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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by krsonekth View Post
    I disagree about this part, I think the drafting of a second safety was more about pushing ABRAMS more than anything else.
    Head exploding again.

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by krsonekth View Post
    I disagree about this part, I think the drafting of a second safety was more about pushing Abrams more than anything else.
    Maybe but it could also just be about cutting Heath. Heís owed 3 mill and can be cut at zero cost. A vet S would be cheaper on a min deal but not as cheap a late pick. KJ can push both kids and can cover both spots if needed. I think itís a cap move more than anything but Iím sure they also like the kid.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by FarOutIos View Post
    Yeah, I agree that they prioritized tackle. I dont think their plan was safety first, then failed. If anything, they may have preferred grant or Holland. But in general, tackles get drafted before safeties. So drafting a RT first makes sense.

    As for doubling up on safety- that also tells me grant or Holland might have been the target. If they didnít want Moehrig because of the back issue, doubling up on S makes sense as a backup plan.
    To be fair they traded up quickly for Moehrig but did not for Holland or Grant.

    Maybe a slight panic move since 2 safeties went right before Moehrig.
    But I doubt they trade up if they thought the back issue was a major problem.

    The Cowboys were certainly going to pick him if we didnt trade up.

    Im sure most if not all would have taken Moherig over grant and Holland as a Raiders fan.



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  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swift Game View Post
    To be fair they traded up quickly for Moehrig but did not for Holland or Grant.

    Maybe a slight panic move since 2 safeties went right before Moehrig.
    But I doubt they trade up if they thought the back issue was a major problem.

    The Cowboys were certainly going to pick him if we didnt trade up.

    Im sure most if not all would have taken Moherig over grant and Holland as a Raiders fan.



    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    I love the pick. Iím just saying that trading up for a guy in the second does not prove they wanted him more than the guy they actually took in the first. Implying that is almost nonsensical. (I know you werenít the one that implied that).

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swift Game View Post
    To be fair they traded up quickly for Moehrig but did not for Holland or Grant.

    Maybe a slight panic move since 2 safeties went right before Moehrig.
    But I doubt they trade up if they thought the back issue was a major problem.

    The Cowboys were certainly going to pick him if we didnt trade up.

    Im sure most if not all would have taken Moherig over grant and Holland as a Raiders fan.



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    The price would have been more steep to move up for Holland/Grant. Mayock would have had to cough up a 3rd round pick for sure. And no, I liked Holland more as a prospect. Time will tell who becomes the better player
    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Carr may very well be the worst starting QB in Raiders history. Carr is like a root canal that takes 8 hrs. The Raiders have stuck with this bum going on 7 seasons! All they have to show for it is excuses. I hope Mariorta runs him out of training camp.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Sounds as though Mayock is waxing the Pinto and installing fake leather seat covers and chrome hubcaps before posting it on Craigslist.

  6. #51
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    Abrams Abrams Abrams Abrams!


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  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by LJ4ptplay View Post
    I love the pick. Iím just saying that trading up for a guy in the second does not prove they wanted him more than the guy they actually took in the first. Implying that is almost nonsensical. (I know you werenít the one that implied that).
    We weren't in the draft room and will never know. But given Mayock's statement, concern and activity subsequent to making the Leatherwood pick, the facts certainly lean towards an interpretation that Moehrig was at the top of the Raiders' board. Mayock stated that that he knew that picking Leatherwood at 17 would create an uproar. That, too, is telling.

    I realize that you disagree with the interpretation of the facts, but calling it nonsensical is a stretch. I get it, it's easier to accept that Mayock made the proper and only choice at 17, that he completely read the draft correctly and anticipated not only the moves of other teams, but where players would fall. But that's just not the reality.

    We got lucky to get Moehrig in the second by trading up to nab him before Dallas did. But so be it. With a franchise like this, I'll take all the luck we can get.

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by RaiderLakersA's View Post
    We weren't in the draft room and will never know. But given Mayock's statement, concern and activity subsequent to making the Leatherwood pick, the facts certainly lean towards an interpretation that Moehrig was at the top of the Raiders' board. Mayock stated that that he knew that picking Leatherwood at 17 would create an uproar. That, too, is telling.

    I realize that you disagree with the interpretation of the facts, but calling it nonsensical is a stretch. I get it, it's easier to accept that Mayock made the proper and only choice at 17, that he completely read the draft correctly and anticipated not only the moves of other teams, but where players would fall. But that's just not the reality.

    We got lucky to get Moehrig in the second by trading up to nab him before Dallas did. But so be it. With a franchise like this, I'll take all the luck we can get.
    Iím not saying he was correct. Iím saying that it makes more sense to believe that he did what HE thought was the right thing to do, and not avoided drafting a higher rated player/position on their board for whatever reason.

    I truly believe he valued either the player or position he took slightly higher, but still had Moehrig with a first round grade, and was ecstatic to get both. The facts that we do know support that position.

    Either way, Iím ecstatic to get Moehrig (who was my hope at 17, to be clear) and their top-rated tackle, even if (in my vastly inferior knowledge to theirs) it was not a name I was expecting.

    I can only hope they were right.

