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  1. #6466
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiteWolf View Post
    I think you need some work in understanding what racism actually is
    Racism in 2020 is racism through low expectations. Thereís a group of people who place unnecessary low expectations on black people and act as if their actions cannot be accounted for because of such expectations. Itís back door racism with the same theme as it was 100 years ago. White people are better than black people but now, we feel sorry for you.

  2. #6467
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    In your first paragraph, you are essentially saying it is better to be white than to be black in the US in 2020 simply by the color of ones skin. This is back door racism. Itís the racism of low expectations. You are telling black people, they are less than but you feel sorry for them so you do it with a smile. Itís modern day racism.

    When you ask specifically why are black people searched more often than white drivers, itís a micro question. You need to consider such criteria as the behavior and actions of the driver. The area in which the vehicle stop occurred and furthermore, the specific road the stop occurred on. Is this road a major route which leads to a main high crime area? Is this road frequented more by black people than white people? Are these specifics the same?
    It's actually the exact opposite. You are the one saying their low achievement is because they are criminals. You have low expectations for them. I think black people are no more inherently likely to be criminals than white people, it's the system that contributes to the discrepancy. You're saying the cause is black people. Who is the racist again?

    In fact, you're entire logic is just horribly stupid. If I said that it is better to be German in 1930's Germany than Jewish, would you say that is back door racism, or the acknowledgement of a reality?

    I have never told a black person they are less than me. I certainly haven't called them all criminals like you. The difference between us is I think they are poor because the system is designed to keep them that way and you think they are poor because they are black.

    One is racist, the other is not. Care to guess which?

  3. #6468
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    Racism in 2020 is racism through low expectations. Thereís a group of people who place unnecessary low expectations on black people and act as if their actions cannot be accounted for because of such expectations. Itís back door racism with the same theme as it was 100 years ago. White people are better than black people but now, we feel sorry for you.
    I love that you have a new buzz phrase.

    Joey "If you don't think that black people are just criminals it's because you think white people are better than them".

    What manure.

  4. #6469
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    I donít want laws or policies which outright or indirectly negatively impact any group of people. Do you agree?

    I mention the higher crime rate amongst black people because itís an issue for young black men in particular. Not admitting the problem is a form of racism.
    No I dont agree, from what I remember you supported stop and frisk on basis of statistics amongst blacks.

    Of course it's an issue, it's an issue for young every color men, but yes especially young black men, hence why we feel we want to actively kill systemic racism. The effects of which you just mentioned.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    Last edited by nastynice; 09-23-2020 at 10:52 PM.
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  5. #6470
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Not at all. I believe white people on average have it easier in this country than black people on average. That has nothing do with the quality of black or white people, but the quality of the system.
    Well said, joey you should reread this and just give it some thought for a minute. What valade is saying is very accurate.

    His following response to your response is also solid. I feel youre not giving his posts their due.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  6. #6471
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    In fact, you're entire logic is just horribly stupid. If I said that it is better to be German in 1930's Germany than Jewish, would you say that is back door racism, or the acknowledgement of a reality?
    Yup. Good analogy.

    Hopefully no one gloss this over with the cliche oh you're trying to compare America to nazi germany, and realizes analogies are meant to help illustrate a thought process. Which this does perfectly in regard to Joey's argument.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  7. #6472
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    It's actually the exact opposite. You are the one saying their low achievement is because they are criminals. You have low expectations for them. I think black people are no more inherently likely to be criminals than white people, it's the system that contributes to the discrepancy. You're saying the cause is black people. Who is the racist again?

    In fact, you're entire logic is just horribly stupid. If I said that it is better to be German in 1930's Germany than Jewish, would you say that is back door racism, or the acknowledgement of a reality?

    I have never told a black person they are less than me. I certainly haven't called them all criminals like you. The difference between us is I think they are poor because the system is designed to keep them that way and you think they are poor because they are black.

    One is racist, the other is not. Care to guess which?
    In fact itís not that at all. I believe black people are disproportionately impacted by poverty partly due to systemic racism in the past. However, this has been exasperated by policies in democrat lead inner cities that have all but forced poor people to rely heavily on the government. Government has literally replaced fathers in inner cities. This combined with the epic failure which was the war on drugs has impacted the black community and the crime rate in inner cities. Make drugs legal and sell them in a state licensed store. Stop allowing gangs to profit from a health issue.

    Yes. The only difference is you are coming off like you care about black people. To use your metaphor, if this was 1930 Germany, you would tell Jewish people that germans have privileges in letters but when the Gestapo showed up, you wouldnít let any Jews hide in your attic. Youíd just complain about it in letters later. You donít want change unless you have mind control and everyone acts in accordance to your beliefs.

    Referring to the high crime rate in inner cities, especially among young black males is not calling them criminals. Itís identifying an issue an offering plans to fix it.

  8. #6473
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    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    No I dont agree, from what I remember you supported stop and frisk on basis of statistics amongst blacks.

