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  1. #436
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    Quote Originally Posted by R. Johnson#3 View Post
    I want Kay to be first in the pecking order to have a start. He's got too much junk to be used out of the pen.
    I'm guessing they will need a platoon of Kay/Merryweather to get through 6-9 innings. Both can give at least 3 innings on a good day but aren't ready to go 5 on their own. Would also help mess up with line ups with the power righty and a mid lefty. Just please no Wags...

  2. #437
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chaotic98 View Post
    I'm guessing they will need a platoon of Kay/Merryweather to get through 6-9 innings. Both can give at least 3 innings on a good day but aren't ready to go 5 on their own. Would also help mess up with line ups with the power righty and a mid lefty. Just please no Wags...
    Agreed. Wags is trash.

    Kay and merryweather should be able to get through a lineup once.

  3. #438
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Agreed. Wags is trash.

    Kay and merryweather should be able to get through a lineup once.
    lol. I don't know what he is (starter, middling reliever...etc) and he does have some wicked movement on his pitches.

  4. #439
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanton View Post
    lol. I don't know what he is (starter, middling reliever...etc) and he does have some wicked movement on his pitches.
    Looks like a guy that will be out of the league after the jays give him his charity service time for being less than horrible last season.

  5. #440
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    Defense!! lol

    couple of nice plays

  6. #441
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike_noodles View Post
    He always had that 2-3 week stretch on fire didn't he?
    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    The ghost of pillar also haunts me when I try to be optimistic about grich any teoscar. I really had hope in pillar every year. He was my under the radar prospect that I loved all the way through the system.
    Thing is with the defense he played the hitting stats were fine. I've said this before - If Hernandez or Grichuk could play CF defense like Pillar then they'd be a terrific player. Kevin Kiermaier is so valuable to the Rays team because of GG caliber defense - Pillar was a slight tier below.

  7. #442
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chaotic98 View Post
    Don't forget JP also hired AA as his assistant GM, so giving him credit is a no brainer, as they had a great relationship (next to Beeston of course).

    Ash signed Clemens when no one else was going to give him what we did in term length or money based on his previous 2-3 years in Boston. If Boston could let him go you knew something was wrong with his career trajectory (luckily for us [I guess] he started using roids). Let's not forget he had difficulty signing free agents (outside of Clemens I cant think of another name FA), had a way of trading their best players for 3-5 prospects who never panned out (Cone, Clemens, Wells trade and typically with the Yankees) also traded a certain Michael Young for Loaiza...

    Ash usually got hosed in deals, his inability to sign decent/top FA's is why I deem him a poor GM.
    If you were keeping Ash it would be more in the scouting or drafting dept. Wouldn't want him touching trades or contracts. Looks like he's done well for himself as he's now the VP of Baseball Projects for the Brewers - not sure if he's their Asst GM or not.

  8. #443
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chaotic98 View Post
    As a team the Angel's had 717 RS 8 short of league ave, 50 runs short of 6th in the league. Which over 162 games a year is .31 runs per game. In ave, they were 9th in the MLB, in Ks, they were the best in the league under the next best by over 100Ks. Were 10th in the MLB in 2Bs, but 25th in HRs that year. Even with the MVP Trout. Why do I mention all these stats...

    Their offense will always be futile in that park as it is was one of the most pitcher friendly parks in the MLB and they play 9-10 road games in Seattle and Oakland, which were extreme pitcher parks. You put that team in Coors, Trout probably has a few .400 ave seasons with a bunch of 50-60HRs maybe a 70HR year.

    I mention the pitching because if they were even MLB ave, they make the playoff as both he and Pujols have over 250 RBIs between them. Yet as a team, their ERA was 20th in the MLB, last in Ks, 5th in hits allowed, 12th in RA 13th in BBs, all in a pitchers park. They would have made the playoffs if not for their pitching.

