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  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by pebloemer View Post
    He's playing as expected. Good matchup for him to get some run.

    Stanley Johnson being first off the bench is quite shocking. Looking good defensively, but he is hard to watch on the other end...
    Showing Houston that Stanley isn’t just cap filler.

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by smith&wesson View Post
    Raps are in trouble. The way the team is currently constructed they are a first round exit and by the looks of it, if things keep going as they are they wont even be in the playoffs.

    Who here is convinced that Siakam/OG/FVV is a core that has a ceiling higher than the 2nd round at best? I personally dont see it, and I think Masai needs to retool this team. Lowry is expiring and turning 35. Gotta figure something out.

    And whats up with Masai's extension?
    No, but they’re a great surrounding cast for a superstar.

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    No, but they’re a great surrounding cast for a superstar.
    You're joking right cuz what superstar is going to want to come to Toronto to pair up with Siakam

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tg11 View Post
    You're joking right cuz what superstar is going to want to come to Toronto to pair up with Siakam
    Jayson Tatum

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by R. Johnson#3 View Post
    Jayson Tatum
    Tatum is on a max near super max so it isn't happening...5 more years on that contract and you would have to give up a lot so sorry try again...only superstar y'all could even realistically get is James Harden but y'all are not goin to pull that trigger either because the Rockets essentially would ask for Siakam, Powell, Van Vleet and others plus draft picks

    No way Masai pulls the trigger on that

    So you are essentially stuck with what you have...so good luck trying to win with Siakam as your main star

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by smith&wesson View Post
    I dont know what warranted Siakam becoming the highest paid player in franchise history. I dont think he will lead the team as far as Demar did even. I dont see us getting to the ECF's with Siakam as our best player, especially not with this cast. I actually wouldnt mind to see a big trade at this point.

    The Nets, Bucks, Heat, Celtics, & 76ers all have a better core. Thats the top 5 seeds in the east. The Magic & Pacers are going to be competitive this year. There are some good up and coming young teams on the rise too like the Hawks. I see this team fighting for a 7th/8th seed realistically and I dont think Masai is banking on free agency now that Giannis is off the table. So really in order to improve on what we have, we need Masai to get clever with some trades as he has always done.
    I saw the Raptors as a 5 or 6 seed coming in and was hoping they could surprise and get into the top 4. I still think they will finish in the top 6. They could have won all three games as they had double digit leads in all of them.

    The Raptors are in an interesting spot because clearly they are not a championship contender this season and they are too talented to miss the playoffs. With the big name FAs coming off the board, I wonder what the next move is. I don't see the Raptors rebuilding.

    Sent from my SM-A530W using Tapatalk
    “It’s about winning,” Stoudemire said. “You win, you’re going to get on national TV. Simple. In Phoenix, we won — Western Conference finals three, four years, playoffs every year. We won. If you don’t win, nobody really wants to see you.”

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by smith&wesson View Post
    I dont know what warranted Siakam becoming the highest paid player in franchise history. I dont think he will lead the team as far as Demar did even. I dont see us getting to the ECF's with Siakam as our best player, especially not with this cast. I actually wouldnt mind to see a big trade at this point.

    The Nets, Bucks, Heat, Celtics, & 76ers all have a better core. Thats the top 5 seeds in the east. The Magic & Pacers are going to be competitive this year. There are some good up and coming young teams on the rise too like the Hawks. I see this team fighting for a 7th/8th seed realistically and I dont think Masai is banking on free agency now that Giannis is off the table. So really in order to improve on what we have, we need Masai to get clever with some trades as he has always done.
    I wouldn't consider Siakam our best player. I also wouldn't consider DeMar the best player from our ECF team. Was Lowry, still Lowry, IMO.

    The thing is no one in this forum has argued this core can win. We all know this is a step back year. So the trolling (not you) is just one guy arguing with the idea of what he thinks this fan base believes. I've blocked the troll because the toxicity will wreck the forum for all, but the idea in jumping into another fan base's discussion and arguing with no one is really only one of a few things. It is either trolling, delusion or stupidity.

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by aman_13 View Post
    I'd like to see the Raptors run some more pick and pop with Siakam.

    His jumper looks much better despite the misses. What is getting him in trouble is his drives to the rim as it still feels like he is not going up strong enough.

    Sent from my SM-A530W using Tapatalk
    Yea a PnP works. The thing with Siakam is they now know how he will operate once he drives. Need to switch it up.

