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  1. #151
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
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    8,591
    Quote Originally Posted by steagles View Post
    atkinson: 5'8"
    konecny: 5'10"
    giroux: 5'11"
    farabee: 6'0"
    NAK: 5'11"
    frost: 5'11"
    lindblom: 6'1"


    i have...concerns.
    It's a different era

  2. #152
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
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    8,591
    I like the Kolosov pick. Easily the best goalie prospect left after you get through Cossa and Wallstedt. At least Chuck is making solid picks with the picks he hasn't thrown away.

    Carolina is absolutely cleaning up btw.

    Ottawa...is not cleaning up. I have no idea what they are doing lol!

  3. #153
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    3,515
    It's a different era
    i know. and i get it, which is why i'm not railing against this.


    but teams that are built like this have to be more than the sum of their parts, or else they get run over in the playoffs. i think you have to be a strong organization to pull that off, and we are very clearly not a strong organization.

    and stylistically, if we do get to the playoffs, we're in the same division as the islanders and the capitals, and those teams play like bulldozers. those are terrible matchups for this roster.

  4. #154
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
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    8,505
    This is how I would roll if I was AV

    JVR Couturier TK
    Farabee Hayes Cam
    Frost G Allison
    Lindblom Laughton NAK
    Cates brothers

    Provorov Ellis
    Sanheim Risto
    York Braun

    Hart

  5. #155
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    Jul 2008
    Posts
    8,505
    I hope Noah Cates decides to sign with us after he does his last year in school. I think he has middle 6 potential. Jackson might be a good 4th line C too.

  6. #156
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    4,321
    I really like the Voracek trade. Atkinson has a ton of speed and skill around the net...He always has feel like a Briere-esque kind of player. I think he's the kind of guy that has been missing from the roster. He is 32 though, but at the same time he hasn't really slowed down a ton. He could be one of those guys that can play through the mid 30s because he's been able to avoid contact pretty well. Briere also put up some decent numbers in his age 32, 33, and 34 seasons (age 32 season 26G/27A, age 33 season 34G/34A, age 34 season 16G/33A and had some injuries that year). If we get that production out of Cam, we won this trade big. Also Cam is available in all situations...PP, PK, and is great even strength. Jake was streaky and could be really frustrating sometimes at ES. I love this trade. I feel as though this trade not only opened cap space, but improved our top 6-9 forwards by a reasonable margin.

  7. #157
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    4,321
    Quote Originally Posted by castan_b View Post
    This is how I would roll if I was AV

    JVR Couturier TK
    Farabee Hayes Cam
    Frost G Allison
    Lindblom Laughton NAK
    Cates brothers

    Provorov Ellis
    Sanheim Risto
    York Braun

    Hart
    Hopefully Lindblom returns to top 6 form..It's somewhat a reasonable hope as well. He should have his energy back...we kind of saw him start to flash his old form toward the end of the season last year. I wouldn't sleep on Allison and Frost making big strides this year as well...We're probably not finished making moves. I could definitely see a move for JVR taking place now. Jake was the more difficult of the two to move.

  8. #158
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    1,871
    Farabee Couts TK
    G Hayes Cam
    JVR Laughton/Frost Lindblom
    Allison Laughton/Frost NAK

    Provy Ellis
    Sanheim Risto
    York/Zamula Braun

  9. #159
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    8,505
    Quote Originally Posted by LLMunchie619 View Post
    Hopefully Lindblom returns to top 6 form..It's somewhat a reasonable hope as well. He should have his energy back...we kind of saw him start to flash his old form toward the end of the season last year. I wouldn't sleep on Allison and Frost making big strides this year as well...We're probably not finished making moves. I could definitely see a move for JVR taking place now. Jake was the more difficult of the two to move.
    If we clear JVRís deal and donít even get anything back, Iíll call this off-season a promising change with one really bad trade.

  10. #160
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    4,843
    So four moves in to the off-season.


    1. Ellis trade.
    Have to give this an A. Top 5or10 RH dman in the league for what felt like peanuts.

    2. Ghost trade.
    Whew, this was an expensive cap dump. This move gets graded based on what's done with the extra money.

    3. Risolainen
    For a 1+2? Really? This is the best 2nd pair dman those assets could get? This is possibly more value than Nolan and myers. Or at least somewhat close. I don't like the player. He's a marginally better RHd. Hagg. Ok wait. The trades bad. The top four looks solid. So does the third pair. The defense is set. I'm content. This trade in a vacuum is trash. The end lineup is much improved. Feel like there was a better option. Maybe not. Idk. I grade this a D in totality.

    4. Jake for Cam.
    Is cam the fastest player in the team? Players are very similar in effectiveness. Less AAV. Solid move. More versatile. Another RH forward. Could help for different PP looks. Solid. Grade it a B.

    Gotta give Fletcher an incomplete. Still need a 1b goalie and ideally another middle six c.

  11. #161
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    4,321
    It seems like Fletcher is getting rid of guys who don't seem to fit in the current system or under AV's system. At one point or another we have seen each of the guys traded demoted or benched. Jake was sat for extending periods during some games, Patrick was constantly struggling, Myers got benched a few times, and Hagg was in and out of the lineup. That is why I believe JVR is next. He has been a guy that obviously has not been able to find much chemistry at Even Strength. I also firmly believe that JVR has value in this league. His cap hit is only for two years at 7M AAV (12M actual value overall) for a top PP performer and a player capable of playing anywhere in the top 6-9.

