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  1. #271
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    Sep 2019
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    Im fine with starting Payton for now, but eventually, Thibs needs to rotate some young guys in more.

    Payton has not been anywhere consistent enough where IQ shouldn't get some starts ahead of him, and Bullock hasn't been anywhere near consistent enough where Frank shouldn't get some starts over him.

    I don't care if you like frank or not, but his shooting looked extremely improved, and his defense is top notch. I don't think Frank will ever been a full time PG, but he could play a similar role to what Hali plays for SA. Off the ball, but in short spurts gets the ball to create for himself and others.

    IMO Frank will thrive in that role.

    And IMO IQ has clearly shown, that he deserves to get some starts over Payton. Payton has been decent but the consistently and 3 pt shot just aren't there.

    There is no reason IQ shouldn't be getting his chance soon. But at the same time, I know we have coaches working with these young guys, who know how to develop players, so I'm confident when they push thibs that IQ is ready, Thibs will give these guys their shot.

  2. #272
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    Jul 2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    Actually Trey has been playing to good lol, he helped Dallas get some wins, I'm a knick fan don' like that lol....

    I was never obsessed with Trey I simply state between him, Mudiay and frank he was the best pg we had, and a few of you went off on me, well low and behold he's probably the only one getting PG minutes right now.

    Forget that, if you haven't seen rivers then you really can't say much and if your judging a players few games vs his career, I'm not sure what to say to that, I've seen superstars go into a funk. He is no superstar but he is a steady good reserve player, how is that in love with fringe players?

    And no I'm not more obsessed with Frank I don't have him in each and every rotation, true?

    I'll say it again you will change your tune with rivers once he gets back to himself, you know his career self. he is an average 3 point shooter, slightly above average defender and gives 100% each time he steps on the court.

    FYI with his bad games, he is still shooting .392 from three, that's actually impressive how badly he's played and I still say he got hurt a few games back, his shot just don't look like his shot right now.

    And it's last 4 games if you want to count the game he was obviously hurt yet still shot 2-5 from three had 6 boards and 4 assists and a +5 when we loss. so technically its 3 bad games in row, you can hate him but why?


    That my friend is reality, not judging a guy
    I dont hate Rivers, was simply saying if accountability is an actual thing he may be playing himself out of the rotation, well see what happens.

    As long as Frank is starting at PF next game Im good

  3. #273
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
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    2,443
    There's no way Mr. Thibs will EVER take away Elfrid Payton's starting job. Elfrid Payton to Julius Randle is the bread/butter and identity of this team. End of story.

    The only way to make an argument is in areas more malleable, that being shooting guard. Seth Bullock has no value. Burks is renown for getting hurt, which is why the Knicks got a nice contract for him.

    Immanuel Quixley can push his way to the starting line up as a shooting guard with point guard sensibilities. He can get RJ Barrett the ball where it plays to his strengths. Same with soon to be back up Center, Obi Toppin.

    Thibs is an old school coach. He doesn't give you what you want. You have to force the issue. You say, I'm a power forward...he makes you play small forward. You say you're a point guard...he makes you play shooting guard.

    These young rookies have to find a path around the obstacle.

  4. #274
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    May 2008
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    49,831
    Quote Originally Posted by HeartOfStarks View Post
    I dont hate Rivers, was simply saying if accountability is an actual thing he may be playing himself out of the rotation, well see what happens.

    As long as Frank is starting at PF next game Im good
    lol that's great

    I still maintain that Frank has a great shot off a pick taking that 15 foot shot, that has been like money for him yet we only see once in a blue moon. that's on the coaching staff to not recognize his strength.

    this club would only benefit from him and Knox continued growth and they are both still very young.

    For some reason you hear more about Payton's defense from Thibs and now JVG and not much about Franks which is a bit odd.

  5. #275
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    May 2008
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    Marc Berman
    @NYPost_Berman

    6m
    Not in piece but JVG on conversing with Thibs: "I talk to him. I dont give suggestions. Every team employs 8,000 coaches now. The last thing he needs as a head coach is someone else in his ear. We talk basketball. But its more generalities. Hes got plenty of guys."

  6. #276
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    Jul 2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    lol that's great

    I still maintain that Frank has a great shot off a pick taking that 15 foot shot, that has been like money for him yet we only see once in a blue moon. that's on the coaching staff to not recognize his strength.

    this club would only benefit from him and Knox continued growth and they are both still very young.

