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  1. #2071
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiteWolf View Post
    That seems convenient doesn't it? NY's early issues had nothing to do with a delay in reaction, it was luck and resources? And...isn't California a blue state? And Arizona considered purple?

    I just get tired of trying to make everything political when quite often that's highly debatable. For that reason I should just exit this forum because it's quite obvious non-'progressives' views aren't wanted, despite the fact the point of forums is for discussion of all viewpoints
    I guess I do not understand your point.

    New York City was the initial epicenter for reasons that were largely apolitical. Luck, yes. But I also said logistics mattered, and we know now that cities, especially those that are travel hubs and which rely heavily on public transportation, are far more vulnerable than rural areas. I also said lack of resources, which includes lack of knowledge about the virus, especially in its early manifestations.

    How is any of that political?

  2. #2072
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiteWolf View Post
    That seems convenient doesn't it? NY's early issues had nothing to do with a delay in reaction, it was luck and resources? And...isn't California a blue state? And Arizona considered purple?

    I just get tired of trying to make everything political when quite often that's highly debatable. For that reason I should just exit this forum because it's quite obvious non-'progressives' views aren't wanted, despite the fact the point of forums is for discussion of all viewpoints
    Why do you think you aren't wanted? Everyone in here will get bashed by a few people on certain sides and so on no matter what. It is a bit different than other forums in that way but would hate to lose some of your insight. You seem very genuine in your opinions and not playing a team game, I think you should ignore some of the labels thrown around if you can. It's just gonna happen a lot on here but plenty of people/posters can see past it as well. You seem to be a Republican that doesn't agree with a lot of the current Republican/Trump way for example so while you see yourself as that label others are likely meaning to describe a certain type of thing not just anyone who considers themselves that necessarily and some are just partisan hacks and some might have a point as well you just gotta figure out what they meant.

    I think you have a point with NY for sure, they have some specific reasoning in the way they handled it that can be pointed to. Initially though everyone was caught off guard. Where it hit's first is kinda luck because it hit before we really knew much. At this point though we have had plenty of time to get ready and recover. Some states have handled this very politically instead of necessarily going with the science and hitting guidelines set to reopen by many experts etc. more so going with what Trump/administration have been pushing to reopen quick.

    I want your viewpoint here though, to be clear either way your opinions on this topic. I think what Crovash said there makes sense though if you think about it. You have a point with NY but the general reasoning and time and what we knew then and now all point to now being more of based on our political leaders decision in how to handle than where it maybe showed up first/what we knew/resources at the time to slow spread and handle since it was so new.

  3. #2073
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Florida and Texas closed bars again. Florida saw 8,900 new cases in a single day.

    Where’s Brewers with all the updates about how the numbers aren’t going up after re-opening when you need him.
    He is still telling himself what a great job deSantis is doing.

  4. #2074
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    Arizona has the most cases per capita in the world!

    Think about that for a second, their worst than NY was or worse than Brazil is right now.

    Their is an article showing the terrible handling of the virus by their governor there.

  5. #2075
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    I guess I do not understand your point.

    New York City was the initial epicenter for reasons that were largely apolitical. Luck, yes. But I also said logistics mattered, and we know now that cities, especially those that are travel hubs and which rely heavily on public transportation, are far more vulnerable than rural areas. I also said lack of resources, which includes lack of knowledge about the virus, especially in its early manifestations.

    How is any of that political?
    well I have far more question about the current situation being political than the early situation being apolitical, so I'll give you that.................but let's look at what I responded to- the comment that Texas opened to 'rah rah' for Trump and didn't take it seriously like the blue states

    well there are blue states with problems currently, too....it's Sun Belt states with the problems, primarily
    But even that, a significantly higher percentage of new COVID cases are people under 35. If I'm thinking politically, I'm suggesting the significant percentage of young people who are NOT Republican....but I'm not seeing it that way....as the weather runs to summer, states have opened up, more young people have gotten together in large groups....and most of those new positives in that age group are asymptomatic, so it's not like I'm placing blame on them.............I'm just countering the idea that the increases now are because of Trump-supporting state and local governments.

    Even with the spreads we've seen...if you don't drill down, you don't see what's really gone on. South Dakota left control of shutdowns to local governments, the state NEVER shut down. Until recently, when a few college students came back to the local campus and a small spread started, I went this entire time never being within 45 miles of over 10 positive cases....even now it's under 20. And this is the way the bulk of the state has gone. However, for awhile, one of the hottest spots in the country was 60 miles from me...for awhile the 2 counties our largest 'metro' area crosses had 95% of the entire state's positive cases. Why? In large part because a meat packing plant remained open as essential and many of their employees are immigrants and many of those immigrants live in closer quarters than most of us do. The 2 other spreads we had in this state more recently were similar. NONE of that remotely political.
    gotta love 'referential' treatment

  6. #2076
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    Quote Originally Posted by mngopher35 View Post
    Why do you think you aren't wanted? Everyone in here will get bashed by a few people on certain sides and so on no matter what. It is a bit different than other forums in that way but would hate to lose some of your insight. You seem very genuine in your opinions and not playing a team game, I think you should ignore some of the labels thrown around if you can. It's just gonna happen a lot on here but plenty of people/posters can see past it as well. You seem to be a Republican that doesn't agree with a lot of the current Republican/Trump way for example so while you see yourself as that label others are likely meaning to describe a certain type of thing not just anyone who considers themselves that necessarily and some are just partisan hacks and some might have a point as well you just gotta figure out what they meant.

    I think you have a point with NY for sure, they have some specific reasoning in the way they handled it that can be pointed to. Initially though everyone was caught off guard. Where it hit's first is kinda luck because it hit before we really knew much. At this point though we have had plenty of time to get ready and recover. Some states have handled this very politically instead of necessarily going with the science and hitting guidelines set to reopen by many experts etc. more so going with what Trump/administration have been pushing to reopen quick.

    I want your viewpoint here though, to be clear either way your opinions on this topic. I think what Crovash said there makes sense though if you think about it. You have a point with NY but the general reasoning and time and what we knew then and now all point to now being more of based on our political leaders decision in how to handle than where it maybe showed up first/what we knew/resources at the time to slow spread and handle since it was so new.
    oh, I'm not necessarily going anywhere....but pre-COVID you never saw me here because pre-COVID I was doing what I've done for years- staying away from the news, staying away from politics as much as possible. Not because I don't want to stay informed, not because I don't have my views....but because most of the news just pisses me off as does most of the political talk. I have enough stress in my life without immersing myself in more.

    But yes, as I've mentioned, I'm an older white Christian registered Republican who would certainly lean conservative, but in no way stand with the party I'm currently registered with....but in no way stand with the platform of the Democrats. The term right wing bothers me because these days it's often used by Dems as a negative reference to those on the extreme...which I am not...but as a Republican, many assume is true....and as a Christian some assume is true. That's part of what can raise my neck hairs- too many assumptions from all sides.
    gotta love 'referential' treatment

  7. #2077
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiteWolf View Post
    well I have far more question about the current situation being political than the early situation being apolitical, so I'll give you that.................but let's look at what I responded to- the comment that Texas opened to 'rah rah' for Trump and didn't take it seriously like the blue states
    I understand, and you are correct to point out that there are blue states currently in trouble, just as there are some red states (it may shed light that the poster to whom you responded is, by his own admission even, highly partisan and vehemently anti-Trump). However, an argument can be made that reopening state economies as has occurred is both a political enterprise — though hardly restricted to one side of the ideological spectrum — and one that has led to an unfortunate resurgence of the epidemic.

    Quote Originally Posted by SiteWolf View Post
    well there are blue states with problems currently, too....it's Sun Belt states with the problems, primarily. But even that, a significantly higher percentage of new COVID cases are people under 35. If I'm thinking politically, I'm suggesting the significant percentage of young people who are NOT Republican....but I'm not seeing it that way....as the weather runs to summer, states have opened up, more young people have gotten together in large groups....and most of those new positives in that age group are asymptomatic, so it's not like I'm placing blame on them.............
    I get it, but as I wrote in an earlier post: “death rates follow contraction rates by around 10 days. More important, there will be a time gap between when the infected less vulnerable population pass the virus up the age ladder. When those numbers catch up, so too will hospitalizations and deaths.”

    Quote Originally Posted by SiteWolf View Post
    Even with the spreads we've seen...if you don't drill down, you don't see what's really gone on. South Dakota left control of shutdowns to local governments, the state NEVER shut down. Until recently, when a few college students came back to the local campus and a small spread started, I went this entire time never being within 45 miles of over 10 positive cases....even now it's under 20. And this is the way the bulk of the state has gone. However, for awhile, one of the hottest spots in the country was 60 miles from me...for awhile the 2 counties our largest 'metro' area crosses had 95% of the entire state's positive cases. Why? In large part because a meat packing plant remained open as essential and many of their employees are immigrants and many of those immigrants live in closer quarters than most of us do. The 2 other spreads we had in this state more recently were similar. NONE of that remotely political.
    Inasmuch as politics in this country is intertwined with economics (you’d be hard pressed to deny this), then I would have to say that there is a political component in your example, at least on the systemic level.

  8. #2078
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    The virus is non-partisan. That it nailed five blue states at the outset (NY, NJ, CT, MA, RI) was a matter of luck, logistics, and lack of resources.

    That it has switched now to red states is arguably more a matter of politics than the earlier iteration in the northeast.
    Don't group Rhode island in that **** we've been low this whole time. 95% of our deaths are nursing home

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  9. #2079
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lil Rhody View Post
    Don't group Rhode island in that **** we've been low this whole time. 95% of our deaths are nursing home
    Right. Of course, how silly of me; those people don’t count.

  10. #2080
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    Right. Of course, how silly of me; those people don’t count.
    Dude it ain't about that




    Out state was in with Conn and Mass we all make the same restrictions and take them away aat the same time. This state has been in the top 10 with everything for not having it bad but yet since we are in a gov pac we got ****ed




    If you don't live here you don't know

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  11. #2081
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    Also while we're at it. **** m*******s and people from Connecticut we have 50% parking at beaches they have nothing and they all flock here and we can't even enjoy our own ****. How's that supposed to stop the spread as well. Let in people from the hot states cooooooooll

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  12. #2082
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lil Rhody View Post
    Dude it ain't about that.

    Out state was in with Conn and Mass we all make the same restrictions and take them away aat the same time. This state has been in the top 10 with everything for not having it bad but yet since we are in a gov pac we got ****ed.

    If you don't live here you don't know
    I know that Rhode Island has the fifth highest mortality rate (per population) of any state in the country (behind the other four I listed).

    I said absolutely nothing about how it was handled.

    Nursing home deaths or not, my point is accurate: “That it nailed five blue states at the outset (NY, NJ, CT, MA, RI) was a matter of luck, logistics, and lack of resources.“

  13. #2083
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiteWolf View Post
    There are plenty of blue states that have had their own problems with COVID spread. Viruses aren't political and while governments are, individuals in all these states aren't doing what they're doing for political gain. Every blue state has non-Democrats and every red state has non-Republicans.
    Have you seen the chart mapping Trump vs Clinton states and counties? Because while the virus isn’t political, the response to it is. Conservatives have mocked wearing a mask. Liberals have embraced it. Same for gloves, social distancing, etc.

  14. #2084
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  15. #2085
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    Texas is shutting down again because of their failed response to COVID. They wanted to rah-rah for Trump and pretend like nothing is going on and now they are paying the price. If they had taken it seriously like the bluer states in the country or Europe, who knows where we might be as a nation.
    Bunch of pendejos in Texas.

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