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tg11 View Post
    Tatum is on a max near super max so it isn't happening...5 more years on that contract and you would have to give up a lot so sorry try again...only superstar y'all could even realistically get is James Harden but y'all are not goin to pull that trigger either because the Rockets essentially would ask for Siakam, Powell, Van Vleet and others plus draft picks

    No way Masai pulls the trigger on that

    So you are essentially stuck with what you have...so good luck trying to win with Siakam as your main star
    Danny Ainge feels the Heat so he's going to trade Tatum for a win now package. Probably something like..

    Tatum

    for

    Powell, McCaw, Baynes and a 2029 2nd round pick
    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Facts can be hypothetical.

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by aman_13 View Post
    I'd like to see the Raptors run some more pick and pop with Siakam.

    His jumper looks much better despite the misses. What is getting him in trouble is his drives to the rim as it still feels like he is not going up strong enough.

    Sent from my SM-A530W using Tapatalk
    For a PnP to be effective there has to be the threat of the roll as well. We don't have a single big who's a good roll man. It's a shame considering Lowry is able to run the PnR like a pro. Ibaka was good enough on the roll which is why he'd get those wide open elbow jumpers off the PnP.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Facts can be hypothetical.

  11. #101
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    Something tells me we get things figured out soon. I mean its a matter of time. Over the past couple years we lost , green, kawhi, gasol, ibaka (thats a lot of touches). It would be a dream but hard to expect guys to immediately step up. With teams coming in with better scouting reports on the top options on a team, of course itl take some time for guys like Baynes or even for that fact van vleet/og to come in and put up more shots and still be efficient. In that regards PS should have a harder time this year as compared to last year but I mean thats up to him. He has the work ethic and puts in the work but a lot of times I think it just comes down to a mental aspect and him speaking about "his mental aspect of the game not being all there", I think thats probably one of the last hardles. Just need to get back to doing "Good" Better. Do the basics. Run the court and all that... Gotta stop trying to post up from the three point line lmao.

  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    No, but they’re a great surrounding cast for a superstar.
    Agreed 💯

  13. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by pebloemer View Post
    I wouldn't consider Siakam our best player. I also wouldn't consider DeMar the best player from our ECF team. Was Lowry, still Lowry, IMO.

    The thing is no one in this forum has argued this core can win. We all know this is a step back year. So the trolling (not you) is just one guy arguing with the idea of what he thinks this fan base believes. I've blocked the troll because the toxicity will wreck the forum for all, but the idea in jumping into another fan base's discussion and arguing with no one is really only one of a few things. It is either trolling, delusion or stupidity.
    I love Lowry, I wish we had 10 more years of Lowry. But we need to figure what to do if and when he’s gone because I really don’t think FVV and Siakam are leading this team. This is why I asked about the core of FVV/OG/Siakam. Are they good enough? To me the answer is no and that’s because they are entirely way to dependent on Lowry. If Kyle sits out 10 games we likely lose 9 of them.

    With respect to your post I agree that Lowry is our best player. I also think that is a problem.. Siakam is paid to be the franchise player. Other wise why the heck did we give him that contract? I know a lot of people here love Siakam but I think we learned with Derozan not to be to much of homers and subjectively look at our team. Siakam is a piece not a corner stone and a I think Masai made a mistake with that contract. I really do. Siakam should have gotten a little more than FVV NOT 33-34 mill a year and be completely reliant on a pg who may not be here next year. Then the question begs to be asked. Are the core of FVV/OG/Siakam a product of Lowrys ability to be a floor general? Do they all shrink when he’s gone? Serious question.
    Last edited by smith&wesson; 12-31-2020 at 12:37 PM.

  14. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by smith&wesson View Post
    I love Lowry, I wish we had 10 more years of Lowry. But we need to figure what to do if and when he’s gone because I really don’t think FVV and Siakam are leading this team. This is why I asked about the core of FVV/OG/Siakam. Are they good enough? To me the answer is no and that’s because they are entirely way to dependent on Lowry. If Kyle sits out 10 games we likely lose 9 of them.

    With respect to your post I agree that Lowry is our best player. I also think that is a problem.. Siakam is paid to be the franchise player. Other wise why the heck did we give him that contract? I know a lot of people here love Siakam but I think we learned with Derozan not to be to much of homers and subjectively look at our team. Siakam is a piece not a corner stone and a I think Masai made a mistake with that contract. I really do. Siakam should have gotten a little more than FVV NOT 33-34 mill a year and be completely reliant on a pg who may not be here next year. Then the question begs to be asked. Are the core of FVV/OG/Siakam a product of Lowrys ability to be a floor general? Do they all shrink when he’s gone? Serious question.
    Definitely happy to discuss this. I agree that a core of FVV/OG/Siakam isn't enough. Those are 3 really good pieces of a supporting cast. As a team, overall team play led to a lot of success last year. That doesn't work with weak links, which a now have many. We aren't seeing Norm from last year (is he really just a jump shooter that curls of screens now?). Ibaka and Gasol were huge sources of strength. Other teams (ie. Atlanta, Indiana, Brooklyn, Philly) will all be better than they were last year. I would have us on the playoff fringe. My pre-season prediction was 6th, but I had higher expectations for Baynes in that scenario (he hasn't looked good IMO). I think we are probably 7-10 range in the East this year.

    So what to do with Lowry and how to add to FVV/Siakam/OG?

    3 options:

    1. Trade. I don't believe this team can acquire Harden without giving pieces from that core up. Probably 2 of those pieces + picks IMO. Which is terribly risky and I don't think we'd be able to win around Harden. I think trading needs to look to the future. As such, anyone should be on the block in the right deal. I think Lowry for futures is the most sensible.

    2. Draft. 2021 draft is said to be loaded. Lottery odds are more balanced. Trading Lowry for futures (picks or young players on rookie scales) could help our draft position and give us additional picks. This organization has excelled at drafting and developing. FVV/OG/Siakam are good, young and contract controlled players to help youth along.

    3. FA. Once we wave goodbye to Kyle, we still have about 30 million in cap space. Is Oladipo a target? Jrue Holiday? DeRozan? Go after an RFA like Collins, Markannen, Lonzo?

  15. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by pebloemer View Post
    Definitely happy to discuss this. I agree that a core of FVV/OG/Siakam isn't enough. Those are 3 really good pieces of a supporting cast. As a team, overall team play led to a lot of success last year. That doesn't work with weak links, which a now have many. We aren't seeing Norm from last year (is he really just a jump shooter that curls of screens now?). Ibaka and Gasol were huge sources of strength. Other teams (ie. Atlanta, Indiana, Brooklyn, Philly) will all be better than they were last year. I would have us on the playoff fringe. My pre-season prediction was 6th, but I had higher expectations for Baynes in that scenario (he hasn't looked good IMO). I think we are probably 7-10 range in the East this year.

    So what to do with Lowry and how to add to FVV/Siakam/OG?

    3 options:

    1. Trade. I don't believe this team can acquire Harden without giving pieces from that core up. Probably 2 of those pieces + picks IMO. Which is terribly risky and I don't think we'd be able to win around Harden. I think trading needs to look to the future. As such, anyone should be on the block in the right deal. I think Lowry for futures is the most sensible.

    2. Draft. 2021 draft is said to be loaded. Lottery odds are more balanced. Trading Lowry for futures (picks or young players on rookie scales) could help our draft position and give us additional picks. This organization has excelled at drafting and developing. FVV/OG/Siakam are good, young and contract controlled players to help youth along.

    3. FA. Once we wave goodbye to Kyle, we still have about 30 million in cap space. Is Oladipo a target? Jrue Holiday? DeRozan? Go after an RFA like Collins, Markannen, Lonzo?
    I do think we could win if we had the right team around him. For example if we kept Lowry/OG/Siakam and incert Harden to that starting line up I think we look pretty dam good in the east. I’m a rockets fan too, as I currently live in Houston and have been following the situation very closely. Our new GM has made it clear he wants picks and a young player emerging as a star. Beyond that they want expiring contracts to get out of Hardens bloated deal. And because of Harden making his trade demands public and his antics, Houston has lost a lot of leverage. This is where Masai can take advantage. We have a ton of expiring deals/ picks and can offer up FVV. Now the harden thing was just an example as I agree with you it comes with a lot of risk. However I’d gladly take that risk vs staying with what we have which is a team that will struggle to make the playoffs.

    If we trade Lowry this core is dead in the water so I don’t see that as a solution unless we’re also going to make further trades and go in to a complete rebuild. This team as constructed is nothing with out Lowry. Which is my concern considering Lowry is nearing the end of his career.

    Last point, we should never ever bank on free agency. When Giannis was an option it was different because there’s a connection there with Masai. But in general terms we have never been a desirable free agent destination.

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