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  1. #1
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    Looking Ahead to the Offseason

    Since the season is paused, figured we could start looking ahead to the offseason. What do you want to see your team do?


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  2. #2
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    That's a tough question without knowing what the draft will look like, how much the cap will be and if there will be any get outta jail free cards to cash strapped teams.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by NBA all the way View Post
    That's a tough question without knowing what the draft will look like, how much the cap will be and if there will be any get outta jail free cards to cash strapped teams.
    Yeah the specifics will be tough but I think there's still discussion to be had.

    Is there a particular weakness on your roster you need addressed?

    Is there someone you'd like to see traded before you have to extend his rookie contract?

    Are there particular draft prospects you like in the range your team is picking?

    Directionally, do you want to rebuild or try to contend?

    I feel you can still give general feelings on your team. With Boston for instance, the team has to weigh the long term luxury tax ramifications of Tatum's extension not next season but the one after. If Boston wants to keep Hayward beyond his current deal then that means paying the tax at least until Kemba expires. (COVID plays into this because before it Boston could have gotten under the tax next year which would be impossible now unless there are unforeseen CBA adjustments - so this is a case where the particulars are tough.)

    John Collins and Lauri Markennan are young players who have been whispered about on the trade market. Boston could put together packages for either if they are truly available.

    We need a backup PG and Dennis Smith Jr is someone Ainge liked in the draft. Wouldn't mind taking a flier if he's cheap.

    We don't know the financial landscape for certain but regardless of that players will be FAs. Pending how the financials work out, I can say that Dario Saric is a stretch 4 that always intrigued me. Jordan Clarkson could be a good scoring bench option that we need.

    I'm just desperate for some type of discussion haha


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  4. #4
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    Another thing that fans can look forward to over the offseason, whenever that is, is the development of their young players. Boston has a few young players whose development I think is important. Each of them has a skill set that is very much needed. I'm not talking stars, but each is capable of filling important roster needs we have.

    First is Grant Williams. He's an undersized, but strong, 4 that is capable of guarding up or down a spot. Even as a rookie he's proven effective on the defensive side of the ball. The question with him is shooting. He's played 62 games and he essentially had two seasons. In his first 20 games he hit ZERO threes. He was 0-25. It was laughable. In game 21, he got over the hump and hit that first three and it turned a corner for him. After going 0-25 in the first 20 games he's gone 21-60 over the last 42 (35%). His FT% on the year is 72.5%, his college FT% was 75.8% and his college 3pt% was 29%. All of those lead me to believe that he was in his own head to start his career and the 35% is closer to what he really ism though probably a little inflated. Main takeaway is that I do believe the 0-25 stretch was an outlier. Otherwise on offense, he's a heady player who sets good picks and has a good feel for moving the ball and making extra passes. Struggles mightily to finish inside on contested shots due to his lack of length though.

    So what does the future hold for him? It mainly depends on his shooting. I don't want to say "NBA player comps" but here are a few guys whose games I think he can attempt to emulate...

    Boris Diaw. He had a similar build to Grant Williams as short for a PF but stocky (Williams is a little shorter but a little stockier). Diaw had a good feel for passing the ball especially inside in traffic. Williams has some of that to him. Diaw was a career 33.6% shooter but that generally went up as he got older. You'd hope Williams could have a similar progression of improving a bit in that area. I think that's the type of offensive game you hope that Williams can try to build. Over Diaw's prime with Phoenix and Charlotte he averaged 11.3/5.2/4.5/0.7/0/7 on 50.3% shooting from the field and 35.0% from 3 across 33.0 minutes per game. In Williams last 42 games he's averaged 4.2/2.9/1.1/0.5/0.5 on 48.9% shooting from the field and 35.0% from 3 across 16.2 minutes per game. In about half the minutes Williams is about half the numbers in a lot of areas there. Hopefully he can build up to a similar sort of prime on the offensive/stats end.

    On the defensive end, I think a solid comparison for him is PJ Tucker. Williams is built similarly and, like Tucker, has shown an ability to guard SFs on the perimeter as well as kick down and guard 5s to a respectable degree in small ball. I think Williams has shown not just the potential but actual production to fit that profile on defense. He'll have to learn the nuances of playing tough without fouling (and to be fair, some of that just comes with respect from the refs as you play more).

