Like us on Facebook


Follow us on Twitter





Page 6 of 10 FirstFirst ... 45678 ... LastLast
Results 76 to 90 of 137
  1. #76
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    13,430
    Quote Originally Posted by vikingsfan0845 View Post
    Rhodes, Waynes, Alexander, Harris, Munnerlyn. Gladney and Dantzler look promising as well.
    All they hype was on Dantzler but Gladney is a god damn dawg! Both have had their up and downs but you see a lot of promise there.

    Don't forget Anthony Harris and even Andrew Sendejo. Sendejo actually played decent for us, at times.

  2. #77
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    13,430
    Quote Originally Posted by pacofunk64 View Post
    I hadn't really followed up yet on that but one guy I follow said he was expecting Ezra to get an F considering he never played Guard and never played on the right side. He said he thought it was around a C grade though.
    Ezra Cleveland allowed five pressures on 43 pass blocking snaps, including three hits and a sack. Losing to Grady Jarrett is understandable but making Allen Bailey look like an all-pro is not ideal. (via Nick Olson on Twitter)

  3. #78
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    13,430
    Quote Originally Posted by pavikingsfan View Post
    This team had Zimmer and were a legit SB contender BEFORE Cousins trash came to town. I would have no problem cleaning house and starting over, because that is the reality of the Cousins signing. We have to now start over. If we're not firing everybody, it should at least go in this order. 1.) Cousins 1.) Spielman 3.) Zimmer.
    Spielman is responsible for the mess, not Zimmer, so Rick should already be fired. Zimmer is at least an average to above average coach. Be careful what you wish for, it could get worse. He at least has made the culture here respectable. Cousins should at least get benched. It's time to move on from it. Cousins just got paid when he had the opportunity, I don't fault him. It's not his fault this organization couldn't do meaningful diligence on him and his history of sucking when it matters. Go back and read the "Kirk Cousins official thread (Poll)" and see all the arm chair quarterbacks on this site who were certain it was gonna start raining Lombardi trophies.
    I still have no problem with Kirk signing. Obviously in hindsight his contract has hindered us but at the time I thought it was a nice 3 year deal with not much risk. I was on the border of extending him but again was ok with it. We didn't have any young QB in the wings.

    Kirk is a good QB, in the 10-15 range. He is playing bad this year no doubt. The problem with Kirk, and quite frankly a lot of these other QB's, is they get paid to carry a team and win when other things are not going as well or as planned. Kirk is not one of those guys. Just like Jimmy G isn't, Jared Goff isn't. Those teams are in the same boat as we are.

  4. #79
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    20,696
    Quote Originally Posted by vikingsfan0845 View Post
    Rhodes, Waynes, Alexander, Harris, Munnerlyn. Gladney and Dantzler look promising as well.
    That wasn't my post but I believe the intent was what players did Zimmer coach up to be good that didn't necessarily have the talent/skills coming out of college. Rhodes, Waynes and Gladney were all first round talents with great skills coming out of college. Alexander was a second round pick who probably would have been drafted in the late first round had he not been injured during the Combine. Munnerlyn's best year was in 2013 with the Panthers before he came to the Vikings so I'm not sure if Zimmer really helped improve his play at the position.

    Just my two cents....
    https://orig00.deviantart.net/1dc3/f/2018/078/e/e/cousins_by_matthew998-dc6cc8l.png

  5. #80
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    20,696
    Quote Originally Posted by pacofunk64 View Post
    I still have no problem with Kirk signing. Obviously in hindsight his contract has hindered us but at the time I thought it was a nice 3 year deal with not much risk. I was on the border of extending him but again was ok with it. We didn't have any young QB in the wings.

    Kirk is a good QB, in the 10-15 range. He is playing bad this year no doubt. The problem with Kirk, and quite frankly a lot of these other QB's, is they get paid to carry a team and win when other things are not going as well or as planned. Kirk is not one of those guys. Just like Jimmy G isn't, Jared Goff isn't. Those teams are in the same boat as we are.
    Unfortunately the front office doesn't want any competition for Cousins so we are stuck with virtually nothing behind him at the position. That's a failure on the front office and they should be held accountable.
    https://orig00.deviantart.net/1dc3/f/2018/078/e/e/cousins_by_matthew998-dc6cc8l.png

  6. #81
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Steubenville, Ohio
    Posts
    18,415
    Quote Originally Posted by pavikingsfan View Post
    This team had Zimmer and were a legit SB contender BEFORE Cousins trash came to town. I would have no problem cleaning house and starting over, because that is the reality of the Cousins signing. We have to now start over. If we're not firing everybody, it should at least go in this order. 1.) Cousins 1.) Spielman 3.) Zimmer.
    Spielman is responsible for the mess, not Zimmer, so Rick should already be fired. Zimmer is at least an average to above average coach. Be careful what you wish for, it could get worse. He at least has made the culture here respectable. Cousins should at least get benched. It's time to move on from it. Cousins just got paid when he had the opportunity, I don't fault him. It's not his fault this organization couldn't do meaningful diligence on him and his history of sucking when it matters. Go back and read the "Kirk Cousins official thread (Poll)" and see all the arm chair quarterbacks on this site who were certain it was gonna start raining Lombardi trophies.
    I'm not firing Spielman over the Cousins decision. It was known Cousins struggled to win the game in Washington but at the same time it's easy to say that the Washington organization is a dumpster fire and it's hard for anyone to win there. If there is any position your going to take a risk on it's the QB position. And honestly, last year I started to think maybe it was paying off. The come back win over the Broncos and the playoff win in NO seemed like potential signs of things to come. Those games in the past Cousins would lose.

    Regardless of that, now is the time to move on. If we can find a team willing to trade for him then our cap problems are solved. But I'm still not going to fire a GM for taking a chance on a QB, especially when the overall results were pretty good. Are we still so quick to forget the successes we've had? This roster is as talented as it is because of Spielman's decisions. The Diggs trade and use of those draft picks alone is extremely impressive. Just from this draft class we've seen Jefferson look like a star, both corners have flashed from time to time, Wonnum has been playing more lately and looks good, Lynch is starting to carve out more playing time, and while Cleveland didn't look good against Jarrett, he finally got into the starting line up. And that is just this years class. Say what you want about Rick's misses but every GM has plenty of them. If you want to look at sketchy track record, go look at some of the drafts Bill Belichick has had as a GM. IMO, this team is in the same situation the Ravens were in with Flacco. They couldn't easily cleaned house after missing the playoffs 4 out of 5 years but that's not what the best organizations in the league do. They kept drafting well, got rid of Flacco, found a good/young QB, and now their back to being one of the best in the league again. The Vikings can do the same thing.
    2020 Vikings Draft:
    1: Justin Jefferson WR LSU
    1: Jeff Gladney CB TCU
    2: Ezra Cleveland OT Boise State
    3: Cameron Dantzler CB Mississippi State
    4: D.J. Wonnum DE South Carolina
    4: James Lynch DT Baylor
    4: Troy Dye LB Oregon
    5: Harrison Hand CB Temple
    5: K.J. Osborn WR Miami
    6: Blake Brandel OT Oregon State
    6: Josh Metellus S Michigan
    7: Kenny Willekes DE Michigan State
    7: Nate Stanley QB Iowa
    7: Brian Cole S Mississippi State
    7: Kyle Hinton G Washburn

  7. #82
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Richmond, VA
    Posts
    20,696
    Quote Originally Posted by vikingsfan0845 View Post
    I'm not firing Spielman over the Cousins decision. It was known Cousins struggled to win the game in Washington but at the same time it's easy to say that the Washington organization is a dumpster fire and it's hard for anyone to win there. If there is any position your going to take a risk on it's the QB position. And honestly, last year I started to think maybe it was paying off. The come back win over the Broncos and the playoff win in NO seemed like potential signs of things to come. Those games in the past Cousins would lose.

    Regardless of that, now is the time to move on. If we can find a team willing to trade for him then our cap problems are solved. But I'm still not going to fire a GM for taking a chance on a QB, especially when the overall results were pretty good. Are we still so quick to forget the successes we've had? This roster is as talented as it is because of Spielman's decisions. The Diggs trade and use of those draft picks alone is extremely impressive. Just from this draft class we've seen Jefferson look like a star, both corners have flashed from time to time, Wonnum has been playing more lately and looks good, Lynch is starting to carve out more playing time, and while Cleveland didn't look good against Jarrett, he finally got into the starting line up. And that is just this years class. Say what you want about Rick's misses but every GM has plenty of them. If you want to look at sketchy track record, go look at some of the drafts Bill Belichick has had as a GM. IMO, this team is in the same situation the Ravens were in with Flacco. They couldn't easily cleaned house after missing the playoffs 4 out of 5 years but that's not what the best organizations in the league do. They kept drafting well, got rid of Flacco, found a good/young QB, and now their back to being one of the best in the league again. The Vikings can do the same thing.
    But what about when the results have been bad? Sam Bradford, Christian Ponder and Josh Freeman come to mind.
    https://orig00.deviantart.net/1dc3/f/2018/078/e/e/cousins_by_matthew998-dc6cc8l.png

  8. #83
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Steubenville, Ohio
    Posts
    18,415
    Quote Originally Posted by VCU4LIFEGOVIKS View Post
    That wasn't my post but I believe the intent was what players did Zimmer coach up to be good that didn't necessarily have the talent/skills coming out of college. Rhodes, Waynes and Gladney were all first round talents with great skills coming out of college. Alexander was a second round pick who probably would have been drafted in the late first round had he not been injured during the Combine. Munnerlyn's best year was in 2013 with the Panthers before he came to the Vikings so I'm not sure if Zimmer really helped improve his play at the position.