    My question is, which team or teams will be going after him? It seems like the trade will happen, more than likely before the 28th when FA starts...we shall see though...

  12. #162
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    58,744
    Quote Originally Posted by LLMunchie619 View Post
    It seems like Fletcher is getting rid of guys who don't seem to fit in the current system or under AV's system. At one point or another we have seen each of the guys traded demoted or benched. Jake was sat for extending periods during some games, Patrick was constantly struggling, Myers got benched a few times, and Hagg was in and out of the lineup. That is why I believe JVR is next. He has been a guy that obviously has not been able to find much chemistry at Even Strength. I also firmly believe that JVR has value in this league. His cap hit is only for two years at 7M AAV (12M actual value overall) for a top PP performer and a player capable of playing anywhere in the top 6-9.

    My question is, which team or teams will be going after him? It seems like the trade will happen, more than likely before the 28th when FA starts...we shall see though...
    I think you're over valuing what JVR is to the rest of the league. While I think he's a fine player, a $7m cap hit is significant and teams don't have tons of space. FA is about to start. Other players like JVR are also available (decent forwards on big hits). But JVR is more of a PP specialist than he is anything, and his 5v5 numbers don't inspire most years. He probably gets a 2/$10m on the market so he's coming in with significant negative value on the contract to a league who's been trying to move money.

    Do I think it's an impossible move? No. But I doubt any team is coming for him. They may swap bad contracts, but that's kind of...it. The Flyers shouldn't be looking to do another Voracek/Atkinson deal however where they simply spread spread hit out. Just be done with him in 2 years instead of adding on. The Flyers aren't in a cap friendly position where another $1.5-2m saved will get them another impact piece.

    I think the Flyers moved Voracek because he asked to be moved (it's been reported he did). I think they moved Ghost because someone would take him. And I think they moved Myers because Nashville wanted a young defenseman back. Frankly, no one really "fit the system" last year. Just about everyone was bad. I think that's more coincidence than anything. I think a lot of this offseason is shuffling paper around and hoping a new arrangement is the fix. You have a GM attempting to change things without the cap space to really change a ton without shifting things. So if JVR is traded it'll be for another bad contract. I'd just rather keep the bad contracts we have before we just acquire a team of guys in their mid 30s signed to $5.5m deals through age 35.

    Sent from my SM-G981V using Tapatalk

  13. #163
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    Jul 2008
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    8,505
    Atkinson is only 1 more year than Voracekís role, and Iím hoping there is one more compliance buy-out coming because of the flat cap Ö

    You got to hope Ellis stays healthy for 3 years. We are still missing a true goal scorer.

  14. #164
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    Jul 2008
    Posts
    8,505
    Quote Originally Posted by txravis12 View Post
    So four moves in to the off-season.


    1. Ellis trade.
    Have to give this an A. Top 5or10 RH dman in the league for what felt like peanuts.

    2. Ghost trade.
    Whew, this was an expensive cap dump. This move gets graded based on what's done with the extra money.

    3. Risolainen
    For a 1+2? Really? This is the best 2nd pair dman those assets could get? This is possibly more value than Nolan and myers. Or at least somewhat close. I don't like the player. He's a marginally better RHd. Hagg. Ok wait. The trades bad. The top four looks solid. So does the third pair. The defense is set. I'm content. This trade in a vacuum is trash. The end lineup is much improved. Feel like there was a better option. Maybe not. Idk. I grade this a D in totality.

    4. Jake for Cam.
    Is cam the fastest player in the team? Players are very similar in effectiveness. Less AAV. Solid move. More versatile. Another RH forward. Could help for different PP looks. Solid. Grade it a B.

    Gotta give Fletcher an incomplete. Still need a 1b goalie and ideally another middle six c.
    Agree with all points here

    Also, I was a big Risto guy during his draft year. He was arguably the best player for Finland in his draft year and world juniors.

    Was he the issue or did he over extend and was asked to be Superman because Buffalo sucked? That is fletchers gamble.

    40+ points per season and a righty is good stuff. Not thrilled about his penalties, or that he doesnít track his man well in the DZ while at Buffalo. But who knows. Buffalo could have been the issue. We will see.

    I hope we donít resign him until the end of the season. Couturier is far more important.
    Last edited by castan_b; 07-25-2021 at 09:23 AM.

  15. #165
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Posts
    393
    I was on board with 2 of the three moves Fletcher made in the past 2 weeks.

    Ellis - that move was a slam dunk....you parted ways with 2 guys that have regressed the last two years....Patrick never seemed that interested on the ice....and Myers had a decent/good year in 2019....but then 2020 and 21 looked average...

    Atkinson - you save money and you get a guy who has that "shoot first" mindset....plus speed and good penalty killer....I can't find fault with it because you moved a guy that seemed to have stayed in Philly maybe a year or two too long...

    Ristolainen - this one still bugs me a bit....If, and that's a big IF in my mind, he's able to turn it around in a new system AND Fletcher can get him to stay for a couple more years....I'll be ok with this move....If he becomes just a rental for a 1st & 2nd round pick....I hope Fletcher is gone....it'll be a boneheaded move on his part....I applaud him for taking a gamble, but he may have overplayed his hand on this deal....

    I hope he has one more shooter in mind for this team....I still think they need just one more.

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