’re doing now is saying that you believe Wentz knew he was always knew he was a problem so admitting it is more so ‘about time’ than it is any sort of revelation.

    Now if he keeps being the same QB than he obviously can’t get better either because he’s incapable talent/brain wise or he truly didn’t believe he was a problem and sticking to it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack of Blades View Post
    I don't consider Brand New indie. I consider them ****ing awesome and don't belong to a genre.

  11. #266
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    Quote Originally Posted by BDawk4Prez View Post
    He was an mvp candidate and had a bad 1/2 of a season.

    Oh no!!!!!! The book is written!
    Well, he was a MVP candidate 4 years ago before he suffered a series of injuries and defenses got accustomed to his habits but let's ignore that and assume he's still the same guy, why exactly was there this huge difference in performance according to you?

    If he was just bad, then yeah that's Schrödinger's Wentz when we apparently never know which version is going to play until he plays. If it's because his supporting cast was bad then that isn't really a MVP candidate, because typically a proper MVP level player isn't dependent on his surrounding players to a degree that they outright determine his performance, nor can a rookie QB replace him and perform at the same level.

    Quote Originally Posted by koldjerky View Post
    Because he thinks he’s not the problem? Quite a few said he was arrogant and played hero ball trying to be the best player because he’s arrogant and egotistical. I don’t think it’d be easy for an arrogant or egotistical person to admit they’re the problem.

    What you’re doing now is saying that you believe Wentz knew he was always knew he was a problem so admitting it is more so ‘about time’ than it is any sort of revelation.

    Now if he keeps being the same QB than he obviously can’t get better either because he’s incapable talent/brain wise or he truly didn’t believe he was a problem and sticking to it.
    No, what I'm saying is that getting benched and traded probably did most of the legwork on that revelation.
    Last edited by QB_Eagles; 06-17-2021 at 03:48 PM.

  12. #267
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB_Eagles View Post
    Well, he was a MVP candidate 4 years ago before he suffered a series of injuries and defenses got accustomed to his habits but let's ignore that and assume he's still the same guy, why exactly was there this huge difference in performance according to you?

    If he was just bad, then yeah that's Schrödinger's Wentz when we apparently never know which version is going to play until he plays. If it's because his supporting cast was bad then that isn't really a MVP candidate, because typically a proper MVP level player isn't dependent on his surrounding players to a degree that they outright determine his performance, nor can a rookie QB replace him and perform at the same level.


    No, what I'm saying is that getting benched and traded probably did most of the legwork on that revelation.
    Who said he's still the same guy? I don't have time to retype for the thousandth time all the things that went in to this last season being a train wreck. Simple version, he was bad, but far from being the sole reason for it.

    Show me an MVP that didn't have a good supporting cast. Are we to now only think that Brady and Mahomes are only MVPs on their own merit?

    We should also stop pretending that Wentz and Hurts played in equal situations. But again, no time for that again.

  13. #268
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    Quote Originally Posted by BDawk4Prez View Post
    Who said he's still the same guy? I don't have time to retype for the thousandth time all the things that went in to this last season being a train wreck. Simple version, he was bad, but far from being the sole reason for it.
    I'm aware you've gone over many times a list of reasons why the Eagles were bad, but I don't think I've ever seen you give specific issues Wentz has had that made him play bad.

    Wentz says he needs to: "Throw to the open guy. First and second down, find a completion and move on." But just a couple of pages ago in this very thread when I said he takes unnecessary risks on 1st down, you thought that was unfair criticism. During the season the argument was that Doug's offense and our WRs are so bad that nobody ever gets open, but now Wentz himself acknowledges he needs to just take the easy completions.

    Quote Originally Posted by BDawk4Prez View Post
    Show me an MVP that didn't have a good supporting cast. Are we to now only think that Brady and Mahomes are only MVPs on their own merit?
    I didn't say that MVPs don't usually have good supporting casts. What I said is that a MVP's performance usually isn't solely determined by his supporting cast. Sometimes there are MVPs with subpar supporting casts, too, like Cam Newton in 2015.

    Quote Originally Posted by BDawk4Prez View Post
    We should also stop pretending that Wentz and Hurts played in equal situations. But again, no time for that again.
    I think you're the one pretending their situations were qualitatively different.

    Last time we discussed this I even quoted you ESPN and PFF links about how OL performance over the last 4 weeks was worse than the first 12 weeks.
    Last edited by QB_Eagles; 06-17-2021 at 04:50 PM.

  14. #269
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB_Eagles View Post
    I'm aware you've gone over many times a list of reasons why the Eagles were bad, but I don't think I've ever seen you give specific issues Wentz has had that made him play bad.

    Wentz says he needs to: "Throw to the open guy. First and second down, find a completion and move on." But just a couple of pages ago in this very thread when I said he takes unnecessary risks on 1st down, you thought that was unfair criticism. During the season the argument was that Doug's offense and our WRs are so bad that nobody ever gets open, but now Wentz himself acknowledges he needs to just take the easy completions.


    I didn't say that MVPs don't usually have good supporting casts. What I said is that a MVP's performance usually isn't solely determined by his supporting cast. Sometimes there are MVPs with subpar supporting casts, too, like Cam Newton in 2015.


    I think you're the one pretending their situations were qualitatively different.

    Last time we discussed this I even quoted you ESPN and PFF links about how OL performance over the last 4 weeks was worse than the first 12 weeks.
    Again, it's there, go find it, I'm not interested in doing it again for the 8758234758924357 time. Nobody said not throwing to the open guy was unfair criticism. I said it was unfair to say his two injuries were his fault.

    You quoted the exception, good job, figured you would. Now, go find another outside of Cam.

    Now OL is the only piece to an offense?

  15. #270
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB_Eagles View Post
    Well, he was a MVP candidate 4 years ago before he suffered a series of injuries and defenses got accustomed to his habits but let's ignore that and assume he's still the same guy, why exactly was there this huge difference in performance according to you?

    If he was just bad, then yeah that's Schrödinger's Wentz when we apparently never know which version is going to play until he plays. If it's because his supporting cast was bad then that isn't really a MVP candidate, because typically a proper MVP level player isn't dependent on his surrounding players to a degree that they outright determine his performance, nor can a rookie QB replace him and perform at the same level.


    No, what I'm saying is that getting benched and traded probably did most of the legwork on that revelation.
    He still had to make that decision to admit it. Now he needs to work on it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack of Blades View Post
    I don't consider Brand New indie. I consider them ****ing awesome and don't belong to a genre.

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