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  1. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bivory View Post
    Build your own star and stop waiting for one to be disgruntle enough to come here. That's a dreamers mentality Knick fans have had your entire life. Mgt has done a lot of good things in regards to patience but when you're rebuilding, it's not about winning and losing, it's about who's winning and losing. We have a bunch of 1 yr vets competing and winning against teams truly trying to rebuild (half the league), and we should be jumping for joy in the Garden..lol I'm as happy as the next guy about RJ coming along and even the wins we get, but lets be honest about who and why we're getting here and it aint the youth on this team.
    To be fair, RJ is 20. Mitch when healthy is a big part of our success and defensive identity. He’s like 20/21 or whatever. Quick is key off the bench, 19. Then Randle is only like 26. Mixing some vets in their late 20s/early 30s with that group isn’t so bad imo. I’m fine with it, and we’re winning.

    Hopefully we nail these draft picks this summer, maybe add Lonzo Ball or GTJ.

  2. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    No coach was going to come in and bench RJ. I don't understand the purpose of even suggesting that it could've happened. He was their highest draft pick in 35 years. It wasn't happening unless he completely bombed this season.
    I agree, I just wanted to point out that there were definitely veterans at RJ’s position that could have stepped in, just like they have done this season from time to time when RJ gets benched late in games.

    I wouldn’t compare RJ to Towns though. I don’t see how it would even be a thought to bench someone as talented as Towns. No team is going to have a veteran big that’s a better option than him.

  3. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by HeartOfStarks View Post
    To be fair, RJ is 20. Mitch when healthy is a big part of our success and defensive identity. He’s like 20/21 or whatever. Quick is key off the bench, 19. Then Randle is only like 26. Mixing some vets in their late 20s/early 30s with that group isn’t so bad imo. I’m fine with it, and we’re winning.

    Hopefully we nail these draft picks this summer, maybe add Lonzo Ball or GTJ.
    Mitch is 23 and Quickley turns 22 in 2 months.

    But I agree with your point. We should all be thrilled with how this team has been taking care of business in games they should win. If we can just figure out how to close games, we’ll scratch out more wins against the upper echelon teams as well.

    But more talent is definitely needed and that’s where Lonzo and others can come in after this season.

  4. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by YoungStuna View Post
    I agree, I just wanted to point out that there were definitely veterans at RJ’s position that could have stepped in, just like they have done this season from time to time when RJ gets benched late in games.

    I wouldn’t compare RJ to Towns though. I don’t see how it would even be a thought to bench someone as talented as Towns. No team is going to have a veteran big that’s a better option than him.
    The comparison was just in terms of status and standing with the team.

  5. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by YoungStuna View Post
    Mitch is 23 and Quickley turns 22 in 2 months.

    But I agree with your point. We should all be thrilled with how this team has been taking care of business in games they should win. If we can just figure out how to close games, we’ll scratch out more wins against the upper echelon teams as well.

    But more talent is definitely needed and that’s where Lonzo and others can come in after this season.
    Lol whoops I don’t know how old anyone on the team is haha

    Except Obi who is 54

  6. #201
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    Build your own star was what the Lakers were doing pre-Lebron.

    They gave up Brandon Ingram, Lonzo Ball, and ridiculous number of future first rounders to the Pelicans. The Lakers won a championship. New Orleans is still sub .500 for a second consecutive season.

    Basketball is an odd sport because 1 guy at only 5 positions can define the whole season.

    The Knicks need a point guard. I'm sorry they do. The Knicks haven't won a championship since they had an All-Star back court, Clyde & Jesus.

  7. #202
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    Bullock and Burks, especially Burks are undersized at the SF position and no coach was coming in here and benching RJ. He was the player that the team identified as their franchise moving forward.

    Bam wasn't good, that's why he didn't play. He was a good defender at the time and that's how they used him. Again, look at last year. Nunn, Herro and Robinson all were able to establish themselves as key pieces as rookies, with two of them being undrafted, because they were good. It didn't matter that they were rookies. Herro's role also continued to expand as the year went on.

    You're too stuck on RJ and using him as an example. His status with the franchise is not the same as the other players. You can't compare.

    Since when was Knox identified as a major piece? He barely played last year and has barely played since his rookie season. I don't understand how you view them as having a similar standing.

    Even you pointing out 2nd and 3rd year in terms of playing is proving the point that players aren't playing just because they are rookies. How Thibs treats younger players is well documented. Go read about his time in Minnesota. Look at how he brought along players in Chicago also.

    I'm not sure why you're so adamant about defending this aspect of Thibs. It doesn't mean he's terrible. He doesn't have to be perfect and this is clearly a flaw of his.
    I just don't think this argument is founded in reality, based on what is happening with this team right now. If these guys are any good they will play plenty next year just like RJ. You can say the RJ argument doesn't hold up but it does. Thibs is not forced to play RJ 35 mins a night. He could be playing 20 if you think he's only playing because of politics. He's the youngest player on our team, mistake prone, and plays 35 mins a night.

