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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigfishguy85 View Post
    Ok, let me paint a picture for you because you still just don't seem to grasp a very key concept here.

    So the OP mentions that we go to 13-3 and the NFCCG with a 10-6 talent level. Going into the year or even watching during the season, I think you'd be hard pressed to find anyone that really thought we were 1 game away from a superbowl in terms of talent. We weren't, so we got lucky that things went as well as they did.

    Right there, your expectation is baseless. Expecting that we're right at the door of getting to a title. We're not. We overachieved and are bigtime regression candidates.

    But let's suppose the front office really was as clueless as you are about this and did what you think they should've done. Maybe they draft a WR in 1 and 2. Let's just say they did that. And then it plays out like this.

    Neither of those receivers makes much of an impact in the first two years. They catch a few balls, sure, but it takes a lot to earn #12's trust. Also over the course of the next two years, Rodgers continues to decline. The defense fails to make any significant jump, finishing no better than 15th in total defense(compared to currently #20 I think). In 3 years you've got a 39 year old, highly overpaid shell of his former self QB. At that point, you have a mediocre defense, young wr's that you still don't really know what they are. Maybe instead of drafting a rb we just paid Jones and his injury issues come back to haunt us. You do all this, and you're still barely getting into the playoffs at best but you're up against the cap because of Rodgers deal and at this point he's no good. Do you keep overpaying the guy through his deal just because you have him? Or do you cut and gut? You went all in on getting a wr in the draft but it didn't make an immediate impact and Rodgers declined some more, and the defense was still average at best. You swore to yourself you were just 1 player away from a superbowl and now you're looking at blowing your whole team up and having to start over.


    Listen, I was disappointed myself about this not being a win now draft. Initially, I hated this draft. It's easy to hate right now. The only point I'm trying to make is what it ends up as 4 years from now will tell the story. Have to give it time to play out because any judgement about it right now is just senseless.
    On the 13-3 thing, who cares..if GB went 10-6 and still won to get to NFCC game they got there. As crewfan said in another thread..GB is right there with anyone but SF who was clearly the best team in the NFC. THe rest of the teams were right there. So if you are arguably No. 2 in the NFC...why strictly focus on the future when you are a team upsetting SF away from probably going to the SB?

    Also, I am not one of those hey DRAFT A WR early guy. I would have liked a Hightower or Proche guy later in the draft but that isn't why I dislike the draft. The draft was deep and had difference makers at multiple positions that would have helped and probably are better players. Could have went Blacklock, Baun or Chinn/Gay Jr at 62 and gotten run stuffing DL and ILB to strengthen defense. Just left a lot to be desired IMO and not just because wasn't a WR.

    I am coming around on Dillon. As there was a run on RBs. There was an article on BR https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...re-draft-class that said after Love was the issue...I disagree that it is simply because no WR...it's because the draft was deep at multiple spots that would have helped GB and probably higher upside guys, certainly than Deguara.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by gopackgo87 View Post
    On the 13-3 thing, who cares..if GB went 10-6 and still won to get to NFCC game they got there. As crewfan said in another thread..GB is right there with anyone but SF who was clearly the best team in the NFC. THe rest of the teams were right there. So if you are arguably No. 2 in the NFC...why strictly focus on the future when you are a team upsetting SF away from probably going to the SB?

    Also, I am not one of those hey DRAFT A WR early guy. I would have liked a Hightower or Proche guy later in the draft but that isn't why I dislike the draft. The draft was deep and had difference makers at multiple positions that would have helped and probably are better players. Could have went Blacklock, Baun or Chinn/Gay Jr at 62 and gotten run stuffing DL and ILB to strengthen defense. Just left a lot to be desired IMO and not just because wasn't a WR.

    I am coming around on Dillon. As there was a run on RBs. There was an article on BR https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...re-draft-class that said after Love was the issue...I disagree that it is simply because no WR...it's because the draft was deep at multiple spots that would have helped GB and probably higher upside guys, certainly than Deguara.

    The gap between us and SF is huge. I just donít see an upset in the cards. They thoroughly dominated us, blew us out both times. We added some points late in the playoff game, but that was garbage time.

    And Iím kinda with you on Dillon. He may end up being pretty productive but heís hard to get excited about. Biggest part of the rest of the draft is to me the OL picks seem promising and address a very real need. They may not all end up being starters but if we get viable backups/swing guys, thatís a win.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigfishguy85 View Post
    The gap between us and SF is huge. I just donít see an upset in the cards. They thoroughly dominated us, blew us out both times. We added some points late in the playoff game, but that was garbage time.

    And Iím kinda with you on Dillon. He may end up being pretty productive but heís hard to get excited about. Biggest part of the rest of the draft is to me the OL picks seem promising and address a very real need. They may not all end up being starters but if we get viable backups/swing guys, thatís a win.
    But GB doesn't have to be the team to beat them. I agree the gap is big between GB and SF but no one else can upset them. You are expecting SF to go to the next few SBs? GB matched up with pretty much everyone else well last year.

    On your point about OL...that's been my point on even being even-keeled on the draft...you like they took some R6 OL because it fits a need and your expectation is maybe they can be swing guys....that's not reason to think highly of a draft...also why I wanted them to you know, fill gaps with strong players in the early rounds on good players who can come in and play but also expected to be around a while.

  4. #19
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    I actually really like the philosophy of skipping on a future need position early and drafting a bunch of them late to see if one hits. We've done it at RB and WR in the past and did it at OL this year. No one ever wants to admit it, but most day 3 guys are never going to be your preferred starter. Maybe some start a few games due to injury and a few actually hit and become starters, but when youre getting later in the draft, you have to acknowledge some of those guys are going to be useless.

    So pick a position that maybe isn't a massive need today, but could be a need soon. OL was a decent spot for that this year. Theoretically, no rookie available at any spot in our draft was going to come in and win a starting spot instantly. So try to fill it with late guys. If it works, awesome. If it doesn't, you can address it next offseason. So I like that decision.

    But I agree, it's the decisions prior to taking the lotto ticket OL group that make me scratch my head. On paper, each position is justifiable. I have some concern with the player rankings at that position for guys like Dillon and deguara but even if we put that aside, the positions alone are somewhat defensible. But the positions all grouped together that make it wierd. They all seem a little like luxury picks when we have glaring needs we didn't address elsewhere.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigfishguy85 View Post
    Honestly, this draft could end up looking brilliant 4 years from now. And we won't know any earlier than that. The only thing I don't like about the Love pick is trading up to get him. But if they got the pick right and he ends up being the guy, then that will be a very small price to pay. I don't like our 2nd or 3rd round picks at all. Both seem like reaches. The rest of the draft I'm fine with.

    Also, I think people are too hung up on last year's record and making it to the NFCC game. We were lucky to be there. Our supposedly much improved defense still finished, what, like 20th overall? Our defense still isn't good. Bottom line is this team still has quite a ways to go before it's legitimately a contender. I hope it's not that bad, but we could almost be like the Bears last year- wildly overachieved the year before and then came back to reality. I think 9-10 wins is very likely this year and that has nothing to do with what we did in the draft.

    And I don't think theres any doubt that Rodgers is declining. He still shows flashes, but he can't consistently do what he used to. The frustrating part is he refuses to play within the system and just take whats there. When you look at Brady and Manning, both just took what was there and didn't force stuff and that's a huge part of why they were both successful and productive late into their careers. Rodgers just insists on trying to do too much and prove how good he is and it's backfiring on him.

    If Rodgers continues to decline, many will be ready to move on from him. His level of play simply isn't worth what they're paying him and it's not even close. So two more years of potential decline, and trust me every fan is going to be ready to move on and spend that money elsewhere.

    Last thing I'll say is this. For one, I don't think this came as a huge shock to Rodgers. He talked about the possibility of it before the draft and even made the statement about nobody being able to beat him out for a while. But if this pick does piss Rodgers off, that's good for us. A pissed off Aaron Rodgers is very dangerous.
    The Jordan Love pick could look brilliant, but the draft is not just about 1 pick. Day 2 was worse than day 1 and we got nothing to make the team better this year other than a short yardage/goal line RB.

  6. #21
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    One of my friends gave me this quote which I think represents our draft philosophy this year. He said " We drafted backup's to positions where we had stud's"

    I might not be a brain surgeon, but that doesn't sound like a wise draft philosophy to me.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by HacksawButch View Post
    One of my friends gave me this quote which I think represents our draft philosophy this year. He said " We drafted backup's to positions where we had stud's"

    I might not be a brain surgeon, but that doesn't sound like a wise draft philosophy to me.
    Except, who is your friend and exactly what are his credentials? I.e. why should I consider his opinion valid? I don't agree with his statement at all.

    We don't have a stud TE.
    We don't have studs on the OL, aside from Bakhtiari.
    We don't have a stud at ILB.
    Rodgers is on the decline and clearly doesn't have much time left at his current pay rate, so thinking about his replacement isn't crazy.
    Aaron Jones had 1 good complete year, after having injury issues the previous two. You really mean to tell me that drafting a backup running back- even if that's all this draft pick turns into- is a bad move?

    Your friend's quote makes for a good sound byte but absolutely nothing more. There is zero logical basis behind it.

  8. #23
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    It seems like the Packers didn't draft for need or BPA. No way Deguara was the best player on the board in R3 but he fits what ML wants to do on O. Dillon I don't mind the pick but he has some mileage so hopefully he stays healthy as he is built like a bull.

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