    Of course it's an issue, it's an issue for young every color men, but yes especially young black men, hence why we feel we want to actively kill systemic racism. The effects of which you just mentioned.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    I did not support stop and frisk because it was a violation of 5th amendment rights. I stated that if I were a black person in the inner city, I would support it as a means to an end.

  9. #6474
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    In fact itís not that at all. I believe black people are disproportionately impacted by poverty partly due to systemic racism in the past. However, this has been exasperated by policies in democrat lead inner cities that have all but forced poor people to rely heavily on the government. Government has literally replaced fathers in inner cities. This combined with the epic failure which was the war on drugs has impacted the black community and the crime rate in inner cities. Make drugs legal and sell them in a state licensed store. Stop allowing gangs to profit from a health issue.

    Yes. The only difference is you are coming off like you care about black people. To use your metaphor, if this was 1930 Germany, you would tell Jewish people that germans have privileges in letters but when the Gestapo showed up, you wouldnít let any Jews hide in your attic. Youíd just complain about it in letters later. You donít want change unless you have mind control and everyone acts in accordance to your beliefs.

    Referring to the high crime rate in inner cities, especially among young black males is not calling them criminals. Itís identifying an issue an offering plans to fix it.
    First Bolded: Well at least you finally acknowledge systemic racism is a real thing. That's an improvement.

    Second Bolded: Spare me. Of both of us, I'm the one wanting to do something about it. I'm the one saying "let's hide the Jews in the attic to stop the system from attacking them" and you're going "No, they should be stopped and frisked for their papers, after all they are more likely to be criminals".

    We already had this conversation on how to fix these issues, your response was to attack unions. Because you don't even believe it's a problem. You still don't. You never will.

  10. #6475
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    I did not support stop and frisk because it was a violation of 5th amendment rights. I stated that if I were a black person in the inner city, I would support it as a means to an end.
    Now you're just flat out lying. You did not state "if you were a black person in the inner city", you flat out stated it was a means to an end you're OK with.

  11. #6476
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    I love that you have a new buzz phrase.

    Joey "If you don't think that black people are just criminals it's because you think white people are better than them".

    What manure.
    You should treat black people and white people the same under the law.

    Do you believe the KKK was/is a problem in this country? So do I. But the fact is, the KKK is only made up of a small percentage of white people. Perhaps it was a higher percentage in the past but still. I feel the same way about KKK members as I go black gang members or mafia members. Wrong is wrong. Do we agree on this?

  12. #6477
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Now you're just flat out lying. You did not state "if you were a black person in the inner city", you flat out stated it was a means to an end you're OK with.
    Iím not going to go back through that thread and look but Iíve been consistent on this from the start.

  13. #6478
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    You should treat black people and white people the same under the law.

    Do you believe the KKK was/is a problem in this country? So do I. But the fact is, the KKK is only made up of a small percentage of white people. Perhaps it was a higher percentage in the past but still. I feel the same way about KKK members as I go black gang members or mafia members. Wrong is wrong. Do we agree on this?
    We agree with the bolded. Where we disagree is you saying "black people and white people are treated the same under the law"


    The fact you instantly go to the KKK anytime you talk of racism tells me you still haven't grasped the concept of systemic racism. It goes back to you assuming racism can only come from racist intent.

    Crack carries a harsher sentence than cocaine. That was because of racist intent (making it a harsher penalty), but that doesn't mean every cop who busts a black man with crack or a judge who sentences them to a harsher crime is a racist. It means they are doing their job and following a racist law that they are unaware was meant to be racist.

  14. #6479
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    First Bolded: Well at least you finally acknowledge systemic racism is a real thing. That's an improvement.

    Second Bolded: Spare me. Of both of us, I'm the one wanting to do something about it. I'm the one saying "let's hide the Jews in the attic to stop the system from attacking them" and you're going "No, they should be stopped and frisked for their papers, after all they are more likely to be criminals".

    We already had this conversation on how to fix these issues, your response was to attack unions. Because you don't even believe it's a problem. You still don't. You never will.
    You donít believe the problem exist because itís in unions and that effects the bottom line for the democrat party. You are good at identifying a problem but you donít want to make the necessary changes to fix those issues if it negatively impacts your partyís bottom line.

    Now equate that to the 1930s. You actually sound like Neville Chamberlain with his wishy washy approach to the Germans.

  15. #6480
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    You donít believe the problem exist because itís in unions and that effects the bottom line for the democrat party. You are good at identifying a problem but you donít want to make the necessary changes to fix those issues if it negatively impacts your partyís bottom line.

    Now equate that to the 1930s. You actually sound like Neville Chamberlain with his wishy washy approach to the Germans.
    Absolutely not. I agreed with you on busting the police unions. I just failed to see how a teacher's union has to do with police violence (hint: it doesn't). You wanted to also destroy that union, because again, it's not about systemic racism. You don't believe it exists. For you it's destroying democratic ideals, so you view this entire conversation as a means to an end: to destroy some part of the Democratic platform.

    Equating it to the 1930's, if I'm Neville Chamberlain, you're the Brownshirts with your "I don't agree with marking Jews and demanding their papers, but it's a means to an end" garbage.

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