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  1. #91
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    His consensus draft ranking was 62 and Traurman's was 72. This idea that he was far and away the #1 TE is kinda silly. A lot of differing opinions on that one.

    I don't dislike the player that much, but I don't necessarily like him that much either. I think his athleticism is being pretty overrated here too. For his size he's a decent athlete, but his agility testing was poor (13th percentile in 3 cone, 39th percentile in 20 yard)... those tests are used to gauge quickness and lateral agility. He's almost certainly going to be limited to an in-line role, which has value, but also feels out of place in this offense, and as an inexperienced player it will take time for him to develop there.

    I will always maintain that the value simply wasn't there and you could have traded down 10+ spots and gotten him or a comparable player. The way no other TE was drafted for the next 50 something picks is pretty telling.
    Last edited by DamnGoat; 04-30-2020 at 05:17 PM.

  2. #92
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    His Notre Dame coach compared him to Kelce and Eifert.

    3 Cone
    Kelce - 7.09
    Eifert - 6.92
    Kmet - 7.44
    Shaheen - 7.09

    Recievers on average run a 6.9, TE run 7.17.

    His agility tests concern me a bit. Shaheen had better testing agility but that never showed up on the field. Hopefully his true athletic potential is shown by his broad/vert jumping ability. He did just turn 21, there's still time to refine his agility and he hasn't hit his athletic peak yet.

    Still....Trade down. Even a few slots. Like most here, hated the value. Even if they moved down and stayed in the 40's while picking up 1 mid round pick I wouldn't have minded grabbing him as much.


    All in all. At least we aren't the Packers. I would take our draft over theirs even though they had more picks and a 1st rounder.
    Their TE reach was so much worse. Josiah whatever was projected 6/7th round and went before Trautman in the 3rd.

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by DamnGoat View Post
    His consensus draft ranking was 62 and Traurman's was 72. This idea that he was far and away the #1 TE is kinda silly. A lot of differing opinions on that one.

    I don't dislike the player that much, but I don't necessarily like him that much either. I think his athleticism is being pretty overrated here too. For his size he's a decent athlete, but his agility testing was poor (13th percentile in 3 cone, 39th percentile in 20 yard)... those tests are used to gauge quickness and lateral agility. He's almost certainly going to be limited to an in-line role, which has value, but also feels out of place in this offense, and as an inexperienced player it will take time for him to develop there.

    I will always maintain that the value simply wasn't there and you could have traded down 10+ spots and gotten him or a comparable player. The way no other TE was drafted for the next 50 something picks is pretty telling.
    I think i can agree Kmet might have been later on my board and a reach.... but honestly anyone who liked Trautman needs to realize how similar he is to Shaheen. There is a reason nobody reached on him. I think there is no debate that in most eyes Kmet was the best TE in the draft.


    ‎"If your going to be thinking anyway, you might as well think big"

    -Rem Koolhaas

  4. #94
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    Trautman moves way better than Adam on the field. I wouldn’t been mad at him and there was a reason why NO traded up for him he’s legit nice


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

  5. #95
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    I mean seriously comparing Shaheen to Trautman. Lets honestly take a look

    40 time :4.79 v 4.8
    Reps : 24 vs 18
    Vert 32.5 vs 34.5
    Broad : 121 vs 114
    3 Cone: 7.09 vs 6.78
    20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.38 vs 4.27

    And I know alot of people will look at this and say Clearly Trautman is better because his 3 cone (which some people swear by) are so much better. But there is one major diference about these two coming out that NOBODY brings up.

    Shaheen was 278Lbs and Trautman was 255. So Shaheen did what he did While carrying an extra 23 pounds. So there is plenty of expectation that should Shaheen get in better Shape and tone down... some of those numbers.... espeically the agility ones.... could improve.


    But its pretty clear that any Big TE can put up big numbers in a Division 3 school. His 57 catches for 887 Yards his final year was not quite as good as Trautman at 70 for 916.... But the truth is they are similar and Drafting Trautman would have seriously felt like drafting Shaheen again.

    Im glad we went this way as opposed to going with trautman. The truth is IMO Shaheen still has potential. Everyone talks about how TEs take a while and dont devleop. Well shaheen has only played in 27 games. His injuries are a concern but if you liked trautman you still have your version of him in your back pocket. Maybe he devleops... maybe he flops out. But Trautman would have been very similar.


