Offseason

[castan_b]

I posted about this above and agree that would be crazy ugly. Essentially, we would have two Brauns on the team at that point next year...lol. I think it was after the Braun signing as well. :/



Who would be the 4M plus 4th liner? Not being sarcastic, but just wondering. I think our 4th line will be something like Raffl/Laughton/NAK next year.

G - Couts - TK
Lindblom - Hayes - Jake
Farabee - Patrick - JVR/Frost (depending on who is in the doghouse/injured at the time)
Raffl/Laughton/NAK

Also, on that note, Patrick signed his Qualifying Offer today so his cap hit is less than 900K I believe.

If JVR is on the 4th line, that is a 7m cap hit on the 4th line ... not good. I draw the line of players going down to the 4th line at 4m ... if they make more than that, they have to be traded and can’t be on the 4th line.

[koldjerky]

If JVR is on the 4th line, that is a 7m cap hit on the 4th line ... not good. I draw the line of players going down to the 4th line at 4m ... if they make more than that, they have to be traded and can’t be on the 4th line.

I think that’s silly logic. Of course you don’t want a high cap hit on the lowest line but if you can’t trade him why bump a player better than him out of the lineup or down a line since you’re going to have that cap hit regardless?

I don’t care if the 4th line was the most expensive line due to sunk costs, I want my best players where they should be. Not anchoring a line just because of a hit.

I agree though, a trade should be the first route.


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[LLMunchie619]

If JVR is on the 4th line, that is a 7m cap hit on the 4th line ... not good. I draw the line of players going down to the 4th line at 4m ... if they make more than that, they have to be traded and can’t be on the 4th line.

Okay, I get that, but wouldn't you rather have JVR there than Nate Thompson? Don't get me wrong, I would love to trade him, but if you have to keep him, get value where you can.

[castan_b]

Okay, I get that, but wouldn't you rather have JVR there than Nate Thompson? Don't get me wrong, I would love to trade him, but if you have to keep him, get value where you can.

JVR’s defense is atrocious and I’d rather have the cap flexibility ... Nate Thompson isn’t on the squad ... I’d rather have NAK, Raf, and Laughton (total of 5.5/6m combined cap hit) on the 4th line ... that is less than JVR makes generally ... good teams just don’t have those large cap hits on 4th lines.

[LLMunchie619]

JVR’s defense is atrocious and I’d rather have the cap flexibility ... Nate Thompson isn’t on the squad ... I’d rather have NAK, Raf, and Laughton (total of 5.5/6m combined cap hit) on the 4th line ... that is less than JVR makes generally ... good teams just don’t have those large cap hits on 4th lines.

I agree with that for the most part, but the other 11 forwards definitely create a "good team". That kind of blanket statement just is not accurate.

[CasperX22]

I swear if they waste their time trading for Demers so help me God...it's bad enough they resigned Braun after wasting assets on him. If Fletcher trades for him that is a fireable offense imo. Focus should be on acquiring another top 6 caliber center even if Patrick is ready to start the season. Hayes is not a good fit for other other skilled top 6 wingers.

[3iverson3]

i think patrick and frost is key to maximizing as much out of jvr as possible. I don't blame him for not being as effective when he plays with grant, Thompson, pitlick. Wtf are we expecting him to do? This year should be much better for him as our top 9 is stacked.

He can play with couts, hayes, Patrick/frost as center.

His other potential wing will be voracek, tk, farabee, frost, lindblom. Its a huge upgrade from the crap he was playing with and expecting to produce

[CasperX22]

i think patrick and frost is key to maximizing as much out of jvr as possible. I don't blame him for not being *** effective when he plays with grant, Thompson, pitlick. Wtf are we expecting him to do? This year should be much better for him as our top 9 is stacked.

He can play with couts, hayes, Patrick/frost as center.

His other potential wing will be voracek, tk, farabee, frost, lindblom. Its a huge upgrade from the crap he was playing with and expecting to produce

I'm not counting on Patrick playing like a top 9 center. I want to add another center to this roster. Let Patrick play the wing or center the 4th line.

[3iverson3]

I'm not counting on Patrick playing like a top 9 center. I want to add another center to this roster. Let Patrick play the wing or center the 4th line.

i want the 4th line to be raffl-laughton-nak though. I wouldn't mind Patrick and laughton flipping until he gets back into it though but we still have frost that can center too.

g-couts-tk
jvr-hayes-farabee
lindblom-frost/patrick-voracek
raffl-laughton-nak

I think lindblom and voracek can really help them defensively and make a great line. Jvr and farabee get hayes so that hayes doesn't negate tk/g/voraceks skill set. I don't know how we can incorporate Patrick AND frost in the top 9 though but they both need to be there (eventually)

[steagles]

I'm not counting on Patrick playing like a top 9 center. I want to add another center to this roster. Let Patrick play the wing or center the 4th line.

i've talked about moving patrick to the wing before, so i don't disagree with you entirely, but there are a few issues with what you're talking about:

1: patrick's biggest issue isn't his ability to play 3rd line center, it's his ability to play at all. as long as he can play, i'm not too worried about his ability to do the job capably.

2: long term, i still think the idea is worth considering.

3: there really isn't anyone available who we could bring in as a potential 3rd line center.

4: i don't think frost is a center, either, so that's not an option, imo.

5: that basically leaves laughton, i guess. meh.

[3iverson3]

i've talked about moving patrick to the wing before, so i don't disagree with you entirely, but there are a few issues with what you're talking about:

1: patrick's biggest issue isn't his ability to play 3rd line center, it's his ability to play at all. as long as he can play, i'm not too worried about his ability to do the job capably.

2: long term, i still think the idea is worth considering.

3: there really isn't anyone available who we could bring in as a potential 3rd line center.

4: i don't think frost is a center, either, so that's not an option, imo.

5: that basically leaves laughton, i guess. meh.

i disagree about frost not being a center. I think both Patrick and frost can do wing or center though. I definitely think frost is ready. Look what suzuki did. Suzuki ain't THAAAAT much better than frost. He is ahead of his development because Montreal gave him time and he used that in the playoffs to get even better. Frost can do that this year, I think. Could be wrong tho lol

[castan_b]

I think that’s silly logic. Of course you don’t want a high cap hit on the lowest line but if you can’t trade him why bump a player better than him out of the lineup or down a line since you’re going to have that cap hit regardless?

I don’t care if the 4th line was the most expensive line due to sunk costs, I want my best players where they should be. Not anchoring a line just because of a hit.

I agree though, a trade should be the first route.


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JVR has a particular skill set that he flourishes with offensively ... but that is only valuable if he has linemates that can allow him to be put in those positions ... 4th line will always be viewed as a defense-first line and typically match up again the other team’s 1st or 2nd line ... especially when playing an away game because of last change ... that is a part of hockey ... you’re not in control of the matchups in hockey... I don’t want JVR on the ice against Crosby, Barzal, etc. defensively and that would happen with high % if we stick him on the 4th line. It isn’t a winning strategy.

[LLMunchie619]

JVR has a particular skill set that he flourishes with offensively ... but that is only valuable if he has linemates that can allow him to be put in those positions ... 4th line will always be viewed as a defense-first line and typically match up again the other team’s 1st or 2nd line ... especially when playing an away game because of last change ... that is a part of hockey ... you’re not in control of the matchups in hockey... I don’t want JVR on the ice against Crosby, Barzal, etc. defensively and that would happen with high % if we stick him on the 4th line. It isn’t a winning strategy.

He was only on the 4th line in the hypothetical situation of Hoffman signing. Also, JVR being on the 4th line would not make us a team that is not good. That is simply a ridiculous statement. You know, a good way of keeping other teams from being in your defensive zone is to play in their side of the ice. A line of JvR, Laughton, and NAK or Raffl would be a 3rd line on most teams. It would also keep JvR in the lineup to take his place in front of the net on the 1st or 2nd PP.

[3iverson3]

i just don't understand some of the hate provorov gets. Yes, he isn't the best pp quarter back and I would love for ghost to get another try but crying for sanheim on it...i mean he hasn't really shown much on the pp too. Also, I don't understand how sanheims numbers being a little better than provorov makes him the future number 1 of this team. I just don't see it. If provorov and sanheims roles were switched, I think provorov would dominate and sanheim would struggle even more. Its not to say I don't like sanheim (love his game)

[CasperX22]

i've talked about moving patrick to the wing before, so i don't disagree with you entirely, but there are a few issues with what you're talking about:

1: patrick's biggest issue isn't his ability to play 3rd line center, it's his ability to play at all. as long as he can play, i'm not too worried about his ability to do the job capably.

2: long term, i still think the idea is worth considering.

3: there really isn't anyone available who we could bring in as a potential 3rd line center.

4: i don't think frost is a center, either, so that's not an option, imo.

5: that basically leaves laughton, i guess. meh.

Well we have a fundamental disagreement on what Patrick's ability actually is. At no point aside from brief flashes has he ever played above a replacement level player. Until he proves to me he is anything more than an overhyped 4th line center in going to continue to treat him as such.