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  1. #211
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanton View Post
    Today is Ryu's 3rd start as a Jay. He needs to be dominant

    6 IP
    7 K's
    2 Hits
    2 BB
    1 Run


    Hopefully Montoyo goes with the same batting order - want to see some consistency.
    Bass, Romano as the high leverage guys out of the pen
    Borucki, Kay as the bridge to the 8th or can even be used if Bass and Romano are not available.
    Don't want to see Drury or Fisher at all unless absolutely necessary.

    Jays currently sit 27th overall in hitting. Orioles (yes the O's), Yankees are top 5 in the league. As one Yogi Berra used to say "Its getting late early”.
    hanton has a time machine. Nice call.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Facts can be hypothetical.

  2. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by FLeays View Post
    Can't give respect because we still have no idea what Pearson, Martin, and Groshans are. Could, would, should, blah. Thought Wormoth and Zeuch were supposed to be something. Now we're acting like Pearson, Martin, and Groshans are the equivalent to Keuchel, Springer, and Correa when they haven't even made it to the big leagues for crying out loud!!! Speaking of Groshans I can't find him in any top 50 prospect ranking. And thinking a 19 year who never played in Dunedien as "ready to go" is extremely bullish. Pearson could be Halladay or he can be Drabek or Appel, Martin could be Bregman/Correa or he can be Aiken/Bubba Starling. Ditto for Manoah and SWR.
    Do we even know if Groshans could play both side of the ball?

    I also never said the Jays don't have top specs I said they didn't have much farm depth at the mid/higher levels beyond Vlad and Bichette. One blue chip pitcher at AA/AAA is not depth. Look at the Dbacks, White Sox, Tigers, Dodgers, Rays, Braves, Padres and Twins farm - that's depth compared to the Jays farm. And before we whine about Vlad and Bichette not being in the farm again consider that the White Sox, Padres, Braves, and Dodgers all graduated some great prospects and still have solid prospects compared to the Jays.

    Also graduating talents like Hernandez, Biggio, Jansen, Mcguire, Tellez, Alford and proclaiming that is a "wave" of talent is asinine. They haven't done anything at the big leagues. Could they be great? Sure. Could they end up like Travis Snider? That's a possibility too. Just because they are Blue Jays prospects does not automatically mean they will pan out and I'm not seeing the talent just yet. The large amount of prospects turning out to be good in The Show like the Yankees of the 90's and the Astros prospects of today that worked doesn't happen very often. We can hope for a FO like the Dodgers or Rays where you get consistently good ball players but I'm not seeing that yet.
    Even I would say you’re being a little extreme in parts here. But I also agree that this many years in, and inheriting a team full of assets (and according the reed the best drafting and developing in the league haha haha) they should have an absolutely monster farm. Definitely disappointing to see a middling farm when the plan is to build from within and somehow compete with the Yankees.

  3. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Even I would say you’re being a little extreme in parts here. But I also agree that this many years in, and inheriting a team full of assets (and according the reed the best drafting and developing in the league haha haha) they should have an absolutely monster farm. Definitely disappointing to see a middling farm when the plan is to build from within and somehow compete with the Yankees.
    They’ve already shown willingness to spend money. I don’t know why you seem insinuate they have said they will only try to compete with drafted and developed talent. We just barely reached the point where you want to start adding through that route, and they did it. A lot. Remind me how much they added last off season between Ryu, Anderson, Gooch and Roarke?

  4. #214
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    Dec 2009
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    How worried should we be about Vladdy?

  5. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by LechWalesa View Post
    How worried should we be about Vladdy?
    I'd say a lot unless he changes his habits, plate approach and mentality if he want to be what he could be. Offensively he could be prime Joey Bats or better. Defensively he could still be a solid 3b OR 1B or at worse, will be a career DH.

    He needs to change his diet or consider gastric bypass surgery. He needs to run more and hit the weights regularly. He needs to change his swing, as he drives the ball on the ground way too much. Needs to stop thinking he can crush any pitch (especially outside the strike zone) with his current swing/stance.

    He's still young and can turn it around to be a top offensive player, but he needs to want it. I am not seeing his effort/attitude aim for those goals over the past 2 years.

  6. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chaotic98 View Post
    I'd say a lot unless he changes his habits, plate approach and mentality if he want to be what he could be. Offensively he could be prime Joey Bats or better. Defensively he could still be a solid 3b OR 1B or at worse, will be a career DH.