    I really like a lot of the traits Williams has. Obviously gotta keep it in perspective - I'm talking about guys like Boris Diaw and PJ Tucker as players he could maybe one day develop into reasonable approximations of. I'm far from saying he's a star. But I really like skill set to develop as a good solid role player for the future. He's shown a lot of traits in college and the NBA that make me think it's reasonable.

    The other 2 young players whose development is important for Boston are Romeo Langford and Robert Williams. Don't have the energy to do extensive write ups on them now though.


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  5. #5
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    This draft had a huge number of unknowns before the rest of the ncaa season and the tournament was cancelled, then no combine, no tryouts, no doctors ... no answers to the questions.

    Player development across the board, not just young guys, has stopped.

    The cap is going to drop some unknown amount which is going to destroy free agency as the majority of players are going to sign 1+1 deals to put off their next contract a year until the cap goes back up ... they hope.

    With no schedule and no number for the cap there is no way to plan for free agency, and the free agents are trying to keep from getting injured and getting more out of shape.

    Summer league is likely to go away so the NBA coaching staffs will not get a chance to work with their own young players as well as losing the opportunity to evaluate other young players for the team or the G-league team.

    A bunch of NBA teams are running low on money which is going to result in people losing their jobs and corners being cut.

    I do kind of like the idea that everybody being stuck at home means the amount of film watched by players, coaches, and front office staff is going to leave the league more prepared than ever for what is coming next.

  6. #6
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    unfortunately the Jazz can't really get better. what this team really needs is a lockdown defender or a big wing/PF that can cover the rim when Gobert has go outside of the paint.

  7. #7
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    Sixers are kinda stuck unless we are willing to make some type of shakeup involving Thybulle or one of our top guys.

    I think if we took a hit in talent by trading away Horford without giving up Thybulle it would be best for us. But it's going to take Thybulle and we would have to rely on the trade bringing back a starter. But if you take a bad contract and an OK player, along with giving up a late first, we could slide Thybulle into the starting lineup as a 2/3, play JRich as a 2/3, slide Harris down to the 4. That would open us up to use out exemption on a better backup combo guard.

    I think this is a better plan than what we went with because Embiid's perfect backup plan is on the team...Simmons. I don't know who is resisting the plan, but Simmons should play point center with Embiid out. But for that to work we need a good combo guard. Then it also allows us to run the offense though Embiid when Simmons sits.

    Ultimately I think we won't do anything major. Retool around the edges. Use exemptions we can use. Generally nothing.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by warfelg View Post
    Sixers are kinda stuck unless we are willing to make some type of shakeup involving Thybulle or one of our top guys.

    I think if we took a hit in talent by trading away Horford without giving up Thybulle it would be best for us. But it's going to take Thybulle and we would have to rely on the trade bringing back a starter. But if you take a bad contract and an OK player, along with giving up a late first, we could slide Thybulle into the starting lineup as a 2/3, play JRich as a 2/3, slide Harris down to the 4. That would open us up to use out exemption on a better backup combo guard.

    I think this is a better plan than what we went with because Embiid's perfect backup plan is on the team...Simmons. I don't know who is resisting the plan, but Simmons should play point center with Embiid out. But for that to work we need a good combo guard. Then it also allows us to run the offense though Embiid when Simmons sits.

    Ultimately I think we won't do anything major. Retool around the edges. Use exemptions we can use. Generally nothing.

    What about maybe trading JRich? Aren't him and Thybulle kind of repetitive?

    Would JRich, Zhaire Smith and a pick be able to get Hield from SAC?

    Then you insert Hield as the starting SG, Thybulle at SF and move Harris to PF to round out the starting unit with Simmons/Embiid.

    That makes Horford a way expensive backup. I say you just live with it for another year vs making a rash decision. The contract gets more and move movable each year that passes. Right now you're talking about moving him for a bad deal. Next year, you could be using him as a short term deal to salary match.

    In the meantime, he gives you an awesome backup center. Embiid should be a 30 minute per game player even in the regular season games he plays. So that's 18 minutes a night for Horford. Along with getting Hield, load up on vet min shooters that would allow Horford/Embiid to play together for another 7-10 minutes a night (i.e. not with Simmons also on the court). Factoring in the games that Embiid misses and Horford plays more, that's probably going to get Horford up to 27-30 minutes a night for the regular season. That's not bad regular season production from him.

