Reparations

[SiteWolf]

So the word reparations has been a sometimes spoken idea all our lives, whether talking about native americans or descendents of slaves. Now, in potentially the strongest push for blacks, it appears some things may actually happen. Reparations for natives in recent history has largely been in the form of housing being built on/near reservations and allowing tribes to open casinos.

Asheville, NC for example just voted as a city council to not just issue a formal apology, but open dialogue to determine whether and how to actually put a plan in place.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/karenro.../#3a66650e1694

Obviously, when you start hitting pocketbooks, there will be pushback from many. I, for example, am just the 2nd generation of my family born in the US, my grandparents coming over from Scandanavia 40 years after slavery ended. On the other end of things, if these reparations are intended strictly for descendents of slaves, how exactly would they determine that given the severe lack of records? With natives, they can determine who has at least a percentage of indigenous background.

So there would be a whole slew of questions, including but not limited to:
1.) Should reparations indeed happen?
2.) What form should reparations take?
3.) How should reparations be funded?
4.) Who should be allowed to participate?
5.) How will participants be determined?

Should reparations be actual checks? Housing? Tuition waivers? If checks, one time lump sums or ongoing payments? A combination of those and more?

For example, I'm not sure if it still goes on or not, but for years many basic ranch style houses were built in various developments as I said on or near reservations. However, I'm not sure how much that actually helps as, for whatever reason, those living in them don't..or can't...maintain them so it's far too often you'd see them with multiple junk cars parked around them, lawns not kept up, many windows broken out or boarded over, etc.

Thoughts?

[WES445]

Just treat us right. Improve our school, stop voter supression, support small business in these community, end the drug war thus taking money away from these gangs, medicare for all and ditto for native americans.

I prefer things that is long acting then cash.

[benny01]

Just treat us right. Improve our school, stop voter supression, support small business in these community, end the drug war thus taking money away from these gangs, medicare for all and ditto for native americans.

I prefer things that is long acting then cash.

Pretty much, that what's doable and can just be extended to everyone.

[Sluggo1]

1. No. But they will
2. Only thing that will shut people up is $$$$
3. It will be funded by Taxpayers.
4. Anyone who is not white will apply. Hispanics will have a reason as to why they deserve reparations.
5. Good luck with this. People will come out of the woodwork. People who got here last week will file claims. White people will claim some slave heritage in their blood and expect something (Sort of like Lizzie Warren being part Indian.)

And this will drive the country further apart.

And several years after reparations…the $$$ will be gone, nothing will have changed and something else will pop up.

[nastynice]

1. No. But they will
2. Only thing that will shut people up is $$$$
3. It will be funded by Taxpayers.
4. Anyone who is not white will apply. Hispanics will have a reason as to why they deserve reparations.
5. Good luck with this. People will come out of the woodwork. People who got here last week will file claims. White people will claim some slave heritage in their blood and expect something (Sort of like Lizzie Warren being part Indian.)

And this will drive the country further apart.

And several years after reparations…the $$$ will be gone, nothing will have changed and something else will pop up.

We just dropped $4.5 trillion to cover up Dumb *** Donald's mistake. I think a $4.5 trillion dollar reparations stimulus would be more than enough.

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[SiteWolf]

Just treat us right. Improve our school, stop voter supression, support small business in these community, end the drug war thus taking money away from these gangs, medicare for all and ditto for native americans.

I prefer things that is long acting then cash.

When I see things like 'provide reparations amounting to a $14trillion wealth transfer' I look at my bank account and think, umm, I'm having a hard enough time thinking I can ever retire.

That said, it's not that I'd have a problem with some reparations...but not all descendents today are in need of it and a lot of the rest of us had nothing to do with slavery. Then I look at the Greenwood District in Tulsa and the loss of possible generational wealth, etc, there, for example. But again, the people responsible aren't around to pay that bill.

What cash amount would even be viewed as enough? In 1980, the government set aside $102million in a trust for the Lakota as compensation for having had the Black Hills taken from them. That trust has grown to something like $1.3billion yet the tribe hasn't touched it. Meanwhile many of their people continue to live in poverty, but touching the money to them is like they've accepted sale of the land.