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by LJ4ptplay View Post
    Iím not saying he was correct. Iím saying that it makes more sense to believe that he did what HE thought was the right thing to do, and not avoided drafting a higher rated player/position on their board for whatever reason.

    I truly believe he valued either the player or position he took slightly higher, but still had Moehrig with a first round grade, and was ecstatic to get both. The facts that we do know support that position.

    Either way, Iím ecstatic to get Moehrig (who was my hope at 17, to be clear) and their top-rated tackle, even if (in my vastly inferior knowledge to theirs) it was not a name I was expecting.

    I can only hope they were right.
    As several have posted, if they drafted Moehrig at 17 and Leatherwood at 48, the A and A+ grades would have been given. I still think trading back a few spots, provided the compensation was adequate, getting Leatherwood later in the first, wouldíve been the prudent thing to do. But it is what it isÖ



    This guy has to be the pick if heís available.

    Iím the president of the Christian Barmore fanclub.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swift Game View Post
    To be fair they traded up quickly for Moehrig but did not for Holland or Grant.

    Maybe a slight panic move since 2 safeties went right before Moehrig.
    But I doubt they trade up if they thought the back issue was a major problem.

    The Cowboys were certainly going to pick him if we didnt trade up.

    Im sure most if not all would have taken Moherig over grant and Holland as a Raiders fan.



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    I actually liked grant a lot. Wanted him more than Moehrig, but to be honest, didnít spend as much time looking at Moehrig since I didnít think he was worth pick 17.

    My thinking is that they wanted grant too. Didnít expect him to go before Moehrig. So when they were surprised that their targets- Holland snd grant- were gone before Moehrig, they jumped for the one that seems like a no brainer. And it seems like a great value to me- keep hearing heís the most complete S in the draft, and the only one worth a first.

    They wouldnít trade up for grant as they didnít expect him to be gone. So My guess is that they wanted another S to throw in the mix in case Moehrig isnít ready short term. I donít think they had long term concerns, otherwise they wouldnít have traded up for him.

  11. #56
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    Id love to know how you know their targets were Holland and Grant... That is going on limb and really just talking BS. You can easily say Moehrig was their top choice and when Grant and Holland came off the board they had to go get their guu. No one knows this board and they wouldn't trade up unless they wanted this guy... If they didn't you think they care if the Cowboys picked him? NO... They would of stayed and took the next guy off the board.... You are drafting as a fan not a GM...

    That is why they dgaf about the Leatherwood pick.... They wanted him, Didnt think he be their in the 2nd round. So they took their guy...

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by FarOutIos View Post
    I actually liked grant a lot. Wanted him more than Moehrig, but to be honest, didnít spend as much time looking at Moehrig since I didnít think he was worth pick 17.

    My thinking is that they wanted grant too. Didnít expect him to go before Moehrig. So when they were surprised that their targets- Holland snd grant- were gone before Moehrig, they jumped for the one that seems like a no brainer. And it seems like a great value to me- keep hearing heís the most complete S in the draft, and the only one worth a first.

    They wouldnít trade up for grant as they didnít expect him to be gone. So My guess is that they wanted another S to throw in the mix in case Moehrig isnít ready short term. I donít think they had long term concerns, otherwise they wouldnít have traded up for him.
    Grant can play in a cover 2, in the box and is good in coverage. My only concern with him was he is 24 years of age. Holland to me is good in coverage, but better as a slot or nickel guy. Moehrig was a perfect fit for what coach Bradley wants to do. When the Chargers selected Nasir Adderley in the 2nd round in 2019 (60 overall) the media raved about him and what a perfect fit he was for coach Bradley. I think Moehrig is a better player than Adderley.

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by sicknick12 View Post
    Id love to know how you know their targets were Holland and Grant... That is going on limb and really just talking BS. You can easily say Moehrig was their top choice and when Grant and Holland came off the board they had to go get their guu. No one knows this board and they wouldn't trade up unless they wanted this guy... If they didn't you think they care if the Cowboys picked him? NO... They would of stayed and took the next guy off the board.... You are drafting as a fan not a GM...

    That is why they dgaf about the Leatherwood pick.... They wanted him, Didnt think he be their in the 2nd round. So they took their guy...
    You could be right on the bs part, lol. But... Iím just going off pre- draft expectations. We were obviously locked in on leatherwood in the first. Didnít expect Moehrig to fall. So our choices would be?... Holland and grant probably. Could be wrong.

    Thatís not saying they wouldnít want Moehrig over them. Itís just who they likely were targeting expecting Moehrig to be gone.

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by FarOutIos View Post
    You could be right on the bs part, lol. But... Iím just going off pre- draft expectations. We were obviously locked in on leatherwood in the first. Didnít expect Moehrig to fall. So our choices would be?... Holland and grant probably. Could be wrong.

    Thatís not saying they wouldnít want Moehrig over them. Itís just who they likely were targeting expecting Moehrig to be gone
    .
    Could be. I think Moehrig was the was the target all along, but I think we can safely assume that at the very least your suggestion was their plan B.

    "...prone to stoogery.".

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfe-Raider View Post
    Could be. I think Moehrig was the was the target all along, but I think we can safely assume that at the very least your suggestion was their plan B.
    Definitely. Plan A or B was a priority, did not want to settle for the next level talent.

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