    ‎"If your going to be thinking anyway, you might as well think big"

    -Rem Koolhaas

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by La_bibbers View Post
    The sources of praise you listed for Kmet are: his college coach and the NFL GM & HC he was drafted by. Of course they're singing his praises. Outside of guys around Kmet, ND, and the Bears, the pick has not been well received. It's not agreed upon that he was the best player available, and it was debatable before the draft that he was even the best tight end. I have a hard time believing at the very least, he was much better than the rest of them to justify being picked 50 picks ahead of the next one.

    It was a position of need. That's the only reason why it's not a straight up F grade. But I stand by the D grade I gave it before.
    Mel Kiper Jr.
    “He was, clearly, in my opinion, slightly ahead of Adam Trautman of Dayton as the best tight end in this draft, and he’ll be a weapon for whether it’s Nick Foles or Mitchell Trubisky.”
    Lance Zierlein
    “He’s still developing and could be a slow starter headed into the league, but he has the talent to eventually become a solid starter as a pass-catching in-line tight end with the ability to mismatch from the slot with his size.”
    Jeff Dickerson
    Kmet -- the consensus top tight end in the 2020 draft class -- finished his career at Notre Dame with 60 catches for 691 yards and six touchdowns.
    Matt Miller
    Kmet has all of the tools NFL teams want in a three-down tight end. He's big enough to play next to the tackle, can help in the run game and is a vertical threat up the seam. While he might not have world-class athleticism or straight-line speed, Kmet is athletic enough to beat linebackers and safeties in his routes. He projects as the best tight end in the 2020 class and should be a rookie starter or high-level contributor.
    I totally support your opinion, but say "outside of guys around Kmet... the pick was not well received" here are four that I found that disagree. All who felt he was the top TE of the draft. An "F-to-D" is a terrible grade imo, but it's yours to give.

    In a perfect draft at #43, who would the bears needed to draft to get an A?

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyben36 View Post
    I mean seriously comparing Shaheen to Trautman. Lets honestly take a look

    40 time :4.79 v 4.8
    Reps : 24 vs 18
    Vert 32.5 vs 34.5
    Broad : 121 vs 114
    3 Cone: 7.09 vs 6.78
    20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.38 vs 4.27
    combine numbers are a part of the draft. Every year there are some phenomenal players with insane stats that never pan out. ones with okay stats that are freaks. Hell, look at Jerry Rice or Tom Brady, both had okay combines. or look at the fast WR in the draft, should they be the first WR taken (Al Davis would agree)?

    Consider the best TE in NFL History, Tony Gonzales
    40 time :4.79 v 4.8 - TG - 4.83
    Reps : 24 vs 18 - TG - NA
    Vert 32.5 vs 34.5 - TG - 33.5"
    Broad : 121 vs 114 - TG - NA
    3 Cone: 7.09 vs 6.78 - TG - 7.75
    20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.38 vs 4.27 - TG - 4.06

    bit dated, but my point, the TE with the best 3 cone drill is not always the best TE.

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by hester23fan4va View Post
    Mel Kiper Jr.

    Lance Zierlein

    Jeff Dickerson

    Matt Miller

    I totally support your opinion, but say "outside of guys around Kmet... the pick was not well received" here are four that I found that disagree. All who felt he was the top TE of the draft. An "F-to-D" is a terrible grade imo, but it's yours to give.

    In a perfect draft at #43, who would the bears needed to draft to get an A?
    Meh. It's not hard to dig up a few positive reactions. There were plenty of more impactful talents available at positions of need. Antoine Winfield, Denzel Mims, Ezra Cleveland, Grant Delpit, etc all would've gotten solid A grades from me. I'm sure there are others I'm not thinking of. That or they should've traded down and taken TE later.

  9. #99
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    I would have preferred Chinn, Winfield, and Mims. Those are just 3 off the top of my head and I know all 3 had consensus rankings higher than Kmet. Or just trade back 20 spots, still take Johnson at 50, go with Kmet or Trautman with the next pick, and hopefully grab a 3rd and/or 4th to go along with it (depends on how far you're moving down.

    Even if all you'd have gotten in the trade down was the 2nd & 4th, in the 4th you'd have a chance at Saahdiq Charles, Ben Bartch, K'Von Wallace, James Morgan, Jack Driscoll, Tyler Biadasz, and more...all at positions of need (OT, OG, S, QB) and more NFL ready than some of the guys they settled for late (especially the OL prospects).
    Last edited by DamnGoat; 05-01-2020 at 05:11 PM.

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by La_bibbers View Post
    Meh. It's not hard to dig up a few positive reactions. There were plenty of more impactful talents available at positions of need. Antoine Winfield, Denzel Mims, Ezra Cleveland, Grant Delpit, etc all would've gotten solid A grades from me. I'm sure there are others I'm not thinking of. That or they should've traded down and taken TE later.
    Matt Miller seemed the be the only real positive one. The others were more just saying giving bio snapshots.

