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  1. #4441
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewing View Post
    Can we make a thread for made up Union stories?
    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Start one.

  2. #4442
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    So the govt should be in control of healthcare and the only ones to have firearms but we can’t trust them to pay a fair wage? Seems legit...
    Yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPoon
    man with hair like fire can destroy souls with a twitch of his thighs.

  3. #4443
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    In my early 20s, I worked in a union doing data entry. 6 months into the job, we had to sign a new contract. The people who had been into the job for years wanted higher pay and better healthcare. I tried to explain to them that literally anyone could do our job, so asking for a $5 an hour raise and full benefits wasn’t likely. Also, unlike teachers or nurses no one would give a **** if we went on strike. But of course the rebel rousers, who conveniently get paid while we were out on strike, convinced everyone otherwise. So we rejected the company’s contract offer and went out on strike. 3 days later, when the company didn’t budge because they had replaced us with short term hires, we approved the first original offer.... yeah, unions are so needed.
    I have this one experience that proves my point for everyone.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPoon
    man with hair like fire can destroy souls with a twitch of his thighs.

  4. #4444
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    If you are a good employee, why would you want a union??? Why would you want someone else speaking out on your behalf???

    Unions make sure that everyone is paid the same. So if you are a good and valued employee, you get paid the same as some jackoff that does half your work and with less quality. And wit a union, that person probably cannot get fired.Why would any good eployee want that???

    If management can promote based on abilities, work ethic, dependability etc.……they will. And the better employees will make more money.

    Unions promote mediocrituy.

  5. #4445
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sluggo1 View Post
    If you are a good employee, why would you want a union??? Why would you want someone else speaking out on your behalf???

    Unions make sure that everyone is paid the same. So if you are a good and valued employee, you get paid the same as some jackoff that does half your work and with less quality. And wit a union, that person probably cannot get fired.Why would any good eployee want that???

    If management can promote based on abilities, work ethic, dependability etc.……they will. And the better employees will make more money.

    Unions promote mediocrituy.
    Because bargaining as a group you have more power.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPoon
    man with hair like fire can destroy souls with a twitch of his thighs.

  6. #4446
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    Quote Originally Posted by flips333 View Post
    Because bargaining as a group you have more power.
    Not if you're a good employee.

    Employers do not want quality talent to get away. Why not let the market for supply and demand determine salaries???

  7. #4447
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sluggo1 View Post
    Not if you're a good employee.

    Employers do not want quality talent to get away. Why not let the market for supply and demand determine salaries???
    Sure one person in a large corporation has more leverage than all the employees combined. Maybe in a small business this is true. But in any large group this is simply not going to be the case. Because, provided you are not doing a task that anyone can do... you can effectively shut down business. You can disagree, but as you are fond of saying, that would mean you are living in a fantasy world.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPoon
    man with hair like fire can destroy souls with a twitch of his thighs.

  8. #4448
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    Quote Originally Posted by flips333 View Post
    Sure one person in a large corporation has more leverage than all the employees combined. Maybe in a small business this is true. But in any large group this is simply not going to be the case. Because, provided you are not doing a task that anyone can do... you can effectively shut down business. You can disagree, but as you are fond of saying, that would mean you are living in a fantasy world.
    So in a union, you are the best employee and will be paid as if you are the worst employee. And you probably cannot get promoted over someone who has more time on the job no matter how much better you are. And of course, the worst employees are almost impossible to fire.

    Teachers' unions are the best examples of mediocrity being rewarded. We spend more per student than any other country and we lag way behind the rest of the major countries in the world. But it's not the teacher's fault. We just need to throw more $$$$ at them. The all will be fixed.

    Sorry, that's not good enough for me.

  9. #4449
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sluggo1 View Post
    So in a union, you are the best employee and will be paid as if you are the worst employee. And you probably cannot get promoted over someone who has more time on the job no matter how much better you are. And of course, the worst employees are almost impossible to fire.

    Teachers' unions are the best examples of mediocrity being rewarded. We spend more per student than any other country and we lag way behind the rest of the major countries in the world. But it's not the teacher's fault. We just need to throw more $$$$ at them. The all will be fixed.