    Yet Trout won MVP, while batting third with a team that finished 4th in their division. Back to Vlad. If he were hitting like Trout (or how Vlad should be based on his trajectory) with this current Jays Pitching (more so their pen) and their hitting, they would have won many more games, especially since he was penciled in to be their 3rd or 4th hitter. So to blame him, for the team's hitting inefficiencies falls mostly on his large shoulders, due to his high expectations that he created with his bat. He is (hopefully still) a franchise player like Trout, not the Gurriels, Jansens, Grich, Hernandez, Shaw, Paniks, Tellez, on this team who are all expendable. And yet, Grich, Teo, Tellez and Panik are either currently hitting their expectations or surpassing them to keep us in the WC hunt.

    I don't care much for Grich or Theo (outside or Biggio, Bichette, Vlad, Ryu, Pearson most of their pitchers in the pen Romano, Bass, Borucki, Mayweather, Kay) they are either expendable or complimentary cast in the current MLB roster. I don't think that either Grich or Hernandez can keep this up, but the fear is, I didn't think that way about JB or EE until they did it in back to back years (and even then I wondered cause Tony Batista did that in 2 seasons).

    I worry about Vlad's BB/K, because its often about his pitch recognition as he tend to swing at almost all first pitches, be it a strike or outside which often leads to him being in an 0-1 count. Starting an at bat 0-1 or 0-2 is much different in the pitches you get being 1-0, 2-0 or even 1-1. That's why Cavan has a high OBP (though he has been hitting better this year) and WAR (whereas Vlad has a -0.1 war and a 1.4 career WAR) and why Grich has been successful thus far (I feel he will be jinxed from this point on).

    Honestly, I get the homerism and hope in Vlad. I want him to start bashing to praise him daily. However, when your franchise player, your power hitting clean up hitter is struggling and has to be dropped to 6th, who else should take the brunt of the offenses problem? He should be our Trout or Tatis, not our C.J. Cron or Eric Hosmer.
    All you had to do was mention park factors and I don't buy the argument regarding the playoffs because the opposing team has to deal with that park as well. If there is a finger to point then point it at the Angles FO for not putting players together that can take advantage of that park (like the Yankees do).

    In regards to Vlad, take a look at Tatis, Acuna, and even Sano. All players are the same age as Vlad except look at who else they have in their lineup. Tatis has Machado, Acuna has Freeman, Sano has Cruz. Who does Vlad have in the lineup that compares to Machado, Freeman, and Cruz? Grichuk? Hernandez? I believe there was an article written on sportsnet or thefan that Vlad is going to be pitched the toughest and is pitched the toughest because he is considered the Jays best hitter. Remember Wells drop-off after Delgado left? Do you think it's a coincidence that Trout struggled in 2011 and took off in 2012 when Pujols joined the Angels? And sure you can make the argument that Bichette has no problems, but then the same argument can be made that Bichette isn't the main focus of the lineup like Vlad is and why Bichette is fine.

    I still don't understand why Vlad's BB/K ratio is a worry. As I've said compare it to Grichuk and Hernandez and you'll see a world of difference. I've already mentioned that Grichuk and Hernandez are in the bottom fifth or sixth in the entire league, without looking Vlad is closer to the middle so I'm not sure compared to these stats how Vlad's BB/K ratios are a problem when the stats say otherwise.

    If this FO is waiting for Vlad to take off while supporting him with a veteran like Grichuk this FO has major MAJOR problems. I'll reiterate it again if the Jays bring in a good solid veteran like Nelson Cruz or JD Martinez and a good contact hitter like Markakis or Cast this offense will take off.

    No one is gonna jinx Grichuk, he's just a bad player as evidence by his poor BB/K ratio. Think 126 out of 136 qualified players.

  9. #444
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    Grichuk's BB/K ratio is better than Javy Baez so I guess Javy Baez really sucks.

    As for Vlad, it looks like he swings at middle and high on first pitch but doesn't really chase low. He's been doing much better over the past week though. He just needs to get the XBH's going and then he can be slotted 3 or 4.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Facts can be hypothetical.

  10. #445
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    Quote Originally Posted by R. Johnson#3 View Post
    Grichuk's BB/K ratio is better than Javy Baez so I guess Javy Baez really sucks.

