RJ Barrett

[D-Leethal]

This is not a bash Barrett thread. Looking to gauge Knick fans sentiments right now about RJ and his prospects to be an all star caliber player. When teams draft guys to be a star, they are featured early on and put up numbers before the team realizes they aren't guys you are gonna win with as a top option. Two easy examples are Wiggins and Jabari Parker.

Pros
- Hard worker, basketball lifer, no nonsense (all this bodes well in the NBA)
- NBA body, great strength
- Good defense with potential to be great
- Good all around game - he can fill up the stat sheet when he is on

Cons
- Really bad shooter
- Struggles to score 1 on 1
- Lacks athleticism
- Doesn't really have a reliable trait on offense at all

My current sentiments is that he has a solid NBA floor due to his pros, but right now is showing a low ceiling due to his cons. If he doesn't fix his cons in a big way he's a better Stanley Johnson.
If he does, you have a Jimmy Butler type. At the end of the day you don't get to be an all star this league at the wing position without being a go to scorer. Not gonna lie, I am worried about RJ, tell me why I'm wrong.

[nycericanguy]

RJ is athletic, he's not a freak, but he's certainly athletic.

He's a bad 3pt shooter this year, but he shot over 32% last year, and 31% in college, he's not going to be at 20% much longer. He's also drastically improved at the FT line, and his mid range % is much better too.

I also don't think he struggles to score 1 on 1, i think he struggles when met at the rim by multiple defenders.

in short his biggest issue is shooting and I'm confident that will improve as he matures. and yes, some spacing wouldn't hurt his game at all. We have somehow managed to give him even WORSE spacing then he had at Duke.

[D-Leethal]

RJ is athletic, he's not a freak, but he's certainly athletic.

He's a bad 3pt shooter this year, but he shot over 32% last year, and 31% in college, he's not going to be at 20% much longer. He's also drastically improved at the FT line, and his mid range % is much better too.

I also don't think he struggles to score 1 on 1, i think he struggles when met at the rim by multiple defenders.

in short his biggest issue is shooting and I'm confident that will improve as he matures. and yes, some spacing wouldn't hurt his game at all. We have somehow managed to give him even WORSE spacing then he had at Duke.

I think RJ can score well if you give him the ball on the move in a handoff or screen situation, but I don't think he is good at all at getting off a quality shot in 1v1 isolation/late shot clock scenarios. He doesn't really have a go to move to get himself a clean look.

I also don't see much athleticism - I don't think he's quick enough to consistently take his man off the dribble. He's more of a bully and less so when he is playing SF.

[nycericanguy]

I think RJ can score well if you give him the ball on the move in a handoff or screen situation, but I don't think he is good at all at getting off a quality shot in 1v1 isolation/late shot clock scenarios. He doesn't really have a go to move to get himself a clean look.

I also don't see much athleticism - I don't think he's quick enough to consistently take his man off the dribble. He's more of a bully and less so when he is playing SF.

he's 6'6 210, keep in mind 2 years ago he would have been listed at 6'7. you figure he's going to be 220ish in his prime. I think he should see some minutes at the 4 in stretches. You look at Tatum who is 210 and he's been a best at PF.

i just think he doesnt have skills that jump off hte board at u, but he's going to just be very solid all around.

[ShadyOne]

he's 6'6 210, keep in mind 2 years ago he would have been listed at 6'7. you figure he's going to be 220ish in his prime. I think he should see some minutes at the 4 in stretches. You look at Tatum who is 210 and he's been a best at PF.

i just think he doesnt have skills that jump off hte board at u, but he's going to just be very solid all around.

I think Tatum fits wherever, because hes got the right combination of size, athletic ability, and skill. I don’t see RJ ever being on that level. Tatum causes a mismatch no matter what

[THE MTL]

His shooting is killing us. He misses on high quality 3pter shots. But he is only 20 and has 2yrs to play until he's 22. He'll come into his own

[D-Leethal]

The good news is he really just needs to do one thing to really turn things around and be a very good player - starting hitting jump shots and 3s at an average rate. If he gets to average there, everything else is already in place. He is good enough inside and around the basket to be a 20ppg guy is he gets an average jump shot. Then you also have the rest of his game which is well rounded.

I’m disappointed to see no improvement on the jumper this year. It’s good that he’s shooting better FTs but so is Andre Drummond. That’s not moving me much when he’s had two 0-20 stretches from 3 12 games into the season.

[Dr. Detfink]

My opinion hasn't changed since I watched him in college. He's a solid player. A very good role player. He's a tremendous 3rd option and fill-in 2nd option.

He cannot carry a team. He is a not a Hall of Famer.

