This is why they kneel

[SiteWolf]

You are sort of making my point for me. If USPS is not going to be profitable, why does its union members believe their salaries, benefits and pensions should be in line with private corporations who are profitable?

You essentially have members who believe they are worth X. While the USPS only earns Y and Y is less than X. This is the problem with public sector unions.

How about this, why don’t you all give me an example of a public sector union without any issues. We know the issues with police. We know the issues with education. And the issues with the USPS.

I need an example in which a public sector union is better for the community as should be the purpose of civil servants.

wait, so people who work for non-profits or, in this case, not-for-profit government....don't deserve to earn the same wage as those in for-profit businesses....because the organization they work for isn't concerned about profit?

And a reason for unions in those cases is because, in the private sector I can go to my boss and stump for a raise and he either can or has access to someone who can make that happen. That's not true at the post office, most things are regulated by people who I'll never have direct contact with and performance based raises are nearly non-existent.

[Scoots]

I did it frequently until a few years ago.

If you were a volunteer fireman then thank you for your service since volunteers have protected me and my family for many years.

But if you really did volunteer then why would you doubt the ability of volunteers to get the job done?

[flips333]

You are sort of making my point for me. If USPS is not going to be profitable, why does its union members believe their salaries, benefits and pensions should be in line with private corporations who are profitable?

You essentially have members who believe they are worth X. While the USPS only earns Y and Y is less than X. This is the problem with public sector unions.

How about this, why don’t you all give me an example of a public sector union without any issues. We know the issues with police. We know the issues with education. And the issues with the USPS.

I need an example in which a public sector union is better for the community as should be the purpose of civil servants.

Because that's not their ****ing point. There are many things provided by the government that aren't intended to make a profit? Should scientists at the CDC and NIH make less than the ones that work for Pfiser? And if so... damn that's just shoot yourself in the foot dumb.

[flips333]

BS


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Yeah.. he broke out the always... which certainly makes it hyperbole at best.

[flips333]

If you were a volunteer fireman then thank you for your service since volunteers have protected me and my family for many years.

But if you really did volunteer then why would you doubt the ability of volunteers to get the job done?

You've never volunteered for something you might have thought a professional who is paid to do something might do better? I mean I know CPR, but I would rather a professional attempt CPR on my loved ones than me.

[flips333]

Exactly. Civil servants should not need to have the power to negotiate collectively. They serve the community.

You trust volunteer firefighters to save your life if need be. Why wouldn’t you trust them to deliver a piece of mail?

Because there are not enough volunteers to run the mail service. Duh!

[SiteWolf]

If you were a volunteer fireman then thank you for your service since volunteers have protected me and my family for many years.

But if you really did volunteer then why would you doubt the ability of volunteers to get the job done?

for one, mail is 6 days a week....an area that doesn't need paid fireman relies on volunteers because they work as needed, not 6 days a week

besides, a volunteer firefighter is wanting to be sure their family and neighborhood is cared for.....I don't much care if my neighbor's ED pills or utility bills get to him

[Scoots]

You've never volunteered for something you might have thought a professional who is paid to do something might do better? I mean I know CPR, but I would rather a professional attempt CPR on my loved ones than me.

I have, but if he was a volunteer fireman why would he inherently distrust a volunteer mail delivery person? Was he worthy of distrust himself?

[Scoots]

Because there are not enough volunteers to run the mail service. Duh!

So they tried to go with volunteers and couldn't get enough? Or are you speculating?

[benny01]

If you were a volunteer fireman then thank you for your service since volunteers have protected me and my family for many years.

But if you really did volunteer then why would you doubt the ability of volunteers to get the job done?

Yeah, I was for 6-7 years. I had a kid that was slow that worked for me and wanted to be a fireman but was nervous to join the department, so I joined with him.

Two things. First, volunteer fireman, at least all that I know, get paid. It's not a lot, and you might get in 20 hours a month(we got paid by call). We also worked in tandem with guys that were professionals. Secondly, I have no doubt that volunteers could do it(postal work), I have real concerns that volunteers would be willing to work 40+hours a week for little to nothing or that you he able to find volunteers in every part of the country they'd be needed.

That gets us to the last point I'll make which is settle down hippy, peace, love and community service doesnt put food on anyone's tables. This is one of the oddest conversations I've seen here in a while.

[benny01]

I have, but if he was a volunteer fireman why would he inherently distrust a volunteer mail delivery person? Was he worthy of distrust himself?

Nothing to do with trust, far more to do with the pie in the sky idea that we are going to start replacing basic services in this country with volunteers. Who's gonna sign up to mow ditches in August?

[flips333]

So they tried to go with volunteers and couldn't get enough? Or are you speculating?

There are not enough paid employees to make it work everywhere... so yes I'm speculating... but It's not like I am pontificating the meaning of life. If you need the experiment to happen.

[flips333]

Nothing to do with trust, far more to do with the pie in the sky idea that we are going to start replacing basic services in this country with volunteers. Who's gonna sign up to mow ditches in August?

And by the logic of some in this thread.... Why would anyone do anything that wasn't self serving. Profit = value...

[flips333]

I have, but if he was a volunteer fireman why would he inherently distrust a volunteer mail delivery person? Was he worthy of distrust himself?

Distrust is not equal to a professional would be better. I'm not like following volunteers around the wall mart because I think they are going to steal something. But who the **** wouldn't rather have a professional doing important things than a volunteer. I don't see how I want a professional = I distrust volunteers.. Who do you trust more to hit a basketball shot.. the best professional guy or the best amateur guy?

[SiteWolf]

Nothing to do with trust, far more to do with the pie in the sky idea that we are going to start replacing basic services in this country with volunteers. Who's gonna sign up to mow ditches in August?

I can't do August ('cause it's over!) but I could be willing to split October with somebody