Like us on Facebook


Follow us on Twitter





Page 1 of 7 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 95
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    3,815

    FA's Want a Winning Culture...Would Trading Randle Turn These FA's Off ?

    All during last year's Free Agency, we kept hearing that FA's want to see organizations trying to win. Will Barrett, Robinson, Quickly and Toppin be enough of a lure? Assuming we look to trade Julius at the peak of his value, will that deter FA's from coming to MSG?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    LI-NY
    Posts
    37,357
    Quote Originally Posted by YankeeFanAlways View Post
    All during last year's Free Agency, we kept hearing that FA's want to see organizations trying to win. Will Barrett, Robinson, Quickly and Toppin be enough of a lure? Assuming we look to trade Julius at the peak of his value, will that deter FA's from coming to MSG?
    If we trade him without getting a really good player back like Beal then yes.

    I do think we could let him walk this offseason if two guys liked what they saw and wanted to team up here (ala DLo in Brooklyn).

    I don't think trading Randle for picks is on the table right now unless we immediately use those picks in another trade.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    28,371
    To me, it all comes down to the organizations confidence in Obi Toppin. If we believe Obi Toppin is going to replace Randle's production then you have to let Randle go ASAP. If we are unsure about Obi then you just keep riding out Quickley-Rj-Randle-Mitch as much as possible and let them develop chemistry together. We truly haven't committed to a core of players in a long-time and let them grow together.


    Kristaps Porzingis
    Stronger than most 15 year old girls.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    8,390
    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksorBust View Post
    To me, it all comes down to the organizations confidence in Obi Toppin. If we believe Obi Toppin is going to replace Randle's production then you have to let Randle go ASAP. If we are unsure about Obi then you just keep riding out Quickley-Rj-Randle-Mitch as much as possible and let them develop chemistry together. We truly haven't committed to a core of players in a long-time and let them grow together.
    Randle is putting up Jokic numbers... what are the chances Obi gets anywhere near that? Seriously

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    28,371
    Quote Originally Posted by HeartOfStarks View Post
    Randle is putting up Jokic numbers... what are the chances Obi gets anywhere near that? Seriously
    First, I love ya but you gotta pump the breaks on that comparison.

    Randle = 22ppg / 11rpg / 6apg on splits 47/38/81 for a TS% of 58% and a PER of 21
    Jokic = 27ppg / 12rpg / 9apg on splits 57/37/84 for a TS% of 66% and a PER of 31.4 (#1 in NBA)

    Totally different caliber of players. Randle MIGHT make the all-star team with and Jokic could win MVP.


    Kristaps Porzingis
    Stronger than most 15 year old girls.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    8,390
    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksorBust View Post
    First, I love ya but you gotta pump the breaks on that comparison.

    Randle = 22ppg / 11rpg / 6apg on splits 47/38/81 for a TS% of 58% and a PER of 21
    Jokic = 27ppg / 12rpg / 9apg on splits 57/37/84 for a TS% of 66% and a PER of 31.4 (#1 in NBA)

    Totally different caliber of players. Randle MIGHT make the all-star team with and Jokic could win MVP.
    Iím not saying Randle is Jokic. I donít think heís anywhere near that... I also donít think Obi is Randle... in fact the gap between Randle/Jokic is probably a lot closer than the gap between Obi/Randle if weíre being real here

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    LI-NY
    Posts
    37,357
    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksorBust View Post
    To me, it all comes down to the organizations confidence in Obi Toppin. If we believe Obi Toppin is going to replace Randle's production then you have to let Randle go ASAP. If we are unsure about Obi then you just keep riding out Quickley-Rj-Randle-Mitch as much as possible and let them develop chemistry together. We truly haven't committed to a core of players in a long-time and let them grow together.
    The best part is we have Randle's team option so we don't even have to make the Randle/Obi decision until after next season.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    13,949
    To be honest, I donít think other really good NBA players are saying ďI canít wait to team up with RandleĒ

    But if we believe Randles play is reasonably sustainable, itís tough to trade him at what he will cost next year. Also, tough to get back good value for him. Heís played like a borderline all-star. Donít know that everyone would treat him as such when dealing with us

    Iíd be surprised if we dealt him
    Last edited by ShadyOne; 02-01-2021 at 03:58 PM.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    28,371
    Quote Originally Posted by D-Leethal View Post
    The best part is we have Randle's team option so we don't even have to make the Randle/Obi decision until after next season.
    Very true. Obi has time to prove he is worth it or not. I really don't know what is preventing me from embracing Randle but I really don't think he is the future of this future. However, considering his cap hit would be $4 million if we cut him and his contract is only like $20 it seems like a no brainer to keep him for the difference.