    Just my two cents....
    From what I recall on Munnerlyn, in Carolina he had knack for making big plays (if I recall he a couple pick 6's) but he also would get burned for being too aggressive. I remember his first season here he got off to a rough start and I remember reading about he was free lancing a bit and didn't buy into Zimmer's scheme right away. After he bought in, he was one of PFF's highest graded slot corners while he was here.

    It's harder to find guy who were draft late because when the Vikings draft a corner it's usually high. But mid to late round picks still include Dantzler and Kearse. I'll throw in Robert Blanton, he was decent for a 5th round pick that was forced to start one season. Harris and Sendejo were undrafted.
    2020 Vikings Draft:
    1: Justin Jefferson WR LSU
    1: Jeff Gladney CB TCU
    2: Ezra Cleveland OT Boise State
    3: Cameron Dantzler CB Mississippi State
    4: D.J. Wonnum DE South Carolina
    4: James Lynch DT Baylor
    4: Troy Dye LB Oregon
    5: Harrison Hand CB Temple
    5: K.J. Osborn WR Miami
    6: Blake Brandel OT Oregon State
    6: Josh Metellus S Michigan
    7: Kenny Willekes DE Michigan State
    7: Nate Stanley QB Iowa
    7: Brian Cole S Mississippi State
    7: Kyle Hinton G Washburn

  9. #84
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Steubenville, Ohio
    Posts
    18,415
    Quote Originally Posted by VCU4LIFEGOVIKS View Post
    But what about when the results have been bad? Sam Bradford, Christian Ponder and Josh Freeman come to mind.
    Ponder was a miss but I'm not going to count Josh Freeman. That was a desperation move that cost the team nothing but 1 embarrassing MNF loss.

    Sam Bradford I think can be debated. Giving up a first round pick was too much (I remember hoping to get him for a 2nd) but it was that or start Shaun Hill on a team with playoff hopes. Who knows what could have happened if he stayed healthy after that great opening start against NO the following year. Bradford kinda falls in the same category as Teddy for me.

    But yes, to your point Rick absolutely is held accountable for missing on a QB more than once. He's an aggressive GM and that's going to lead to big hits and big misses. Overall, I think his track record shows more than enough successes to be trusted to right the ship.
    2020 Vikings Draft:
    1: Justin Jefferson WR LSU
    1: Jeff Gladney CB TCU
    2: Ezra Cleveland OT Boise State
    3: Cameron Dantzler CB Mississippi State
    4: D.J. Wonnum DE South Carolina
    4: James Lynch DT Baylor
    4: Troy Dye LB Oregon
    5: Harrison Hand CB Temple
    5: K.J. Osborn WR Miami
    6: Blake Brandel OT Oregon State
    6: Josh Metellus S Michigan
    7: Kenny Willekes DE Michigan State
    7: Nate Stanley QB Iowa
    7: Brian Cole S Mississippi State
    7: Kyle Hinton G Washburn

  10. #85
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    2,020
    Trade Kirk to the Browns. The Browns are looking at a win now moment and Kirk would be better than Baker and it works with him back with Stefanski. You eat the 20 million and we let Reiff, Harris, Yannick walk and possibly cut Barr and Rudy and roll with our new QB in 2021 and in 2022 we are back in business.

  11. #86
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    13,430
    I think most of can agree that we have a probably a top 10-12 coach/GM. I also can agree that sometimes you have to take a swing to get over that hump. But one thing I do believe is that they deserve a shot to turn things around (I'm talking finishing this year and coaching next).

    I've always thought that this year would be a soft rebuild. Meaning we would likely compete for a playoff spot but I did not expect anything more than that. Then you throw in Covid, No additional training for all those rookies, Pierce opting out, Hunter out, Barr out. The results have not been surprising on the defensive struggles. Up and downs.
    Kirks struggles are surprising a bit, in terms of the TO's. Some of them being aggressive and some have just been bad throws/decisions.

    You look at our roster next year and does anyone not believe that we can turn it around (given healthy)?

    Hunter, Pierce, 3T, Ideafi/Ngakoue
    Barr, Kendricks, Wilson
    Dantzler, Gladney, Hughes
    Smith, Harris?

    I think Harris will likely be gone as they'll prioritize resigning Ngakoue. Barr could be gone as cap causality.

    Offensively we'll have to still figure out some potential holes on the OL. Reiff has played outstanding this year but can we afford him? Still have guard issues so Bradbury and O'Neill are the only solid options at the moment.
    Rudy will be gone so Irv will take another step.

    My point is we have a lot of good pieces still.

  12. #87
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Steubenville, Ohio
    Posts
    18,415
    Quote Originally Posted by nessythegreat View Post
    Trade Kirk to the Browns. The Browns are looking at a win now moment and Kirk would be better than Baker and it works with him back with Stefanski. You eat the 20 million and we let Reiff, Harris, Yannick walk and possibly cut Barr and Rudy and roll with our new QB in 2021 and in 2022 we are back in business.
    Trading a high second round pick for Yannick and then letting him walk the following year is a bad move. If we can trade Cousins we should have plenty of room to sign him. The rest I agree with.
    2020 Vikings Draft:
    1: Justin Jefferson WR LSU
    1: Jeff Gladney CB TCU
    2: Ezra Cleveland OT Boise State
    3: Cameron Dantzler CB Mississippi State
    4: D.J. Wonnum DE South Carolina
    4: James Lynch DT Baylor
    4: Troy Dye LB Oregon
    5: Harrison Hand CB Temple
    5: K.J. Osborn WR Miami
    6: Blake Brandel OT Oregon State
    6: Josh Metellus S Michigan
    7: Kenny Willekes DE Michigan State
    7: Nate Stanley QB Iowa
    7: Brian Cole S Mississippi State
    7: Kyle Hinton G Washburn

  13. #88
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Steubenville, Ohio
    Posts
    18,415
    Quote Originally Posted by pacofunk64 View Post
    I think most of can agree that we have a probably a top 10-12 coach/GM. I also can agree that sometimes you have to take a swing to get over that hump. But one thing I do believe is that they deserve a shot to turn things around (I'm talking finishing this year and coaching next).

    I've always thought that this year would be a soft rebuild. Meaning we would likely compete for a playoff spot but I did not expect anything more than that. Then you throw in Covid, No additional training for all those rookies, Pierce opting out, Hunter out, Barr out. The results have not been surprising on the defensive struggles. Up and downs.
    Kirks struggles are surprising a bit, in terms of the TO's. Some of them being aggressive and some have just been bad throws/decisions.

    You look at our roster next year and does anyone not believe that we can turn it around (given healthy)?

    Hunter, Pierce, 3T, Ideafi/Ngakoue
    Barr, Kendricks, Wilson
    Dantzler, Gladney, Hughes
    Smith, Harris?

    I think Harris will likely be gone as they'll prioritize resigning Ngakoue. Barr could be gone as cap causality.

    Offensively we'll have to still figure out some potential holes on the OL. Reiff has played outstanding this year but can we afford him? Still have guard issues so Bradbury and O'Neill are the only solid options at the moment.
    Rudy will be gone so Irv will take another step.

    My point is we have a lot of good pieces still.
    Exactly. If we pick high enough to get one of Lawrence/Fields/Lance then that QB will have Cook, Thielen, Jefferson, and Irv Smith as his weapons. The OL still needs work but O'Neill and Bradbury are good young pieces and Cleveland maybe he can be good. A quick turnaround is possible.
    2020 Vikings Draft:
    1: Justin Jefferson WR LSU
    1: Jeff Gladney CB TCU
    2: Ezra Cleveland OT Boise State
    3: Cameron Dantzler CB Mississippi State
    4: D.J. Wonnum DE South Carolina
    4: James Lynch DT Baylor
    4: Troy Dye LB Oregon
    5: Harrison Hand CB Temple
    5: K.J. Osborn WR Miami
    6: Blake Brandel OT Oregon State
    6: Josh Metellus S Michigan
    7: Kenny Willekes DE Michigan State
    7: Nate Stanley QB Iowa
    7: Brian Cole S Mississippi State
    7: Kyle Hinton G Washburn

  14. #89
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    13,430
    Quote Originally Posted by vikingsfan0845 View Post
    Exactly. If we pick high enough to get one of Lawrence/Fields/Lance then that QB will have Cook, Thielen, Jefferson, and Irv Smith as his weapons. The OL still needs work but O'Neill and Bradbury are good young pieces and Cleveland maybe he can be good. A quick turnaround is possible.
    Well the biggest problem is Zim/Rick won't take a QB knowing they need to win (unless of course they end with the distinct possibility to land Fields or Lawrence). I'd be ok taking Lance later in the first perhaps. Figuring we are going to be in the top 8-10 spots I could see Rick trading down to recoup that second round pick he lost. There is DT and iOL that will likely be available when we pick that I would love to have as well. Hell J'Marr Chase lol. OMG him and JJ would be amazing....ok no can't do that but damn that would be fun.

  15. #90
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    My Shell
    Posts
    7,247
    We just need a franchise QB; I think that is painfully obvious at this point. If they pass up an opportunity because we have "Kirk" that should be an immediate fire imo.

Page 6 of 10 FirstFirst ... 45678 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •