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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by warfelg View Post
    My bigger issue is you're still hanging onto what could have been rather than what happened.
    That's kind of like saying, "I got into a severe car accident without wearing a seat belt but I didn't have a single bruise, so not wearing the seat belt was a solid decision."

    It's revisionist history to say it was a good trade for the Steelers because it's generally not a great move to make for a team that was trending towards a top 5 pick with a real question at QB due to age/injury.
    The Baker has come. Believe the hype.


  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiteWolf View Post
    and yet some in the media think Seattle won this trade......because it doesn't make the Jets better in 2020 and they'll have to use a premium pick to replace Adams......................like most trades involving only picks, time will tell...but whatever pick the Jets make, it'll be 2024 or so before a 1st rd pick costs them what Adams wants right now
    Why would they have to use a premium pick to replace a box safety. They drafted Davis in the 3rd to play FS and could just retain Maye to play Strong Safety.

    There's a huge economic component in play. After projecting what Adams might receive on a long-term extension, Jason Fitzgerald of Over the Cap noted, "The Jets will save about $47 million in cap space for one year of McDougald and 12 combined years of draft selections versus six years of Adams and four years of a fourth-round pick."


    "You don't know how to drink. Your whole generation, you drink for the wrong reasons. My generation, we drink because it's good, because it feels better than unbuttoning your collar, because we deserve it. We drink because it's what men do."

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThomasTomasz View Post
    And expect the going rate to be three first rounders for similar players the next time they go on the block.
    It might, or there will be a push not to trade and sign defensive players because it is an offensive league.


    "You don't know how to drink. Your whole generation, you drink for the wrong reasons. My generation, we drink because it's good, because it feels better than unbuttoning your collar, because we deserve it. We drink because it's what men do."

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThomasTomasz View Post
    I've seen the Redskins crash and burn trading picks for players and then overpaying them. That's why I would rather draft the players and give out the contract in free agency.

    The only time it really worked out for us was trading a first rounder for Laverneous Coles. Not because Coles really worked out well for us- he was above average- but because we traded Coles back to the Jets after two years for Santana Moss.
    Two things, Coles was signed as a restricted Free Agent with a 1st round tender, and eff ewe for bringing up that painful experience. Skins fans love to bring that up.


    "You don't know how to drink. Your whole generation, you drink for the wrong reasons. My generation, we drink because it's good, because it feels better than unbuttoning your collar, because we deserve it. We drink because it's what men do."

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vee-Rex View Post
    That's kind of like saying, "I got into a severe car accident without wearing a seat belt but I didn't have a single bruise, so not wearing the seat belt was a solid decision."

    It's revisionist history to say it was a good trade for the Steelers because it's generally not a great move to make for a team that was trending towards a top 5 pick with a real question at QB due to age/injury.
    I disagree with this thinking on it because thatís not a similar thing at all.

    Canít make revisionist history on trades at all because you need to see what happens before you call it good or bad. Just like draft grades, itís fun to look at it right away, wonít know the real result until years later.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by warfelg View Post
    I disagree with this thinking on it because thatís not a similar thing at all.

    Canít make revisionist history on trades at all because you need to see what happens before you call it good or bad. Just like draft grades, itís fun to look at it right away, wonít know the real result until years later.
    By this logic, if the Steelers trade their 2021 and 2022 first rounders for Josh Rosen today, you wouldn't call it bad? Never know, he could lead the Steelers to win 5 super bowls in the future.

    I know that's a wild example and I'm not comparing it to Minkah (who is a really good player), but I guess I don't agree with that logic.
    The Baker has come. Believe the hype.


  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vee-Rex View Post
    By this logic, if the Steelers trade their 2021 and 2022 first rounders for Josh Rosen today, you wouldn't call it bad? Never know, he could lead the Steelers to win 5 super bowls in the future.

    I know that's a wild example and I'm not comparing it to Minkah (who is a really good player), but I guess I don't agree with that logic.
    I mean, that's a really out there example. No team would make a trade that bad. But I am against saying it's a bad trade because we didn't know the terms at the time and were mostly guessing on what it would end up being.

    Who knows. What if Russell Wilson ends up missing 2020 and the Seahawks go 5-11, 5th pick goes to the Jets. Still looking at those 2 1sts the same?

  8. #53
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    "There were many GMs and coaches that I talked to over the weekend [about the Jamal Adams trade] ... and most, I'd say almost all, felt that the Jets fleeced the Seattle Seahawks."

    ó@diannaESPN


    "You don't know how to drink. Your whole generation, you drink for the wrong reasons. My generation, we drink because it's good, because it feels better than unbuttoning your collar, because we deserve it. We drink because it's what men do."

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Claymation View Post
    "There were many GMs and coaches that I talked to over the weekend [about the Jamal Adams trade] ... and most, I'd say almost all, felt that the Jets fleeced the Seattle Seahawks."