    Kristaps Porzingis
    Stronger than most 15 year old girls.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    28,371
    Quote Originally Posted by ShadyOne View Post
    To be honest, I donít think other really good NBA players are saying ďI canít wait to team up with RandleĒ

    But if we believe Randles play is reasonably sustainable, itís tough to trade him at what he will cost next year. Also, tough to get back good value for him. Heís played like a borderline all-star. Donít know that everyone would treat him as such when dealing with us
    I agree. He's earned his contract but to me I wish we were swinging for the fences of a lottery pick and $50 million in cap space. Instead we are going to be in NBA purgatory with a pick around #10 (not a game changer), an untested Obi, and only cap space to sign 1 big FA. Like you said I don't think Randle is the piece to entice a big FA to come here.


    Kristaps Porzingis
    Stronger than most 15 year old girls.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    13,949
    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksorBust View Post
    I agree. He's earned his contract but to me I wish we were swinging for the fences of a lottery pick and $50 million in cap space. Instead we are going to be in NBA purgatory with a pick around #10 (not a game changer), an untested Obi, and only cap space to sign 1 big FA. Like you said I don't think Randle is the piece to entice a big FA to come here.
    I agree with that assessment. But it is what it is, Iím just going to make the best of it, and hope Mitch and RJ keep trending up, Randle is at least 85% for real, and IQ keeps looking like a potential stud. If we can get to a team that has a sustainable run of above .500 playoff teams that put up a fight, Iíll take it. A lot easier to swing a deal from that position, than where we are currently
    Last edited by ShadyOne; 02-01-2021 at 04:08 PM.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Posts
    3,001
    Winning culture?

    Did the Clippers have a winning culture? No.

    Did the Brooklyn Nets have a winning culture? No.


    The Knicks will NEVER get top shelf UFAs because they don't like the owner. Period. So long as Dolan owns the team, they'll never come.

    Julius Randle is getting re-signed. He's the BEST the Knicks can get.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    28,371
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Detfink View Post
    Winning culture?

    Did the Clippers have a winning culture? No.

    Did the Brooklyn Nets have a winning culture? No.


    The Knicks will NEVER get top shelf UFAs because they don't like the owner. Period. So long as Dolan owns the team, they'll never come.

    Julius Randle is getting re-signed. He's the BEST the Knicks can get.
    Ironically you picked two examples of how having a winning culture matters.

    Two seasons ago everyone was really impressed with Kenny Atkinson and the Nets overachieving with their lackluster roster and making the playoffs with a winning record. The same things were being said about Doc Rivers and the Clippers. Both teams had winning records and overachieved and then stars teamed up to join them.

    You proved the other argument!


    Kristaps Porzingis
    Stronger than most 15 year old girls.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Posts
    3,001
    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksorBust View Post
    Ironically you picked two examples of how having a winning culture matters.

    Two seasons ago everyone was really impressed with Kenny Atkinson and the Nets overachieving with their lackluster roster and making the playoffs with a winning record. The same things were being said about Doc Rivers and the Clippers. Both teams had winning records and overachieved and then stars teamed up to join them.

    You proved the other argument!
    The Clippers did not have a winning culture previous to Doc Rivers. Basically Donald Sterling bought Doc Rivers, Chris Paul, and back in those days the worst team had the best chance to win the #1 pick. Then Rivers, Paul etc overthrew Sterling. The franchise burned down with Doc Rivers and he resigned to go to Philly.

    Kenny Atkinson had nothing to do with Kyrie Irving and Kevin Durant. Irving and Durant wanted to play in NYC with autonomous power. They got Atkinson fired almost immediately. Now they got Harden. Steve Nash who is not really a coach but a towel boy.

    I must respectfully disagree.

    These players go where they want but they want everything from the owner. And they GOT it.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    28,371
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Detfink View Post
    The Clippers did not have a winning culture previous to Doc Rivers. Basically Donald Sterling bought Doc Rivers, Chris Paul, and back in those days the worst team had the best chance to win the #1 pick. Then Rivers, Paul etc overthrew Sterling. The franchise burned down with Doc Rivers and he resigned to go to Philly.

    Kenny Atkinson had nothing to do with Kyrie Irving and Kevin Durant. Irving and Durant wanted to play in NYC with autonomous power. They got Atkinson fired almost immediately. Now they got Harden. Steve Nash who is not really a coach but a towel boy.

    I must respectfully disagree.

    These players go where they want but they want everything from the owner. And they GOT it.
    There was so much sports talk about how the cultures of the Nets and Clippers have both shifted.

    https://theathletic.com/737537/2018/...nt-in-4-years/

    https://hashtagbasketball.com/brookl...e-newlook-nets

    https://www.sbnation.com/2019/4/11/1...y-lou-williams

    https://clipperholics.com/2019/03/27...la-clippers/7/

    ttps://www.ocregister.com/2019/04/27/clippers-intend-to-carry-this-seasons-winning-culture-forward/

    I stopped after easily finding 5 but it was all over ESPN too. Doc Rivers almost won coach of the year with that team before Kawhi and PG joined. If you want to ignore that and go by your own personal opinion then by all means but the narrative for both of those franchises is that they had created a winning culture and vastly over-performed the talent of their roster because of it.


    Kristaps Porzingis
    Stronger than most 15 year old girls.

Page 1 of 7 123 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •