Who Leads Off?

[R. Johnson#3]

There's been some discussion about this and I figured it's thread worthy. We have 2 elite leadoff hitters in Springer and Biggio. An argument can be made for Bichette as well. Who do you think our leadoff hitter should be and why?

I'm firm on Biggio. Mainly for his speed and ability to get on base. His bat isn't really suited to be anywhere else in the top 5 besides the leadoff spot really. He doesn't make enough contact to hit between 2-5. Not enough power to hit 3-5. He just has a great ability of getting on base and is lethal on the base paths. He's exactly what you want hitting in front of a bunch of great hitters both contact and power. He was tied for 4th in the AL in runs last year with 41 over 59 games. I think it's a safe bet to say he plates 100+ in a full season as the leadoff hitter.

Springer is a great leadoff man. It's just that his bat is so great it could go anywhere in the top 3 and it would work. If you put his 40HR bat behind Biggio and Bo then he drives in 120RBI. I get the argument for wanting a great bat hitting as many times as possible but then he's more than likely going to drive in less runs hitting leadoff. In 2019 he hit 39 HR with a .591 SLG% but only drove in 96 RBI. If he puts up that SLG% in 2021 from the 3 spot I think he'd drive in a lot more.

[Raps18-19 Champ]

Based on last year and current players

Biggio
Springer
Bichette
Teoscar
Rowdy
Guirriel
Vlad
Grichuk
Jansen (Kirk probably AAA)

[mike_noodles]

I like Biggio in the lead off spot.

[bartron_44]

100% Springer. He's been leading off for years in Houston. ..and you want that guy leading the team in PA's. This shouldn't even be a question.

This team has been looking for a true lead off guy for years. Biggio has a high OBP and works counts, but he is also a very good with RISP. When they won the EL he was the clean up hitter behind Alford, Bichette and Vladdy...and was named MVP he hit so well in that role.

For example....

Last year Biggio hit :

.326/.492/.522 with RISP
.311/.485/.514 with runners on base
.219/.309/.390 with the bases empty.

He did manage to do ok overall while hitting first, but that was despite being awful leading off games, and really bad overall when leading off an inning. ( in both 2019 and 2020).

The guy thrives with runners on base, not when leading off. ( both in 2020 and in 2019) I want him hitting 2nd again like he did most of 2019, or in the middle some where he will get more ABs with runners on base.

[bartron_44]

This thread should have started with something more like

....Springer is a great leadoff man. In 2019 he scored 96 runs, drove in 96 runs and hit 39 HR ... In just 122 games!

😊😉..hehe

[pebloemer]

Springer. Been doing it for years. He's elite. Means more AB's for him.

[ChongInc.]

I think they can convince springer to bat 2nd. Dosh did great in that spot for us.

[hanton]

you need a vote for this? 150MM reasons to bat him leadoff

[Chaotic98]

As of the roster now:
if Biggio bats first,
Bo, Springer, Teo, Vladdy, Tellez, LGJ, Grich, Jansen.

if Springer bats first:
Bo, Teo, Vladdy, Tellez, LGJ, Grich, Jansen, Biggio.

I'd have Biggio or Grich hit 9th, to have a better chance in later innings for Springer to have a better chance of having a RISP as Jansen's OBP is crappy.

[R. Johnson#3]

100% Springer. He's been leading off for years in Houston. ..and you want that guy leading the team in PA's. This shouldn't even be a question.

This team has been looking for a true lead off guy for years. Biggio has a high OBP and works counts, but he is also a very good with RISP. When they won the EL he was the clean up hitter behind Alford, Bichette and Vladdy...and was named MVP he hit so well in that role.

For example....

Last year Biggio hit :

.326/.492/.522 with RISP
.311/.485/.514 with runners on base
.219/.309/.390 with the bases empty.

He did manage to do ok overall while hitting first, but that was despite being awful leading off games, and really bad overall when leading off an inning. ( in both 2019 and 2020).

The guy thrives with runners on base, not when leading off. ( both in 2020 and in 2019) I want him hitting 2nd again like he did most of 2019, or in the middle some where he will get more ABs with runners on base.

Good post. I was unaware of his numbers leading off games. Despite his numbers with RISP he still can't get that BA above .250. If he could, I'd be a lot more comfortable with him hitting in the 2 spot. Makes me a little less firm on Biggio as the leadoff man though. I just want a potential 40 HR bat hitting behind guys who have a higher likelihood of getting on base. Not behind the 8 and 9 hitters.

Edit: Springer in the 2 spot could probably match JD's production from the 2 spot.

[R. Johnson#3]

As of the roster now:
if Biggio bats first,
Bo, Springer, Teo, Vladdy, Tellez, LGJ, Grich, Jansen.

if Springer bats first:
Bo, Teo, Vladdy, Tellez, LGJ, Grich, Jansen, Biggio.

I'd have Biggio or Grich hit 9th, to have a better chance in later innings for Springer to have a better chance of having a RISP as Jansen's OBP is crappy.

In my perfect World Grich is 9 and Biggio is 1. Stack the 2 fastest guys for when the order turns around.

[ChongInc.]

In my perfect World Grich is 9 and Biggio is 1. Stack the 2 fastest guys for when the order turns around.

If this was 2K I would be putting biggio in the 9 spot ahead of Bo with springer batting 2nd. Unfortunately real life players don’t see the huge value of batting 9th before the big boys. They want an extra AB.

[Chaotic98]

If this was 2K I would be putting biggio in the 9 spot ahead of Bo with springer batting 2nd. Unfortunately real life players don’t see the huge value of batting 9th before the big boys. They want an extra AB.

It all depends on philosopy. On ave over a 162 game schedule this is how many plate appearances each spot gets

AL:
1st - 762
2nd - 743
3rd - 725
4th - 709
5th - 693
6th - 675
7th - 657
8th - 638
9th - 618

With 1-4 having over 700 PAs you want your top 4 hitters there. Between 8 and 9 there's 20 PAs, so I'd rather want a somewhat stronger bat there to see if it gets more RBI chances for 1-2, which is why I'd put a Biggio or Grich over Jansen.

Using Sabermetrics and other stats they rank the most valuable batting spots as 4-3-1-2-5-6-7-8-9 so you put your best hitters there.

Traditional is speed at 1, a good batter at 2, most power at 4 and worst at 9.

[ChongInc.]

It all depends on philosopy. On ave over a 162 game schedule this is how many plate appearances each spot gets

AL:
1st - 762
2nd - 743
3rd - 725
4th - 709
5th - 693
6th - 675
7th - 657
8th - 638
9th - 618

With 1-4 having over 700 PAs you want your top 4 hitters there. Between 8 and 9 there's 20 PAs, so I'd rather want a somewhat stronger bat there to see if it gets more RBI chances for 1-2, which is why I'd put a Biggio or Grich over Jansen.

Using Sabermetrics and other stats they rank the most valuable batting spots as 4-3-1-2-5-6-7-8-9 so you put your best hitters there.

Traditional is speed at 1, a good batter at 2, most power at 4 and worst at 9.

Exactly though. I want to have my 4 best bats 1-4 for sure. Best bats have power though. I personally like extending the lineup by putting a high OBP player at #9.

I understand what you’re saying, but I have biggio as our best OBP guy, not exactly our best bat.

Not disagreeing. Just a philosophy thing.

[Chaotic98]

Exactly though. I want to have my 4 best bats 1-4 for sure. Best bats have power though. I personally like extending the lineup by putting a high OBP player at #9.

I understand what you’re saying, but I have biggio as our best OBP guy, not exactly our best bat.

Not disagreeing. Just a philosophy thing.

As I keep thinking about it, I'd try Grich 7, Jansen 8, Biggio 9. Biggio can act as a leadoff hitter in later innings, and allows Grich to keep his swing for the fences approach. What I hope is to wake up Jansen's bat by putting him in the 8th spot and not a 9th hitter's mentality of they don't expect me to hit. If that fails, Biggio 7, Grich 8th and Jansen 9th to recoup the PAs