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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.B View Post
    Iíll say it again, could have had Mims with that 2nd pick. Or the Eagles could have taken a RB. There were still some really good RBís on the board when the Eagles made their 2nd pick.


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    The more I think about it, they should have gone with Mims and gone WR/WR. Mims could have been an easy Alshon replacement. Mims-Reagor-Ward could make a nice trio. But alas we'll never see it.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB_Eagles View Post
    Yeah, just me and dumbasses like this guy could come up with stuff like that: https://overthecap.com/the-benefits-...raft-strategy/

    I mean a backup keeping the team around .500 in 7 games of the starting QB's absence shouldn't be too tall of a task. The competent backups can do that. Or you can have backup like Hundley, causing certain fans to write off the season as soon as the starter goes down. According to you the Packers front office under Ted Thompson never knew what they were doing but that was a smart call apparently.
    For a rookie QB to come in and do that would be a very tall task. Iíd say that 9 out of 10 times that rookie is going to be like a deer in the headlights if he has to start an NFL game. For most rookies the game doesnít even start to slow down until at least their second year. If Wentz goes down again this season and Hurts has to start, its more likely that the Eagles are screwed than that Hurts keeps the team around .500.


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  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB_Eagles View Post
    I mean a backup keeping the team around .500 in 7 games of the starting QB's absence shouldn't be too tall of a task. The competent backups can do that.
    So this post got me curious so I decided to look up records of backups (starting the season) in 2020 (I left off week 17 starters as that wasn't for injuries/benchings):
    Minshew* 6-6
    Tannehill 9-4
    Bridgewater 5-0
    K Allen 5-7
    Rudolph 5-3
    Lock 4-1
    Hodges* 3-3
    Jones* 3-9
    Haskins* 2-5
    Moore 1-1
    B Allen 1-2
    Siemian 0-1
    Driskel 0-3
    Finley* 0-3
    Rosen 0-3
    Blough* 0-5

    * - denotes rookies

    Backups who came in for injury were 41-56 in 2019 alone. Rookies were 14-31 as starters coming in for injuries.

    I went back another year or two that I'm not going to do similar starters but it seems as though if you want a competent backup, your best bet isn't a rookie contract, rather it's spending the slight extra dime and get yourself a former starter to come in.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB_Eagles View Post
    This Hurts debate has already happened in 4 different threads now (outside of this one). Just to recap since you seem to have missed all of those:

    1) Hurts could be a bust but let's not act like any other *one* player picked in his stead was a guarantee to succeed at pick 53. Most of the picks in that range bust, and most of those who don't bust their ceiling is backup.
    2) The Eagles have already invested heavily in the backup QB position over the last four year, at an average of $8M/year just for the QB2. Hurts will make $1.5M/year over 4 years. Not $4M for 1 year and then look for another QB who doesn't know the system.
    3) The team won a Super Bowl with their backup QB in 2017, which validates that investment.
    4) Wentz has suffered an injury every year over the last 6 years. So the team has to plan for the eventuality of Wentz missing more games. Even if another Super Bowl run with a backup QB is unlikely, a capable backup QB keeping a team in competition over a few games isn't unlikely at all.

    These are simply facts. You can throw out more arguments but I won't respond because this is the "Andy Dalton signs with the Cowboys" thread.
    Just to play devilís advocate here...

    1. The draft is always a crap shoot. That is correct for any player taken in any round. The good teams though rely on their 2nd and 3rd round picks to be come starters. For the good teams those 2nd round picks become the backbone of your team. Drafting a backup QB doesnít really make a lot of sense in the second round. Just doesnít make sense that you waist a premium pick on a guy you hope never plays.

    2. You canít down play how important NFL experience is, especially at the QB position. If Hurts makes it past year 2 of his contract without having to play then the Eagles should be ok with Hurts as the backup QB. If he has to play an extended amount of time though in his rookie season the Eagles are likely screwed.

    3. The Eagles won the SB with a backup QB that had years of NFL experience. The Eagles donít have that luxury at right now with Hurts.

    4. Cant argue with 4. Wentz gets hurt a lot. Just seems to make more sense that they would want a veteran backup QB. Even Cam would make more sense. Yes he gets hurt a lot too but he could easily step in for 8 games and lead the Eagles to a record better than .500.


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  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by NBA all the way View Post
    I actually wanna see Dalton in those conditions/circumstances, dude struggles mightily in prime time games.

    In all fairness, Joe Montana, Tom Brady, John Elway, and pretty much any other great QB would have also struggled with the Bengals.


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  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by warfelg View Post
    The more I think about it, they should have gone with Mims and gone WR/WR. Mims could have been an easy Alshon replacement. Mims-Reagor-Ward could make a nice trio. But alas we'll never see it.
    Wentz would be loving life right now if they had added Reagor AND Mims.


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  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.B View Post
    Just to play devilís advocate here...

    1. The draft is always a crap shoot. That is correct for any player taken in any round. The good teams though rely on their 2nd and 3rd round picks to be come starters. For the good teams those 2nd round picks become the backbone of your team. Drafting a backup QB doesnít really make a lot of sense in the second round. Just doesnít make sense that you waist a premium pick on a guy you hope never plays.
    Just to make a point here: Before the Killer B's broke up, only 3 Steelers offensive starters were 1st round picks (Ben, Pouncey, DeCastro)(possibly true this year too). Last year 3/5 of our O-Line was undrafted (Villanueva, Foster, Fieler). We still don't have a 1st round WR (Juju 2nd, Johnson 3rd, Washington 2nd, Claypool 2nd). Our only other 1st round player as of right now is backup TE (Ebron).

    As much as this league is changing it still makes the most sense to invest in your defense. I can only speak for ours but we only have 2 projected starters not from the top 3 rounds:
    Heyward (1), McCullers (7), Tuitt (2), Watt (1), Bush (1), Williams (7), Dupree (1), Nelson (3), Fitzpatrick (1), Edmunds (1), Haden (1). Backups are similarly highly drafted with Alualu (1), Sutton (3), Hilton (UD), Highsmith (3)

  8. #68
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    I actually don't hate Dalton. Cincy is a factory of sad. I do think he's a huge upgrade over Nick Foles and he can let the deep ball iet it ****ing eat.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.B View Post
    I actually agree with you. If there is a preseason and Dalton looks good a lot of the fan base is going to want him to start the regular season. If Dak sits out and Dalton looks good in his place itís going to be hard putting Dak back in after a holdout (if Dalton is playing well).

    It clear that things are different with the Cowboys since they hired McCarthy.


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    Honestly, this could eventually be better than just drafting a QB high in this draft. Dak might hold out and if dalton comes in and plays great, it eliminates the urgency to get dak signed. Obviously you still want to sign him but you can tell him that youíve reached your limit and for him to take it or they will explore trades. I think they can get a 1st+ for dak which would be a fantastic ROI for him being a 4th round draft pick. In the offseason they can resign dalton to a 2-3 year contract and then with that 1st that they acquired, they can take Daks replacement long term and have him learn behind dalton for a year or two. That would be a smooth transition in my opinion

    Your baby can't do this

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by surf and turf View Post
    Hot take . AD has more TD then Dak.
    Now youíre getting it

    Your baby can't do this

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.B View Post
    Just to play devilís advocate here...

    1. The draft is always a crap shoot. That is correct for any player taken in any round. The good teams though rely on their 2nd and 3rd round picks to be come starters. For the good teams those 2nd round picks become the backbone of your team. Drafting a backup QB doesnít really make a lot of sense in the second round. Just doesnít make sense that you waist a premium pick on a guy you hope never plays.

    2. You canít down play how important NFL experience is, especially at the QB position. If Hurts makes it past year 2 of his contract without having to play then the Eagles should be ok with Hurts as 8 of time though in his rookie season the Eagles are likely screwed.

    3. The Eagles won the SB with a backup QB that had years of NFL experience. The Eagles donít have that luxury at right now with Hurts.

    4. Cant argue with 4. Wentz gets hurt a lot. Just seems to make more sense that they would want a veteran backup QB. Even Cam would make more sense. Yes he gets hurt a lot too but he could easily step in for 8 games and lead the Eagles to a record better than .500.


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    The Eagles also don't have the luxury of spending much more than the league minimum on a backup QB anymore.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by CasperX22 View Post
    The Eagles also don't have the luxury of spending much more than the league minimum on a backup QB anymore.
    True. The cap space for the eagles next year is like 25mill over the cap unless they carry a lot of the cap space over from this year.

    Your baby can't do this

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by warfelg View Post
    So this post got me curious so I decided to look up records of backups (starting the season) in 2020 (I left off week 17 starters as that wasn't for injuries/benchings):
    Minshew* 6-6
    Tannehill 9-4
    Bridgewater 5-0
    K Allen 5-7
    Rudolph 5-3
    Lock 4-1
    Hodges* 3-3
    Jones* 3-9
    Haskins* 2-5
    Moore 1-1
    B Allen 1-2
    Siemian 0-1
    Driskel 0-3
    Finley* 0-3
    Rosen 0-3
    Blough* 0-5

    * - denotes rookies

    Backups who came in for injury were 41-56 in 2019 alone. Rookies were 14-31 as starters coming in for injuries.

    I went back another year or two that I'm not going to do similar starters but it seems as though if you want a competent backup, your best bet isn't a rookie contract, rather it's spending the slight extra dime and get yourself a former starter to come in.
    not sure why pittsburgh fans ran rudolph out of town

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.B View Post
    Wentz would be loving life right now if they had added Reagor AND Mims.


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    Reagor and mims would be ****in crazy, but I donít like playing the ďwe coulda had this guyĒ game. The rumor out there is that the eagles woulda taken Jeremy Chinn if they didnít take jalen hurts so thatís who imma go with. Putting my hate for the jalen hurts pick aside, it doesnít bug me too much that they supposedly passed on chinn because I think the eagles mighta gotten a steal with kívon Wallace in the 4th round, and I think he will be a great scheme fit too and personally I like that pick in the 4th round more than if the eagles took Jeremy chinn in the 2nd.

    Your baby can't do this

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by warfelg View Post
    So this post got me curious so I decided to look up records of backups (starting the season) in 2020 (I left off week 17 starters as that wasn't for injuries/benchings):
    Minshew* 6-6
    Tannehill 9-4
    Bridgewater 5-0
    K Allen 5-7
    Rudolph 5-3
    Lock 4-1
    Hodges* 3-3
    Jones* 3-9
    Haskins* 2-5
    Moore 1-1
    B Allen 1-2
    Siemian 0-1
    Driskel 0-3
    Finley* 0-3
    Rosen 0-3
    Blough* 0-5

    * - denotes rookies

    Backups who came in for injury were 41-56 in 2019 alone. Rookies were 14-31 as starters coming in for injuries.

    I went back another year or two that I'm not going to do similar starters but it seems as though if you want a competent backup, your best bet isn't a rookie contract, rather it's spending the slight extra dime and get yourself a former starter to come in.
    Not every situation is created equally for rookie QB's either. You look at the situations where rookies stepped in and struggled, those were already bad teams. What did Hodges even need to do to win games? Not throw pick 6's and score 17 pts? The issue isn't taking Hurts in the 2nd round. The issue is was Hurts the best player on the board and if not did the Eagles maximize their assets. Backup QB was definitely a need, but is Hurts that much better than some of the choices taken later like Eason and Fromm? And was taking Hightower, Watkins, and trading for Goodwin a better use of resources than just taking Mims and using those assets on different positions? None of us know the answers to those questions yet. Was it poor logic to bank on multiple later WRs in a draft said said to be the best WR draft in over 2 decades? It could certainly blow up in Howie's face, but at least the logic makes some sense.

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