    As for Vlad, it looks like he swings at middle and high on first pitch but doesn't really chase low. He's been doing much better over the past week though. He just needs to get the XBH's going and then he can be slotted 3 or 4.
    Baezís defence is a big part of what makes him a top player.

  11. #446
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Baezís defence is a big part of what makes him a top player.
    I was being facetious. Judging a free swinging player like Baez based on their BB/K ratio would be like judging Kyle Lowry based on his shot blocking. Not really a stat indicative of the players skills. Same goes for Grichuk although he's clearly nowhere near Baez's level.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Facts can be hypothetical.

  12. #447
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    Hopefully Jays take care of business vs Boston.
    Anderson needs to show up today and give this team some needed innings. 6 IP's and less than 3 runs.

    Anderson vs (lefty no name) Kyle Hart

    Biggio batting 8th (?) hope not

  13. #448
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    Quote Originally Posted by FLeays View Post
    All you had to do was mention park factors and I don't buy the argument regarding the playoffs because the opposing team has to deal with that park as well. If there is a finger to point then point it at the Angles FO for not putting players together that can take advantage of that park (like the Yankees do).

    In regards to Vlad, take a look at Tatis, Acuna, and even Sano. All players are the same age as Vlad except look at who else they have in their lineup. Tatis has Machado, Acuna has Freeman, Sano has Cruz. Who does Vlad have in the lineup that compares to Machado, Freeman, and Cruz? Grichuk? Hernandez? I believe there was an article written on sportsnet or thefan that Vlad is going to be pitched the toughest and is pitched the toughest because he is considered the Jays best hitter. Remember Wells drop-off after Delgado left? Do you think it's a coincidence that Trout struggled in 2011 and took off in 2012 when Pujols joined the Angels? And sure you can make the argument that Bichette has no problems, but then the same argument can be made that Bichette isn't the main focus of the lineup like Vlad is and why Bichette is fine.

    I still don't understand why Vlad's BB/K ratio is a worry. As I've said compare it to Grichuk and Hernandez and you'll see a world of difference. I've already mentioned that Grichuk and Hernandez are in the bottom fifth or sixth in the entire league, without looking Vlad is closer to the middle so I'm not sure compared to these stats how Vlad's BB/K ratios are a problem when the stats say otherwise.

    If this FO is waiting for Vlad to take off while supporting him with a veteran like Grichuk this FO has major MAJOR problems. I'll reiterate it again if the Jays bring in a good solid veteran like Nelson Cruz or JD Martinez and a good contact hitter like Markakis or Cast this offense will take off.

    No one is gonna jinx Grichuk, he's just a bad player as evidence by his poor BB/K ratio. Think 126 out of 136 qualified players.
    Park factors have a lot to do with a hitter's or pitcher's stats, as to where they play most of their home or road games. Ex. a 38 year old knuckle baller can win a Cy Young pitching in Shea or get absolutely thrashed playing at Rogers or vs the AL East or Rockies hitters struggling out of Coors.

    I can agree that having protection for Vlad might increase his stats, but it might not. The way hes swinging at first pitches, has about 60% ground ball rate and is striking out more than walking and has a high SO rate with a low HR rate (typically high SO rate = high HR rate).

    Comparing his BB/K rate to Grich or Teo is pointless, as I've mentioned, as neither had Vlad's skill or pedigree coming up through the minors. That's like comparing Vlad's ability to steal bases with Tatis Jr. Vlad's hitting comparables are akin to a Trout, Pujols, Tatis Jr not a Grich or a Teo, both of which are out performing him on O and D.

    Right now this is a poor D team, in CF, RF and 1b. We seem to have 4 DHs on this roster after Vogel

  14. #449
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  15. #450
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanton View Post
    There will be minimal D at 3b, 1b, CF, RF. The pitchers better hope they can get hitters to hit it to SS, 2B, LF or pop up to the C or P.

    On the flip side, I'm picturing Groshans and Martin at 3b and CF respectively now.

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