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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye15 View Post
    I always see Zeke listed in the top 7-8 PGs ever. Which he isn't. He is overrated.
    He is probably in the top 3 PGs ever.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYKalltheway View Post
    He is probably in the top 3 PGs ever.
    not even close

    If you want the ultimate, you've got to be willing to pay the ultimate price. It's not tragic to die doing what you love.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye15 View Post
    not even close
    I'd love to see a list. And arguments.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYKalltheway View Post
    I'd love to see a list. And arguments.
    Magic
    Stockton
    Paul
    Curry
    Kidd
    Payton
    Oscar

    on the fence:
    Nash

    Cause they are all better. Zeke was an excellent player, but way overrated due to his championships. By 1990, was he even his teams best player anymore? Hell Kevin Johnson had a case over him for the Dream Team.

    If you want the ultimate, you've got to be willing to pay the ultimate price. It's not tragic to die doing what you love.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye15 View Post
    Magic
    Stockton
    Paul
    Curry
    Kidd
    Payton
    Oscar

    on the fence:
    Nash

    Cause they are all better. Zeke was an excellent player, but way overrated due to his championships. By 1990, was he even his teams best player anymore? Hell Kevin Johnson had a case over him for the Dream Team.
    I don't think those Pistons teams win either title with Gary Payton. Does that argument make a difference to you?


    Kristaps Porzingis
    Stronger than most 15 year old girls.

  6. #21
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    picturing the glove on that pistons defense just made me cream.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye15 View Post
    Magic
    Stockton
    Paul
    Curry
    Kidd
    Payton
    Oscar

    on the fence:
    Nash

    Cause they are all better. Zeke was an excellent player, but way overrated due to his championships. By 1990, was he even his teams best player anymore? Hell Kevin Johnson had a case over him for the Dream Team.
    He had a short career, who cares about the 90s?

    His peak alone makes him a top 3. Not so sure Oscar qualifies as a Point Guard, he played in an era where the '2 guard' was a thing, which was a combo PG/SG. If Oscar's a PG then West definitely is one, too. In the 5 positions termplate, both these guys should be considered SGs.


    What makes Stockton, Paul, Curry, Kidd and Payton better than Isiah Thomas?

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksorBust View Post
    I don't think those Pistons teams win either title with Gary Payton. Does that argument make a difference to you?
    who not?
    https://www.basketball-reference.com...advanced::none

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksorBust View Post
    I don't think those Pistons teams win either title with Gary Payton. Does that argument make a difference to you?
    I think they do. With a Payton/Dumars defensive backcourt all other teams guards are fked

  10. 06-02-2020, 08:55 AM

  11. #25
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    Sure you can compare their seasons h2h and make it look reasonable but I would advise that you instead go back and look at how Zeke played in both of those finals wins. He was a leader. He was the glue. He was clutch. That has to count for something.


    Kristaps Porzingis
    Stronger than most 15 year old girls.

  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by JordansBulls View Post
    Hakeem makes sense but I wouldn't replace Ewing in 1992. Maybe if it were in 1994 then Hakeem over Ewing is a good idea. I would probably had taken Isiah over Stockton at the end of 1992. But if selection was September 1991 Isiah over Stockton to me is a no brainer. In fact I think Nique deserved to make it as well over Pippen who up until that time had only made one allstar game by September 1991.
    Hakeem was ineligible in 1992 after playing for the Nigerian junior team in 1980 stupid rule, although I would have rather seen him play for Nigeria, and Dominique for France. Hakeem later played for the 1996 team. I
    As far as my replacements, I'd cut Laettner and add O'Neal, who wasn't as fundamentally sound, but was flat-out more talented. I'm alright with Stockton over Thomas.

  13. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrblisterdundee View Post
    Hakeem was ineligible in 1992 after playing for the Nigerian junior team in 1980 stupid rule, although I would have rather seen him play for Nigeria, and Dominique for France. Hakeem later played for the 1996 team. I
    As far as my replacements, I'd cut Laettner and add O'Neal, who wasn't as fundamentally sound, but was flat-out more talented. I'm alright with Stockton over Thomas.
    Why would Dominique play for France? He's not French. He's an American born abroad.

    As for Shaq, for some reason he wasn't picked for the national team. In 1990, they had both Laettner and Mourning on Team USA for the World Championship.

  14. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYKalltheway View Post
    Why would Dominique play for France? He's not French. He's an American born abroad.

    As for Shaq, for some reason he wasn't picked for the national team. In 1990, they had both Laettner and Mourning on Team USA for the World Championship.
    It's my general sentiment that the great players born abroad should play for the country where they're from to make things more competitive. Hakeem with the Nigerian team could have given the U.S. some trouble, as could Wilkins with the French. Isn't that better than them playing on an ultra-stacked team?

  15. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrblisterdundee View Post
    It's my general sentiment that the great players born abroad should play for the country where they're from to make things more competitive. Hakeem with the Nigerian team could have given the U.S. some trouble, as could Wilkins with the French. Isn't that better than them playing on an ultra-stacked team?
    But Dominique is not... from France. He's an American, born by American parents, raised in the USA. Just because he was born elsewhere doesn't make him a French dude instead of American.

    Hakeem on the other hand is a proper Nigerian that became naturalized as American. Completely different. Just like Mutombo is from DR Congo but has an American passport as well now.

    I understand that in the USA there's this mentality that if you're born there you have a right to a passport, but that does not apply to most the rest of the world, especially if born by foreigners.

    Nique is American through and through, nothing French about him except the name.

    This argument existed in Greece regarding Antetokounmpo. He is a Nigerian born in Greece, raised here, he loves and feels proud of the fact, yet he was only given citizenship in order to be able to move to the USA for the NBA. He doesn't have a Nigerian passport. He still is a Nigerian by blood as both his parents are from there, but he has been legally eligible for a Greek passport for years before he actually got one.

    Then we have other issues of naturalization, like Serge Ibaka who moved to Spain when he was 18 and Nikola Mirotic who moved to Spain when he was 14.
    Last edited by NYKalltheway; 06-07-2020 at 10:48 AM.

  16. #30
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    In response to the OP

    Michael Jordan
    Magic Johnson
    Karl Malone
    David Robinson
    Patrick Ewing
    Charles Barkley
    Clyde Drexler
    Scottie Pippen
    John Stockton
    Chris Mullin
    Terry Porter
    Christian Laettner


    *Bird was done. Laettner earned the spot over Shaq, if we compare college careers.

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