    Sorry, that's not good enough for me.
    It doesn't matter how much you are getting payed compared to your peers... it matters how much you are getting paid with vs without a union.

    Would you rather A. get paid 50,000 but make 10,000 more than the guy next to you who sucks. Or B. make 60,000 and make 10,000 less than the guy next to you who sucks?

    I'm taking B...

    The countries in europe you are referring too also have Unions. My guess is those that spend less (and have a similar level of education) do so by spending less on management rather than teachers.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/teac...country-2017-5
    https://nces.ed.gov/programs/coe/indicator_cmd.asp

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPoon
    man with hair like fire can destroy souls with a twitch of his thighs.

  10. #4450
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    In my early 20s, I worked in a union doing data entry. 6 months into the job, we had to sign a new contract. The people who had been into the job for years wanted higher pay and better healthcare. I tried to explain to them that literally anyone could do our job, so asking for a $5 an hour raise and full benefits wasn’t likely. Also, unlike teachers or nurses no one would give a **** if we went on strike. But of course the rebel rousers, who conveniently get paid while we were out on strike, convinced everyone otherwise. So we rejected the company’s contract offer and went out on strike. 3 days later, when the company didn’t budge because they had replaced us with short term hires, we approved the first original offer.... yeah, unions are so needed.
    That’s a powerless union right there.

    Ours (grocery workers) went on strike that was planned for a week and the companies caved in a few hours.

    Good unions are needed. Many people fought and died for labor rights and having so much power shift back in favor of corporations these days is a disgrace.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  11. #4451
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sluggo1 View Post
    Not if you're a good employee.

    Employers do not want quality talent to get away. Why not let the market for supply and demand determine salaries???
    McDonalds, Walmart....many examples of companies who were perfectly willing to sacrifice quality employees seeking to unionize.

    There’s simply too much power by corporations and their ability to squeeze every bit out of underpaid workers to maintain their growth up top.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  12. #4452
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    Well there are always going to be good and bad unions as well as good and bad situations to be involved in a union. I've never been in one, but have been around both good and bad ones. However, state gov'ts often act as a union....raises aren't merit based, only based on time of service.

    Oftentimes, the people that like unions the most are the ones that benefit from them the most; average at best employees with a lot of service time. The above average employee who expects to move thru the ranks fast doesn't like unions as much. Increased pay sometimes comes with caveats that are hard to stomach. For example, how much of that increase is eaten up by union dues and how much freedom of choice is given with benefit packages, etc. However, that's my perception with limited exposure. I just know the one time I was directly involved, the machine shop I was working at pushed to bring a union in not long before I left and two years later were working to get rid of it.

    It is still hardly incentivizing to be making less than someone doing the same job even if you're making more than you were. The paycheck is bigger but the stress and morale levels are lower.
    gotta love 'referential' treatment

  13. #4453
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    Quote Originally Posted by flips333 View Post
    I have this one experience that proves my point for everyone.
    I never mentioned my point in my story. Was just responding to his story...

  14. #4454
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    Quote Originally Posted by GGGGG-Men View Post
    That’s a powerless union right there.

    Ours (grocery workers) went on strike that was planned for a week and the companies caved in a few hours.

    Good unions are needed. Many people fought and died for labor rights and having so much power shift back in favor of corporations these days is a disgrace.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    It’s powerless because it’s unskilled labor. Unions are only effective if the labor is skilled and therefore can not be easily replaced- teamsters, nurses, teachers...

  15. #4455
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    It’s powerless because it’s unskilled labor. Unions are only effective if the labor is skilled and therefore can not be easily replaced- teamsters, nurses, teachers...
    I disagree. I was a 16 year old grocery clerk and then worked in the deli. Easy to find a replacement, but any time the company refused a modest benefit or raise, my rep delivered. When the company tried to reduce overtime benefits we threatened to strike and they backed off.

    It was also the nineties and there was a shred of Union respect left in NY where unions have a longer history and respect even by some conservatives (like my pro union Trumper dad). So maybe that changes the game compared to now.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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