    He needs to change his diet or consider gastric bypass surgery. He needs to run more and hit the weights regularly. He needs to change his swing, as he drives the ball on the ground way too much. Needs to stop thinking he can crush any pitch (especially outside the strike zone) with his current swing/stance.

    He's still young and can turn it around to be a top offensive player, but he needs to want it. I am not seeing his effort/attitude aim for those goals over the past 2 years.
    I'd say defence shouldn't even be on his radar right now because he looks awful at the plate. This kid needs to spend 100% of his time on hitting. He consistently gets behind in counts and then ends up grounding out or flying out on pitches that are belt high. He's also swinging right through first pitch strikes a lot.

    Simply put, he looks completely lost at the plate. I'm starting to think this is the first time he's really ever been challenged at baseball. I agree with the part that I bolded too. IIRC this past off-season was the first ever off-season where he was actually working out. I think he's just being served a much needed slice of humble pie.
    Last edited by R. Johnson#3; 08-12-2020 at 08:37 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Facts can be hypothetical.

  7. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by R. Johnson#3 View Post
    hanton has a time machine. Nice call.
    haha. I was bang on. Too bad they couldn't hold it for him but at least we got the walk-off. I'm not the biggest Shaw fan so good to see him contributing

  8. #218
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanton View Post
    haha. I was bang on. Too bad they couldn't hold it for him but at least we got the walk-off. I'm not the biggest Shaw fan so good to see him contributing
    Yeah he looked so happy when he finally got some run support. I was tuning in and out last night and from what I saw Ryu looked like an ace. Take that HR away and it's basically a spotless outing.

    I see Shaw as nothing more than a placeholder but there is a positive about him. If he ends up having a good year then we can keep him around because he has 1 more year of arb. He's not ideal but as a placeholder for Groshans with contract flexibility? I'm fine with him.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Facts can be hypothetical.

  9. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by LechWalesa View Post
    How worried should we be about Vladdy?
    I go back and forth on this, I think he will be alright. My guess is they've left him alone for the most part, have him try and figure it out. I watched alot of his winter workout videos and he was working very hard (including a workout on a sandy beach - sweating buckets) however working hard doesn't always equate to results I know because I lived it and seen it in kids his age. His lower half needs alot of work, he's relying on too much upper body which leads to a lazy type of swing. Pitchers bust him low with fastballs and he just rolls it over.

    The Jays have all the resources to help him but he also needs to be willing to put in the work. Fortunately the shortened season works to his advantage - imagine having to watch him struggle like this over 162 games. One other thing, I really hope this FO are patient with him and understand that he comes from a different background, different culture.

  10. #220
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    Let's see what Pearson has in store for us today, so far he's gotten by with 2 pitches, FB(51%) and slider(36%). Want to see more of his change-up (8%).

  11. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenny Powders View Post
    You were the one who said we have no talent above A ball. I just simply pointed out that we did. You can take that as you wish but this conversation has run it's course for me.

    Also, I think you're highly underestimating Martin. He was arguably the best player in a stacked draft class.
    The only thing I'm trying to point out about Martin is that he's not a surefire major league.

  12. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by LechWalesa View Post
    How worried should we be about Vladdy?
    If Vlad has better hitters around him he'll get better. Pitchers are pitching him tough. Give it another season or two.

  13. #223
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Even I would say you’re being a little extreme in parts here. But I also agree that this many years in, and inheriting a team full of assets (and according the reed the best drafting and developing in the league haha haha) they should have an absolutely monster farm. Definitely disappointing to see a middling farm when the plan is to build from within and somehow compete with the Yankees.
    Probably being as extreme as someone assuming that all the guys are going to work out. Unfortunately it's still going to be a couple more years to see how this plan really pans out (it took Gillick 6 years to win 89 games). My concern is the service time wasted on Vlad, Bichette, and maybe Pearson if the legit prospects take longer to make the jump.

  14. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by FLeays View Post
    Probably being as extreme as someone assuming that all the guys are going to work out. Unfortunately it's still going to be a couple more years to see how this plan really pans out (it took Gillick 6 years to win 89 games). My concern is the service time wasted on Vlad, Bichette, and maybe Pearson if the legit prospects take longer to make the jump.
    This is exactly what I have been saying for years now. I agree.

  15. #225
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanton View Post
    Let's see what Pearson has in store for us today, so far he's gotten by with 2 pitches, FB(51%) and slider(36%). Want to see more of his change-up (8%).
    If the 1st inning tells us anything it's that every single batter is looking for his fastball.
    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Facts can be hypothetical.

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