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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    What do you mean did he let Nash run the show??? Nash hardly played cause he was injured. Did you not watch any basketball at all during this time?? What kind of question is that??? Kobe only really had two seasons of being relatively healthy and being able to do whatever he wanted and that was in 06 ad 07. In 05 he played the entire season hurt. Before and after those seasons he was on solid teams that had a shot to make a deep run and yes, his numbers definitely were much lower in these latter seasons than in 06 and 07.
    Nash played 50 games the first season and things were so bad mike could not wait to get Nash suit up.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by ldawg View Post
    Nash played 50 games the first season and things were so bad mike could not wait to get Nash suit up.
    So he missed over 30 games??? He was playing hurt the entire time. He said as much. He had nerve damage and it caused him severe pain. Sheesh dude, you just spew nonsense. I really dont think you watched any of these games. Either that or you have some kind of memory condition. I also don't know what you mean by things got so bad that mike couldn't wait to have Steve suit up. Nash was overall pretty bad.

  3. #63
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    Your claim is Lebron holds the ball and run out the shot clock. How is that inflation if you claim at that point heís not being productive with the ball. Should inflation not take place when you speed up the tempo like say GSW take more shots get more rebounds assist, etc? Again all these things are not created equal. You canít look at one star and look at the next and say his style you canít win with or numbers inflated. All players have inflated numbers. Their skills is the key. How that player performs doing those tasks. Itís a sentiment to their abilities.
    Last edited by ldawg; 07-09-2020 at 07:30 PM.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    So he missed over 30 games??? He was playing hurt the entire time. He said as much. He had nerve damage and it caused him severe pain. Sheesh dude, you just spew nonsense. I really dont think you watched any of these games. Either that or you have some kind of memory condition. I also don't know what you mean by things got so bad that mike couldn't wait to have Steve suit up. Nash was overall pretty bad.
    My point dude is no point guard hurt or not was not coming to La with kobe handing over the keys. So to say he never had a top pg with the sample we do have that was not going to happen. I think everyone knows that.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by ldawg View Post
    Your claim is Lebron holds the ball and run out the shot clock. How is that inflation if you claim at that point heís not being productive with the ball. Should inflation not take place when you speed up the tempo like say GSW take more shots get more rebounds assis, etc? Again all these things are not created equal. You canít look at one star and look at the next and say his style you canít win with or numbers inflated. All players have inflated numbers.
    It doesnt seem that you know what inflation actually means. Stars have inflated numbers compared to non-stars, but some stars have MORE inflation than others. Not that hard to understand and again, completely irrelevant to this thread

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by ldawg View Post
    My point dude is no point guard hurt or not was not coming to La with kobe handing over the keys. So to say he never had a top pg with the sample we do have that was not going to happen. I think everyone knows that.
    Kobe didnt really dominate the ball. That wasnt really Kobes game. He would do it in spurts and in certain moments, but that wasnt how he played. And it's factually true that he never had a top pg in his career. So again, not really sure what you're saying. Payton was no longer a star and the triangle didnt allow him to be a true pg. Nash was injured and was basically done being a decent player. We have a sample of 0 lol

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    It doesnt seem that you know what inflation actually means. Stars have inflated numbers compared to non-stars, but some stars have MORE inflation than others. Not that hard to understand and again, completely irrelevant to this thread
    Dude itís common sense but itís a sentiment to their abilities. Shooting more at a low percentage vs someone with a higher percentage when both avg 20ppg. Ex one player take more shots to get to 20 his numbers are inflated to the number of shots he takes not how long he has the ball.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    Kobe didnt really dominate the ball. That wasnt really Kobes game. He would do it in spurts and in certain moments, but that wasnt how he played. And it's factually true that he never had a top pg in his career. So again, not really sure what you're saying. Payton was no longer a star and the triangle didnt allow him to be a true pg. Nash was injured and was basically done being a decent player. We have a sample of 0 lol
    No in the triangle he did not but it was in his style to play 1 on 1 itís was his style to you canít guard me. Give me the ball let me show you. He was not the pass it around type.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by ldawg View Post
    Dude itís common sense but itís a sentiment to their abilities. Shooting more at a low percentage vs someone with a higher percentage when both avg 20ppg. Ex one player take more shots to get to 20 his numbers are inflated to the number of shots he takes not how long he has the ball.
    Same deal with assists dude. If one player has the ball more and passes more theyre going to have more assists. Meaning that this player's assists will be inflated. They both shot it about the same, but LBJ dominated the ball more and made more passes, hence he will have inflated assists relative to kobe. Again though, this has all been covered many times over and is not what this thread is about and im really not sure why youre bringing this up here or now.

    All I said was that kobe wasnt as ball dominant as some of you guys were making him out to be and that he would work jsut fine with CP3. Kobe was actually an amazing player off the ball. Not as good as MJ, but he was really good off the ball nonetheless. With CP3, who is a pass first pg, he would've looked to get kobe the ball in prime positions to score and kobe would've likely further cultivated is off the ball game. It would've likely led to kobe scoring with greater ease than at any other time in his career.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by ldawg View Post
    No in the triangle he did not but it was in his style to play 1 on 1 itís was his style to you canít guard me. Give me the ball let me show you. He was not the pass it around type.
    Nah, not really dude. That was 19 year old kobe, sure. That wasnt 2012 kobe, which is who cp3 would've been playing with. 2012 kobe knew how to win and would've likely easily adjusted. If the trade goes down, it likely lengthens Kobe's career by a few years and probably leads to 1-2 more titles.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    Same deal with assists dude. If one player has the ball more and passes more theyre going to have more assists. Meaning that this player's assists will be inflated. They both shot it about the same, but LBJ dominated the ball more and made more passes, hence he will have inflated assists relative to kobe. Again though, this has all been covered many times over and is not what this thread is about and im really not sure why youre bringing this up here or now.