    Obviously where it'd show itself as a bad contract is would be in the playoffs. Because then you expand on Embiid's and Simmons' minutes which means Horford needs to come down to make the rotations work. But again, if you guys withstand it for an extra year the deal becomes much more movable.


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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by dhopisthename View Post
    unfortunately the Jazz can't really get better. what this team really needs is a lockdown defender or a big wing/PF that can cover the rim when Gobert has go outside of the paint.
    It was interesting to see you guys swap out Favors to Bojan at the 4 spot. Basically one end of the spectrum to another. How has that worked out overall, trading the secondary rim protection for shooting?

    I hate to say it but I think the Conley trade might have really F'd up the window. He's picked it up but hasn't been worth the money. And that salary slot will be used up by Mitchell's extension so it could be tough to recover.


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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by hugepatsfan View Post
    What about maybe trading JRich? Aren't him and Thybulle kind of repetitive?

    Would JRich, Zhaire Smith and a pick be able to get Hield from SAC?

    Then you insert Hield as the starting SG, Thybulle at SF and move Harris to PF to round out the starting unit with Simmons/Embiid.

    That makes Horford a way expensive backup. I say you just live with it for another year vs making a rash decision. The contract gets more and move movable each year that passes. Right now you're talking about moving him for a bad deal. Next year, you could be using him as a short term deal to salary match.

    In the meantime, he gives you an awesome backup center. Embiid should be a 30 minute per game player even in the regular season games he plays. So that's 18 minutes a night for Horford. Along with getting Hield, load up on vet min shooters that would allow Horford/Embiid to play together for another 7-10 minutes a night (i.e. not with Simmons also on the court). Factoring in the games that Embiid misses and Horford plays more, that's probably going to get Horford up to 27-30 minutes a night for the regular season. That's not bad regular season production from him.

    Obviously where it'd show itself as a bad contract is would be in the playoffs. Because then you expand on Embiid's and Simmons' minutes which means Horford needs to come down to make the rotations work. But again, if you guys withstand it for an extra year the deal becomes much more movable.
    JRich and Thybulle arenít repetitive and even if they are long defenders on the wing are exactly what you want more of.

    Hield is ok, but JRich acts as a secondary ball handler and elite defender. I donít feel the gain of shooting from Hield is enough to make up for those losses.

    Keeping Horford shouldnít really be an option TBH. His value will only continue to go down. It really is our best bet to hope some team really wants a skilled big like Horford. My top curiosity is if the Bulls are as interested in moving LaVine as rumored, is could Horford be used in salary matching with Thybulle, Smith, and some 1sts.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by warfelg View Post
    JRich and Thybulle arenít repetitive and even if they are long defenders on the wing are exactly what you want more of.

    Hield is ok, but JRich acts as a secondary ball handler and elite defender. I donít feel the gain of shooting from Hield is enough to make up for those losses.

    Keeping Horford shouldnít really be an option TBH. His value will only continue to go down. It really is our best bet to hope some team really wants a skilled big like Horford. My top curiosity is if the Bulls are as interested in moving LaVine as rumored, is could Horford be used in salary matching with Thybulle, Smith, and some 1sts.
    Your last trade idea is kind of my point. I think you're being overaggressive thinking you can get that in Horford this year. He's still got 3 years left on his deal (I know year 3 isn't guaranteed but at $14M it's still a sizable commitment). I don't think including him at that amount is practical for a deal like LaVine or some other similar young player.

    I think a deal like that becomes MUCH more feasible if you wait a year. I think if you chop another $27M off the Horford commitment a deal like you're suggesting here is extremely plausible. But for this offseason I think it's very unlikely. I can't see a team like CHI who you mentioned or frankly any team trading away a valuable piece while having to take on the Horford deal.

    Part of that has to do with limited trade assets. Smith and late 1sts are filler. Any team can stuff a package with stuff like that. Thybulle looks to be a super solid piece but if you're talking about guys like LaVine I think other teams have "super solid" pieces to offer that don't require them taking on as big a deal as Horford.


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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by hugepatsfan View Post
    Your last trade idea is kind of my point. I think you're being overaggressive thinking you can get that in Horford this year. He's still got 3 years left on his deal (I know year 3 isn't guaranteed but at $14M it's still a sizable commitment). I don't think including him at that amount is practical for a deal like LaVine or some other similar young player.