  11. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by hester23fan4va View Post
    combine numbers are a part of the draft. Every year there are some phenomenal players with insane stats that never pan out. ones with okay stats that are freaks. Hell, look at Jerry Rice or Tom Brady, both had okay combines. or look at the fast WR in the draft, should they be the first WR taken (Al Davis would agree)?

    Consider the best TE in NFL History, Tony Gonzales
    40 time :4.79 v 4.8 - TG - 4.83
    Reps : 24 vs 18 - TG - NA
    Vert 32.5 vs 34.5 - TG - 33.5"
    Broad : 121 vs 114 - TG - NA
    3 Cone: 7.09 vs 6.78 - TG - 7.75
    20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.38 vs 4.27 - TG - 4.06

    bit dated, but my point, the TE with the best 3 cone drill is not always the best TE.
    i actually took the time to look at the best 3 cone times.... because the way sone talk around here its the be all end all of draftabable combine stats. If u want to take a look yourself tell me how far down the list you have to get till u find somebody who made an impact as an nfl player

    https://www.pro-football-reference.c...order_by_asc=Y
    Last edited by Kyben36; 05-01-2020 at 05:37 PM.


    ‎"If your going to be thinking anyway, you might as well think big"

    -Rem Koolhaas

  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by ds637 View Post
    Matt Miller seemed the be the only real positive one. The others were more just saying giving bio snapshots.
    Mel did give the pick an A grade, even though the citation used didn't reflect that. Otherwise, I agree, but didn't wanna nitpick.

  13. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stunner View Post
    Trautman moves way better than Adam on the field. I wouldn’t been mad at him and there was a reason why NO traded up for him he’s legit nice


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    I 100% disagree. You can tell me via your eyes he does but go back and watch Adam Shaheen vs D3 level comp and he looks alot more athletic than he does vs NFL players. I think Trautman will be very similar and not be able to use what is clearly the best athlete on the field excuse anymore.


    ‎"If your going to be thinking anyway, you might as well think big"

    -Rem Koolhaas

  14. #104
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    The funny thing is though.... Some people who are the most critical of this are also the same people saying that Jimmy Greham was overpaid and will bust. So are you OK with going into the season with Jimmy G as your only proven guy...... or do you think we should have drafted somebody. To me you cant have it both ways and make any sense.

    And I get it... I would have prefered to go a different way myself. Trade Down specifically because we needed more assets..... but I would have taken Chinn over Kmet and ran with 2 roks. but maybe the FO doesnt want two roks on the back end. IDK. But at least we didnt reach on somebody other than the guy most are calling the best TE in this draft.


    ‎"If your going to be thinking anyway, you might as well think big"

    -Rem Koolhaas

  15. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by La_bibbers View Post
    Mel did give the pick an A grade, even though the citation used didn't reflect that. Otherwise, I agree, but didn't wanna nitpick.
    Dickerson said he was best in the draft, how is that not a positive comment? I'm sure there are opinions of every nature, that's why i have no issue with yours.

    Quote Originally Posted by La_bibbers View Post
    Meh. It's not hard to dig up a few positive reactions. There were plenty of more impactful talents available at positions of need. Antoine Winfield, Denzel Mims, Ezra Cleveland, Grant Delpit, etc all would've gotten solid A grades from me. I'm sure there are others I'm not thinking of. That or they should've traded down and taken TE later.
    the traded down argument, as if 31 other teams were willing to trade for 43. Can't know that, will never know that. Assuming that wasn't an option, we'll just have to see how those guys plan out. Regardless, getting the guy they want whether first or second or third, why not? better than hoping and not getting. what's the phrase, 1 in the hand is better than 2 in the bush.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyben36 View Post
    The funny thing is though.... Some people who are the most critical of this are also the same people saying that Jimmy Greham was overpaid and will bust. So are you OK with going into the season with Jimmy G as your only proven guy...... or do you think we should have drafted somebody. To me you cant have it both ways and make any sense.

    And I get it... I would have prefered to go a different way myself. Trade Down specifically because we needed more assets..... but I would have taken Chinn over Kmet and ran with 2 roks. but maybe the FO doesnt want two roks on the back end. IDK. But at least we didnt reach on somebody other than the guy most are calling the best TE in this draft.
    I made the same point and it's a good one. Best TE in the draft, at #43, solid to good pick. I'd give it a B, B-. The defense was great last year and yeah there were holes all over, but the most glaring was TE for sure. As Nagy/Pace agree it's essential to this offense.

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