    ó@diannaESPN
    There are so many! Which is why I can't name a single one...
    Dak: 15,778 @ 65.8%, 7.6 per att, 97+21 TD, 36 INT+31 FMB, 97.0 Rate
    Wentz: 14,191 @ 63.8%, 6.9 per att, 97+3 TD, 35 INT+48 FMB, 92.7 Rate

    2020:
    Dak: 1188 @ 67.1%, 8.3 per att, 5 TD, 2 (1.4%) INT, 98.5 Rate 76.7 QBR
    Wentz: 737 @ 59.8%, 5.6 per att, 3 TD, 6 INT (4.5%), 63.9 Rate 35.5 QBR


    Quote Originally Posted by BDawk4Prez View Post
    I'll leave PSD if Foles isn't the starter in Jax (or elsewhere) next year.
    "Hater" is a term used by weak minded people in the face of legitimate criticism.
    -Scott van Pelt

  10. #55
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    They gave up a ton for a player who is seeking Top pass rusher money next year. Sad to see him go, but the jets got an absolute haul thereís no questioning that. Top it off the Seahawks were bidding against themselves.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


    #Hernandezing


    Quote Originally Posted by bwallstreet View Post
    haha delusional
    Someone underestimated the jets!

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by warfelg View Post
    I mean, that's a really out there example. No team would make a trade that bad. But I am against saying it's a bad trade because we didn't know the terms at the time and were mostly guessing on what it would end up being.

    Who knows. What if Russell Wilson ends up missing 2020 and the Seahawks go 5-11, 5th pick goes to the Jets. Still looking at those 2 1sts the same?
    Didnít know the terms but the probabilities were that the Steelers were going to pick close to a top 5 pick.
    Without having your QB of the future on your roster it was a stupid gamble.
    Sure itís not so bad now but the thinking process behind the deal was crazy.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullseyed View Post
    He has lined up more often as a DL than a S, he's got a similar look to Kam Chancellor.

    Adams



    Kam

    Isn't that where the safety position is headed in today's game though?

  13. #58
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    Look I get the hindsight argument but itís not complicated. You can grade out a trade contextually. Right now this trade was a bad trade for the Seahawks and great for the Jets. Letís say the Jets mess up their draft and gets scrubs. Well then the trade didnít work out well for them in the end but at the time the made it it was still a good trade. Letís say the Seahawks go to the Super Bowl and win off an Adams pick 6. Well the trade turned out well for them in the end but they still gave up more compensation then they needed to at the time they gave it up.

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrueFan420 View Post
    Look I get the hindsight argument but itís not complicated. You can grade out a trade contextually. Right now this trade was a bad trade for the Seahawks and great for the Jets. Letís say the Jets mess up their draft and gets scrubs. Well then the trade didnít work out well for them in the end but at the time the made it it was still a good trade. Letís say the Seahawks go to the Super Bowl and win off an Adams pick 6. Well the trade turned out well for them in the end but they still gave up more compensation then they needed to at the time they gave it up.
    I would disagree with that last part to an extent. I think grading the process is a valid exercise. But if adams pushes Seattle over the top, then the process isn't bad. They saw a guy they wanted and capaitalzed on it. I agree on the draft pick part. Who the Jets pick is less relevant because draft picks always are more of a hypothetical exercise. But when looking at the actual player, using highsight isn't a bad thing, particularly in the short term to see what that player does for the team. Overpaying isn't a bad thing if that player makes a major difference.

    To me, the trade is a win for the Jets already. Even if the Hawks win back to back super bowls and those are both pick 32, getting those picks for a guy who clearly wasn't the one guy to push them into even being a good team is a win. But from Seattle's perspective, I think it's still open. We don't know what adams will do to that defense. If he's a difference maker, then trading two picks for a difference maker might be worth it, even if they have to pay him a record deal.

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    I would disagree with that last part to an extent. I think grading the process is a valid exercise. But if adams pushes Seattle over the top, then the process isn't bad. They saw a guy they wanted and capaitalzed on it. I agree on the draft pick part. Who the Jets pick is less relevant because draft picks always are more of a hypothetical exercise. But when looking at the actual player, using highsight isn't a bad thing, particularly in the short term to see what that player does for the team. Overpaying isn't a bad thing if that player makes a major difference.

    To me, the trade is a win for the Jets already. Even if the Hawks win back to back super bowls and those are both pick 32, getting those picks for a guy who clearly wasn't the one guy to push them into even being a good team is a win. But from Seattle's perspective, I think it's still open. We don't know what adams will do to that defense. If he's a difference maker, then trading two picks for a difference maker might be worth it, even if they have to pay him a record deal.
    For me you hit much of the reason why you grade a trade in hindsight. Along with the fact of we just donít know what those picks will be. Like I said, Wilson could get a season ending injury in week one, Seattle gets a top 5 pick, and it goes to the Jets. Is that entirely fair to say Seattle shouldnít have done the trade? No. But it really makes the trade a win from the Jets standpoint. Thatís what happens when you trade for and unknown commodity (draft pick in the future) vs a known commodity (draft pick after the season or another player).

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