    I think a deal like that becomes MUCH more feasible if you wait a year. I think if you chop another $27M off the Horford commitment a deal like you're suggesting here is extremely plausible. But for this offseason I think it's very unlikely. I can't see a team like CHI who you mentioned or frankly any team trading away a valuable piece while having to take on the Horford deal.

    Part of that has to do with limited trade assets. Smith and late 1sts are filler. Any team can stuff a package with stuff like that. Thybulle looks to be a super solid piece but if you're talking about guys like LaVine I think other teams have "super solid" pieces to offer that don't require them taking on as big a deal as Horford.
    Yea. I think ultimately itís going to be a really boring offseason for us. Use the exemption and draft well. Thybulle could be really good JRich insurance (he has 1 year left and will demand a big payday) which is why Iím against losing him.

    But who knows. Every year guys get signed and guys get traded on contracts no one thought would happen.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by hugepatsfan View Post
    Since the season is paused, figured we could start looking ahead to the offseason. What do you want to see your team do?
    Go after AD (if he opts out). You never know. Miami has the cap space.

    Other then that, sign a couple of 1yr contracts, see if we can get are hands on Beal around next season trade deadline; & wait on Giannis free agency.







    Quote Originally Posted by IKnowHoops View Post
    As a rookie Micheal Beasley averaged 13.9pts per game on .472 shooting. Do you know how many times Kobe Bryant or Tracy Mcgrady shot at that percent or better? Never in there whole careers. If Beas can be what he was when he was a rookie (he won't hell be better) then the heat are coming away with another steal.

  14. #14
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    Clippers future actually doesn't look as bright as it seems and thats why management has to be on red alert right now, Kawhi and PG could walk if West and co. dont approach this off-season correct. The Clippers not being able to keep Shai is monumental and if we dont win, we will be royally ****ed for years, like Nets level ****ed after dealing with Ainge.


    For such an impressive team at full health, I dont feel like Kawhi even has as much support as he did last year in Toronto. We may have more star power and maybe that matters more in the post season (assuming we ever return to normalcy to give that playoff atmosphere) but we have glaring holes in our set up. Sweet Lou has aged like fine wine but hes clearly on the decline and is getting to a scary age. Trez is young but he sports the kind of game and frame that doesn't age too well unless he begins to develop a jumper. We're going to give him max money, i just know it. I hope he takes a paycut to stay with his PnR buddy and titles but in the best timeline, Clippers S&T him for pieces that make more sense for us. I just cant imagine who that would be. I would settle for getting some prospects and picks if the team has nothing to offer and try to flip those later.

  15. #15
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    How about this for an interesting 3 team trade...

    BOS gives: G Jaylen Brown, G Kemba Walker, #17 pick this year, 2021 1st rounder, 2023 1st rounder
    BOS gets: G Bradley Beal, C Al Horford

    PHI gives: C Al Horford, G Zaire Smith, 2022 1st rounder
    PHI gets: G Kemba Walker

    WAS gives: G Bradley Beal
    WAS gets: F Jaylen Brown, G Zhaire Smith, #17 pick this year, 2021 1st rounder (BOS), 2022 1st rounder (PHI), 2023 1st rounder (BOS)

    The Wizards are losing the best player in the deal, but they land a 20 ppg SG signed long term along with a bunch of picks to hopefully ignite a rebuild. Beal has proven to be a terrific player but he also doesn't seem to be a franchise leading type of player that's a top notch winner is going to be built around.

    PHI replaces Horford with another big contract, but it's an all star PG that can work in their defensive scheme with all the studs they have and addresses their need for another guy to initiate offense with Simmons. Kemba is a significantly better compliment to their roster and just a flat out better player than Horford.

    Boston upgrades at the SG spot with a player who's long been a mentor/friend of Tatum. Having those two together I think puts Boston in great position to keep them for their careers. Moving Kemba for Horford moves the roster pieces around a bit and better balances the roster. Smart/Beal/Hayward/Tatum/Horford is a great blend of offense/defender. Over the next 3 years, Beal/Horford vs Kemba/Brown is basically a wash salary wise so it doesn't blow them up that way.


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