    For some reason you hear more about Payton's defense from Thibs and now JVG and not much about Franks which is a bit odd.
    Im telling you guys Payton has a fully staffed PR team inside the Knicks FO, hes like big sugar theres lobbyists and everything

  7. #277
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    Dec 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by HeartOfStarks View Post
    Im telling you guys Payton has a fully staffed PR team inside the Knicks FO, hes like big sugar theres lobbyists and everything
    Tell me about it. Management is actually having success convincing some around here that Bully, Rivers, and Payton have value and should get more playing time than a 3rd yr lottery pick having his best yr as a pro. Repeat a lie long enough, people will start believing it's true.

  8. #278
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bivory View Post
    Tell me about it. Management is actually having success convincing some around here that Bully, Rivers, and Payton have value and should get more playing time than a 3rd yr lottery pick having his best yr as a pro. Repeat a lie long enough, people will start believing it's true.
    Agreed, 2 out of 3 of those guys should be relegated to the bench imo but well see if it happens. Id probably have Payton backing up Q at this point personally and move Rivers/Bullock to third string, neither are doing much for us at this point imo (at least when were healthy, I realize right now guys are out so of course theyll get minutes).

    But Im with you on Knox, hes improved and I would prioritize him over Bullock personally.

  9. #279
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    Ian Begley Retweeted
    Steve Popper
    @StevePopper

    1h
    Knicks January 31 game against the Clippers at MSG has been moved from 5 p.m. to 1 p.m.

  10. #280
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    May 2008
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    You know for all the talk of Payton and Bullock stink defensively? Not sure how this happens then? Forget points allowed because that can be contributed to pace but the %?

    1st in points allowed (102.7)
    1st in opponents FG%
    1st in opponents 3-point FG%
    5th in Defensive Efficiency



    The Thibs affect:


  11. #281
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    You know for all the talk of Payton and Bullock stink defensively? Not sure how this happens then? Forget points allowed because that can be contributed to pace but the %?

    1st in points allowed (102.7)
    1st in opponents FG%
    1st in opponents 3-point FG%
    5th in Defensive Efficiency



    The Thibs affect:

    I never said Bullock is bad on defense, its his shot that seems to be slipping to me.

    Payton is not a good defender. Probably close to average but hes really not good, guys blow by him a lot, hes inconsistent at getting past screens, hes just not great.

    Mitch has been great. RJ is a pretty good defender imo, Bullock is probably a bit above average on that end and surprisingly Randle has improved a good bit on that end. Overall this is why were good defensively, I believe a lot of it is the coaching change.

  12. #282
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    Quote Originally Posted by HeartOfStarks View Post
    I never said Bullock is bad on defense, its his shot that seems to be slipping to me.

    Payton is not a good defender. Probably close to average but hes really not good, guys blow by him a lot, hes inconsistent at getting past screens, hes just not great.

    Mitch has been great. RJ is a pretty good defender imo, Bullock is probably a bit above average on that end and surprisingly Randle has improved a good bit on that end. Overall this is why were good defensively, I believe a lot of it is the coaching change.
    Everyone gets beat in the NBA. Payton is a good defender and a good team defender. If he wasn't making the right rotations and the right switches Thibs wouldn't be playing him.

  13. #283
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    Quote Originally Posted by HeartOfStarks View Post
    I never said Bullock is bad on defense, its his shot that seems to be slipping to me.

    Payton is not a good defender. Probably close to average but hes really not good, guys blow by him a lot, hes inconsistent at getting past screens, hes just not great.

    Mitch has been great. RJ is a pretty good defender imo, Bullock is probably a bit above average on that end and surprisingly Randle has improved a good bit on that end. Overall this is why were good defensively, I believe a lot of it is the coaching change.
    Nah its Obi Toppin
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps08-09 Champ View Post
    My dick is named 'Ewing'.

  14. #284
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    Dec 2008
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    12,537
    Remember when looking at defensive rankings..

    Good teams really dont care about the regular season. They rest guys when they feel like it. Cut guys minutes if they think they need to. They crank it up when they need to

  15. #285
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    May 2008
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    So RJ who does get beat a lot, is pretty good, bullock is just a bit above average, Randle has improved and Payton is just flat out no good on defense? yet that description nets a high ranking % wise?

    Every PG in this league gets beat, IQ went up against the best of the best and he blew him away. Its a team game on defense no player with picks is locking you down.

    I'm guessing you guys think Thibs is just flat out bad for thinking bullock and payton can play defense? Why would he not only say it but be adamant about it?

    We all wanted Payton out, but right now i'll go with the coach's decision till further notice. 7-8 you'd think we were 3-12?

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