[SiteWolf]

We just dropped $4.5 trillion to cover up Dumb *** Donald's mistake. I think a $4.5 trillion dollar reparations stimulus would be more than enough.

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wait, what? You're going to put all that on POTUS? Regardless of how much you think he sucks, he didn't create the virus or the aftermath. You can say he mishandled it, but what the stim covered would have been needed anyway.........and it's Congress (all of 'em) that so stupidly put that package together that money went a ton of places it shouldn't have and never made it to places it should.

[nastynice]

wait, what? You're going to put all that on POTUS? Regardless of how much you think he sucks, he didn't create the virus or the aftermath. You can say he mishandled it, but what the stim covered would have been needed anyway.........and it's Congress (all of 'em) that so stupidly put that package together that money went a ton of places it shouldn't have and never made it to places it should.

If he made masks mandatory in February he wouldnt need any stimulus for anything.

It would have been a sticky situation no matter who was president, but Trump has just been beyond unbelievably bad. Hes the leader, hes the one the country needed to step up, of he stepped up it would have had a major impact on our country. But he didnt, he shrunk away and has been an active issue in this covid battle.

It's not all on him, you're right, but there is A LOT on him, and hes failed miserably on every level. Even opening the economy is something he cant seem to coordinate the country on. He was supposed to be the "business man president", he cant seem to manage this economy for jack ****.

I'm just as frustrated with democraat California state reopening. But at least they've been trying, they shut down just in time, phase 1 was good (although it started late imo) getting into phase 2 things started getting hurried. And phase 3 was just clearly unsustainable, I dont understand who made that call.

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[SiteWolf]

In February and March, virtually nobody knew whether masks would really help or not....and the CARES Act was at the end of March. Believe me, I'm not suggesting he's been anything but horrible through all this, I just can't put as much of the early part of this on him.....and as time wore on it was obvious to most we shouldn't be listening to him anyway, so not sure how much of the latter either.

Remember, too....states did their own thing as far as closing/mandates/reopening. It SHOULD have had more direction from the federal level, I agree....but states, even down to community level did their own things.

And really, you can't fix stupid....and a chunk of what's going on now has to do with a lot of stupid on individual levels- from packing beaches to having COVID parties...

[WES445]

When I see things like 'provide reparations amounting to a $14trillion wealth transfer' I look at my bank account and think, umm, I'm having a hard enough time thinking I can ever retire.

That said, it's not that I'd have a problem with some reparations...but not all descendents today are in need of it and a lot of the rest of us had nothing to do with slavery. Then I look at the Greenwood District in Tulsa and the loss of possible generational wealth, etc, there, for example. But again, the people responsible aren't around to pay that bill.

What cash amount would even be viewed as enough? In 1980, the government set aside $102million in a trust for the Lakota as compensation for having had the Black Hills taken from them. That trust has grown to something like $1.3billion yet the tribe hasn't touched it. Meanwhile many of their people continue to live in poverty, but touching the money to them is like they've accepted sale of the land.

I think that refusal is because of "The tribes say the payment is invalid because the land was never for sale and accepting the fund would be tantamount to a sales transaction" I think they want their land back. It is definitely better than the land they were moved to. It's a principle thing. Considering how the government is giving the oil industry free rein on their reservation at Standing Rock, I can understand it.

On Black reparations: I don't expect things that aren't going to happen. Just do right for all and equally.

Source PBS NewsHour: Why the Sioux are refusing $1.3 Billion.

[debo]

1. No. But they will
2. Only thing that will shut people up is $$$$
3. It will be funded by Taxpayers.
4. Anyone who is not white will apply. Hispanics will have a reason as to why they deserve reparations.
5. Good luck with this. People will come out of the woodwork. People who got here last week will file claims. White people will claim some slave heritage in their blood and expect something (Sort of like Lizzie Warren being part Indian.)

And this will drive the country further apart.

And several years after reparations…the $$$ will be gone, nothing will have changed and something else will pop up.