[Hustla23]

The good news is he really just needs to do one thing to really turn things around and be a very good player - starting hitting jump shots and 3s at an average rate. If he gets to average there, everything else is already in place. He is good enough inside and around the basket to be a 20ppg guy is he gets an average jump shot. Then you also have the rest of his game which is well rounded.

I’m disappointed to see no improvement on the jumper this year. It’s good that he’s shooting better FTs but so is Andre Drummond. That’s not moving me much when he’s had two 0-20 stretches from 3 12 games into the season.

I'd have to double check but I'm pretty sure there's a significant correlation between FT% and overall jump shooting. It's a good sign that RJ's free throw percentage has improved.

Overall, I'm not too concerned. Probably the most important trait any star has is mental strength. RJ has that in boat loads and his physical traits are sufficient enough to fulfill any star tier projections.

The second most important trait is probably IQ. Contrast RJ's feel for the game with a guy who is more explosive and athletic than him like Shumpert who had no clue how to play basketball and subsequently sucked horribly.

Having said all that, his three ball looks like it has no consistency with almost a different form every time he shoots it. He's a work horse so there's reason to be hopeful that he'll figure it out.

[beagleboss]

I'd be OK with Barrett if he wasn't the 3rd pick in a Zion and Morant draft. They were all saying this was a 3 player draft. And it turns out it was a 2 player draft. Barrett is not it. I agree he is a nice kid who works hard but his talent and overall game is just not fun or exciting to watch. And he doesn't have star potential imo. I cringe and get physically ill every time he takes a 3 or tries to drive to the hole at 3 mph. And once he gets into the paint, he doesn't have any athleticism or moves to get off a good shot. That's why he misses layup's and gets blocked a ton. It's frusting to watch. He should not be a go-to player for offense. If we're being honest, he should be an opportunistic scorer who only shots when he's wide open or set up.

I really hope he ends up as a decent 4th or 5th option on a good team who is a jack of all trades type of player but in terms of him ending up like Jimmy Butler (which is what I was hoping for) that dream has ended. This kid doesn't have that talent or skill. I know some will say he's only 20 and he doesn't have the right spacing and talent around him and I've taken that into account. This is more of an observation of Barrett's skills. He's severely overrated.

[Azrael]

I think he is putting to much pressure on himself to be that allstar and number 1 option on the team. Bring in Lavine and make Rj the 3rd option and let him develop at his pace.

[D-Leethal]

I think he is putting to much pressure on himself to be that allstar and number 1 option on the team. Bring in Lavine and make Rj the 3rd option and let him develop at his pace.

To be fair that is what he has been projected to be since grade school. Just like guys like Wiggins, Jabari, Michael Beasley, OJ Mayo. Eventually you realize they just aren't that dude they were projected to be. I'm not quite there yet but RJ needs to turn his jumper around in a big big way.

RJ has a high floor for all the reasons I mentioned, and can transition into a deeper scoring option and all around solid pro, but at some point you need to decide to stop giving the kid 40 minutes and featuring him as your 2nd option and giving him the ball in crunch time like he is your star player if he isn't able to deliver at that level.

I would argue RJ is underperforming the expectations of his role (2nd option, young budding star) more than anyone else on our team and now we are already lowering the bar for him.

[HeartOfStarks]

His shooting is killing us. He misses on high quality 3pter shots. But he is only 20 and has 2yrs to play until he's 22. He'll come into his own

This. It all comes down to his shot. If he can get it right we’re good, if not we have an issue. But he still hasn’t even played 82 pro games so think we can give him a bit of time.

[Bubba313]

All this after a game where RJ actually played really well minus the 1.5 turnovers (not putting full blame on him for the second turnover) at the end of the game seems like a bit much.

Everything's basically been said about RJ in this forum one way or another. One thing I'll add - We generate next to nothing in fast break points (see Payton and to a lesser extent Randle walking the ball up), and it's an area where RJ would shine.

[ewing]

I am more encouraged by Barrett then I have been at anytime. Watching him at Duke I thought he was extremely overrated and he didn’t change my mind in his rookie year. I definitely thought he might be a bust. This year he has shown not only can he use his strength to get to spots but he can actually finish. He still plays a position that almost always demands you have a jump shot if you are going to be an impact player. Also despite becoming a promising driver and finisher almost every drive is a bully ball move. When he doesn’t have a physical advantage he becomes very limited so he will get shut down in some match ups. I think the OJ Mayo comparison is valid. His profile has been elevated a lot bc he has this long standing rep. Still he gets a lot done for a guy that lacks a jumper or any shake. He doesn’t have to add a ton to be a good player. With a jump shot I think he becomes a legit starter on just about any team. Even still I think eventually we will see that is what he is and he shouldn’t have the ball all the time. He not a great creator or play maker for others. Still if he is a physical presence that gives you 18- 20 and hits open jumpers at a fairly consistently that’s a damn good player


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