    All I said was that kobe wasnt as ball dominant as some of you guys were making him out to be and that he would work jsut fine with CP3. Kobe was actually an amazing player off the ball. Not as good as MJ, but he was really good off the ball nonetheless. With CP3, who is a pass first pg, he would've looked to get kobe the ball in prime positions to score and kobe would've likely further cultivated is off the ball game. It would've likely led to kobe scoring with greater ease than at any other time in his career.
    I look at it different i wont call it inflation sure it goes up but to me it tells ones ability. One will not say A player vs B player get more assist or rebounds because hes on the floor more or have the ball more. A player just have a better sense of where to be for rebounds or hes taller so even with the same minutes the numbers would reflect that. To me that is not inflation but ones ability. Assist Shooting iMO is the same. Lets say Lebron stats are inflated since he has the green light My question is why he never took advantage of it and shoot a whole lot more why he never gunned for Kobe 81 when he have the green light? Why not go for Wilt 100? Thing is he is more likly to pass in certain situations not inflation. I would call inflation when you have a goal to reach and you get there even if you have to over pass, over shoot, steal your teammate rebound etc. But if you are just playing within you abilty and talents to me that is not infalted numbers that is your talents talking. Thats like saying MJ stats is inflated to that of Pippen. NO MJ was just flat out better not inflated. Thats like saying Magic got more assist because he pass more or Curry have a higher percentage because he shot more, or Shaq dunk more because hes on the floor more. These are not inflaton.

    Antwan Walker was inflation. A player posting inefficient numbers while scoring like a star clearly playing outside his ability.

    Players with the same opportunity will not perform the same thus making it not an inflation but a reflection of one skills and ability. Rondo wont play like Kobe and Kobe wont play like Rondo with the same minutes and touches.

    And i said he will work fine with Kobe because he can shoot. Meaning if you play with a superstar like Kobe you will have the ball less than you did. In short Would Kobe let Rhondo be Rondo playing with him and KG or was kobe going to take over? I just do not see Kobe doing that. Not a rookie(boy) with no experience on top of that If you Watch Kobe as much as you said you will have an idea of his personality and traits. get in position for the rebound.
    Last edited by ldawg; 07-09-2020 at 10:50 PM.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    The triangle doesnt really have a true pg though and that's why Payton didnt really fit. I agree that he should've probably come off the bench, but that was on Phil.
    Payton didn't fit because his athleticism had waned and he played behind 3 guys. peak payton would've been great in the triangle as one of the actual post options. I know Phil wanted the truest PG to run his offense when he wanted to ship Kobe off. really wish we could see that timeline of events transpire.

    I wanted to look at Kobe's numbers over the years playing with and without a more ball dominant, traditional PG. just wanted to see the results but Shaq prolly plays the biggest role in his stats. I know he did with Wade those years back

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    Same deal with assists dude. If one player has the ball more and passes more theyre going to have more assists. Meaning that this player's assists will be inflated. They both shot it about the same, but LBJ dominated the ball more and made more passes, hence he will have inflated assists relative to kobe. Again though, this has all been covered many times over and is not what this thread is about and im really not sure why youre bringing this up here or now.

    All I said was that kobe wasnt as ball dominant as some of you guys were making him out to be and that he would work jsut fine with CP3. Kobe was actually an amazing player off the ball. Not as good as MJ, but he was really good off the ball nonetheless. With CP3, who is a pass first pg, he would've looked to get kobe the ball in prime positions to score and kobe would've likely further cultivated is off the ball game. It would've likely led to kobe scoring with greater ease than at any other time in his career.
    they're not inflated. that's like saying Magic has inflated assists and he actually had teammates shipped off so he could be the full time PG. are u suggesting they should've taken the ball outta his hands or was the team better off with one of the greatest decision makers actually making the decisions.

    they have the ball more, it leads to more turnovers too. are their turnovers actually better?

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    Nah, not really dude. That was 19 year old kobe, sure. That wasnt 2012 kobe, which is who cp3 would've been playing with. 2012 kobe knew how to win and would've likely easily adjusted. If the trade goes down, it likely lengthens Kobe's career by a few years and probably leads to 1-2 more titles.
    That was the competitive Kobe nature until the very end.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chronz View Post
    they're not inflated. that's like saying Magic has inflated assists and he actually had teammates shipped off so he could be the full time PG. are u suggesting they should've taken the ball outta his hands or was the team better off with one of the greatest decision makers actually making the decisions.

    they have the ball more, it leads to more turnovers too. are their turnovers actually better?
    I would love to see never tuned down a good shot swaggy p playing point lol.
    Last edited by ldawg; 07-09-2020 at 09:42 PM.

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