    I don't think Thibs is stunting the rookies development, or doing anything egregious by coaching them hard and making them earn their way. I think IQ will be a big minute player next year and if Obi improves he will too. If they weren't in the plans they wouldn't be playing at all as rookies.

  8. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    The comparison was just in terms of status and standing with the team.
    RJ was bad last year. He has gotten no props nationally until very recently. He was drafted by the prior regime and already getting bust chatter by everyone outside of Knicks fans that had belief in him. It wouldn't have been that hard to play him 20 mins a night this year in favor of Burks/Bullock.

    Also btw Duncan Robinson played 15 games his rookie year for 10 mins a night. Nunn was 24 and had 2 years of D-League exprerience. He wasn't your typical rookie. Herro played 27, Quickley is at 20.

  9. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    Tony Parker played 30 min per game as a rookie and he's another example of a player whose role increased as the season went along. Who cares if he was yelled at more? That's not what we're discussing at all. Good players deserve to play regardless of their tenure in the league.
    That is precisely the content of the post I quoted and responded to.

  10. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bivory View Post
    Build your own star and stop waiting for one to be disgruntle enough to come here. That's a dreamers mentality Knick fans have had your entire life. Mgt has done a lot of good things in regards to patience but when you're rebuilding, it's not about winning and losing, it's about who's winning and losing. We have a bunch of 1 yr vets competing and winning against teams truly trying to rebuild (half the league), and we should be jumping for joy in the Garden..lol I'm as happy as the next guy about RJ coming along and even the wins we get, but lets be honest about who and why we're getting here and it aint the youth on this team.
    But, the bugging stars you have now will ask be seeking a fortune by then. If you wait 2-3 years to develop from within, Randle is a max player. RJ is also. Then you can't bring in another star. NOW is the time. This off-season. Build it NOW.

  11. #206
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Detfink View Post
    Build your own star was what the Lakers were doing pre-Lebron.

    They gave up Brandon Ingram, Lonzo Ball, and ridiculous number of future first rounders to the Pelicans. The Lakers won a championship. New Orleans is still sub .500 for a second consecutive season.

    Basketball is an odd sport because 1 guy at only 5 positions can define the whole season.

    The Knicks need a point guard. I'm sorry they do. The Knicks haven't won a championship since they had an All-Star back court, Clyde & Jesus.
    Uh, Lebron signed as a Free Agent. THEN THEY TRADED THE FARM for the 2nd best player on the planet. THEY DID BUILD THIER OWN which is why they were able to trade for a star that wanted to play with Lebron. Do we have Lebron or anyone that stars want to play with? I think not. BUILD YOUR OWN
    Last edited by Bivory; 04-15-2021 at 04:07 PM.

  12. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    No coach was going to come in and bench RJ. I don't understand the purpose of even suggesting that it could've happened. He was their highest draft pick in 35 years. It wasn't happening unless he completely bombed this season.
    There is an ocean between "benching" and being the coach's second favorite horse. I agree RJ couldn't be benched. But he could have been a 20-25 min guy based on a poor rookie season. But he's not, he's a horse playing 35 mins a night at 20 and playing through tons of mistakes without getting yanked.

  13. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Detfink View Post
    Build your own star was what the Lakers were doing pre-Lebron.

    They gave up Brandon Ingram, Lonzo Ball, and ridiculous number of future first rounders to the Pelicans. The Lakers won a championship. New Orleans is still sub .500 for a second consecutive season.

    Basketball is an odd sport because 1 guy at only 5 positions can define the whole season.

    The Knicks need a point guard. I'm sorry they do. The Knicks haven't won a championship since they had an All-Star back court, Clyde & Jesus.
    The only reason they did that was because they literally already had the best player this generation, LeBron James who also plays the point. Then they added the best 2 way forward/center to the team. That gave them 2 top 10 2 way NBA talents.

    If you think the Knicks should follow that blue print you need to figure out how to add the best 2 way players of this generation along with another top 5 talent otherwise the Knicks should not and can not follow that blue print.

    Also New Orleans has no choice but to build through the draft so they are not going to add veterans that will ruin their draft position. Instead they will patiently build through the draft while giving their talented youth NBA experience. New Orleans should be a much better team come next season.

  14. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bivory View Post
    Uh, Lebron signed as a Free Agent. THEN THEY TRADED THE FARM for the 2nd best player on the planet. THEY DID BUILD THIER OWN which is why they were able to trade for a star that wanted to play with Lebron. Do we have Lebron or anyone that stars want to play with? I think not. BUILD YOUR OWN
    My point exactly.

  15. #210
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocco Hardball View Post
    But, the bugging stars you have now will ask be seeking a fortune by then. If you wait 2-3 years to develop from within, Randle is a max player. RJ is also. Then you can't bring in another star. NOW is the time. This off-season. Build it NOW.
    Build what now? With whom? THERE IS NO NOW. WTF are you guys talking about. This team is not good. Going one on one all night is a dead loser in the playoffs.

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