Would you be ok with it if we buy you a new stuffed monkey?

[nastynice]

In February and March, virtually nobody knew whether masks would really help or not....and the CARES Act was at the end of March. Believe me, I'm not suggesting he's been anything but horrible through all this, I just can't put as much of the early part of this on him.....and as time wore on it was obvious to most we shouldn't be listening to him anyway, so not sure how much of the latter either.

Remember, too....states did their own thing as far as closing/mandates/reopening. It SHOULD have had more direction from the federal level, I agree....but states, even down to community level did their own things.

And really, you can't fix stupid....and a chunk of what's going on now has to do with a lot of stupid on individual levels- from packing beaches to having COVID parties...

I think it's common sense that masks would help, I think the medical community would have unaninously agreed with me at that time. I also think that while it's hard to say exactly what the right course of action would have been, we know doing NOTHING was the absolutely worst possible approach to this virus. And that's exactly what hes done up to this point, so that's why I'm bashing the guy. Hes a complete and utter fail.

Yes states did their own thing and deserve some blame too, but they had to do their own thing cuz federal wasn't doing a damn thing. I blame states too tho, any state that opened and had to lock back down is absolutely stupid. That means we saw it play out in Wuhan, Iran, Italy, France, AND New York USA and still haven't got a damn clue about the behavior of this virus.

Yes you cant fix stupid but you can regulate it. Treat risky acting people like a drunk driver. Public threat. People will complain, yes, but their behavior will conform. Also, there has been zero attempts at informing the public by the govt.

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[SiteWolf]

hard to remember now, but at the end of March, the CDC was still only recommending the sick and those caring for the sick wear masks...it was April before that changed

yes I agree that more things should have been stipulated on a federal level, and certainly things like ppe should have been sourced and distributed on a federal level.....and Donnie has been stupidly stubborn..I'm just saying early on nobody seemed to know the right track, 20/20 hindsight is a tricky thing, and the CARES act would have been needed regardless, even tho it was carelessly implemented by Congress.

[nastynice]

hard to remember now, but at the end of March, the CDC was still only recommending the sick and those caring for the sick wear masks...it was April before that changed

yes I agree that more things should have been stipulated on a federal level, and certainly things like ppe should have been sourced and distributed on a federal level.....and Donnie has been stupidly stubborn..I'm just saying early on nobody seemed to know the right track, 20/20 hindsight is a tricky thing, and the CARES act would have been needed regardless, even tho it was carelessly implemented by Congress.

East Asia had no issue figuring out the right track.

I'll say this, the american education and medical system knows enough about viruses to have averted such high casualty numbers and an outbreak in NY. Trump played his role horrendously and it didnt help, but theres an issue with the system here. There seems to be an entire medical arm of government missing.

Everything that has happened has been easily predictable. Nothing has happened which is beyond the scope of what they teach medical and health care professionals in school.

Me mentioning masks is just an easy way to demonstrate how we could have easily spent $3billion dollars to buy every American a $10 mask and never had to shut down the economy and print $4 trillion. But it's not just as simple as masks, we should have actively been setting protocol for counties with cases since January, we should have been screening, tracking, and tracing travelers in and out of metros with cases, etc.

Wether it's on trump or the system, probably on both I dont know, but nothing that happened is stuff that we dont know. There is just no one in the White House who has studied this who is setting protocol. That's the issue.

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[brett05]

So there would be a whole slew of questions, including but not limited to:
1.) Should reparations indeed happen?
**** No there should not be reparations. None alive today suffered from slavery, none alive today have slaves or had them in the past.
2.) What form should reparations take?
**** None should take since none suffered or benefited from Slavery.
3.) How should reparations be funded?
**** It can't be funded.
4.) Who should be allowed to participate?
**** Those that were slaves or owned slaves which would be none at this point
5.) How will participants be determined?
**** See answer to #4


The truth of the matter it was multiple races that were responsible for slavery in America, especially if you go back to those that were supplying the labor.

It's an ugly part of history but it's time to move on.

Treat everyone equally and fairly. Plain and simple.