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  1. #1861
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    So youíre saying your last paragraph contradicts your first one?

    Are all those measures things we know will reduce the transmission or things we will project will reduce transmission?
    When I said "there are no answers" I meant in the overall situation and strategy there is nothing final, not the tactics, and I wasn't saying there was no data obviously.
    Last edited by Scoots; 06-09-2020 at 04:41 PM.

  2. #1862
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    Quote Originally Posted by spliff(TONE) View Post
    So is this an answer? Because it sounds more like a guess that you're sharing because it supports what you WANT to believe.
    No, it's another question. I don't WANT to believe anything. I just have questions. That's how science works.

  3. #1863
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    Blams said it better than I did, but that was my point. We have answers, given the data that is currently available. Maybe that data changes later as we get further into the event, but until it does, he outlined the answers we have; they are not guesses. Will they eradicate the virus? Of course not, but as Wolf pointed out, that is not even a question most of us are asking yet.

    The problem is that we donít like the answers that science has given us thus far.

  4. #1864
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    Glad to see that the guy who almost certainly masterminded the GOP's plan to expose various Democratic legislators in Pennsylvania is retiring.

    https://www.inquirer.com/politics/pe...-20200609.html

    I just wish he wasn't using that position in government to profit.
    Let's get embedded tweets working again!

    https://forums.prosportsdaily.com/sh...5#post33780085

  5. #1865
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    Blams said it better than I did, but that was my point. We have answers, given the data that is currently available. Maybe that data changes later as we get further into the event, but until it does, he outlined the answers we have; they are not guesses. Will they eradicate the virus? Of course not, but as Wolf pointed out, that is not even a question most of us are asking yet.

    The problem is that we donít like the answers that science has given us thus far.
    If the person coming up with the "answer" doesn't have all the data it's not THE answer, it's an educated guess, and there is no expert in this whole situation. Those people don't exist.

    I'm not against the shelter in place, I'm not against the masks, I'm not mad about any of this stuff. I'm just contrarian and pedantic and it bugs me when people say "just" anything in an argument. There is nothing "just" about this situation. We don't know far more than we do know ... and no matter what the "just" people say, the economic impact REALLY matters in the ongoing health impact of this pandemic. It also bugs me that the ongoing and increasing psychological toll being taken on people by this is largely dismissed bu the "just" people.

  6. #1866
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    Big shocker: cases spiking in 20+ states.

    https://youtu.be/kL6_kdO721U

  7. #1867
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    There is nothing "common" about this whole thing. And letting fear drive your decisions doesn't always make the best decisions.
    Being safe, smart, and respectful is not equivalent to letting fear drive your decisions last I checked. Though I love it how so many people think they're tough of courageous or something for denying science and going about their lives as if everything is normal.

  8. #1868
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    Did you read what I wrote? What you replied to? Texas HAD to start re-opening by law. The state constitution set the limit at 30 days.

    And how have "the numbers" shown a result when we are far from done with this?
    Do you have a citation to back this claim up? Because I've never heard or seen evidence to back upanything of the sort.

  9. #1869
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    It also bugs me that the ongoing and increasing psychological toll being taken on people by this is largely dismissed bu the "just" people.
    I am curious who was doing this, can you quote them?

  10. #1870
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    Quote Originally Posted by spliff(TONE) View Post
    Being safe, smart, and respectful is not equivalent to letting fear drive your decisions last I checked. Though I love it how so many people think they're tough of courageous or something for denying science and going about their lives as if everything is normal.
    You don't think people allow fear to make decisions? Fear of negative PR drives politicians constantly.

    Where did I deny science? What I said was scientific ... we don't have the data yet to have THE answer, we have ideas for tactics and some people have suggested one strategy and some have suggested other strategies.

    Some of that conviction is paper thin, but it feels good so it's pushed hard.

    Fear drives people's decisions on where to live, where to shop, what to drive, what to eat, where to eat and on and on. It's not the only factor, but it is a factor.

  11. #1871
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    Quote Originally Posted by spliff(TONE) View Post
    Do you have a citation to back this claim up? Because I've never heard or seen evidence to back upanything of the sort.
    The former I read in the paper in April. I'll see if I can find it.

    The latter there is no way to support it other than to say that Corona is still a problem so clearly we can have no conclusion yet.

  12. #1872
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    Quote Originally Posted by mngopher35 View Post
    I am curious who was doing this, can you quote them?
    I see no point in finding people saying "just stay home, wear a mask, maintain social distance" ... often followed with calling someone stupid for not listening to science and trying to kill people if they have questions about it.

    Have you really not seen or heard people saying things like that?

    And to be clear, I'm not rushing out of my house and protesting and making a big deal about it, I can just see that not everyone is capable of staying isolated indefinitely and people who do have issues doing so shouldn't be called idiots and killers as a blanket position.
    Last edited by Scoots; 06-10-2020 at 03:36 PM.

  13. #1873
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    I see no point in finding people saying "just stay home, wear a mask, maintain social distance" ... often followed with calling someone stupid for not listening to science and trying to kill people if they have questions about it.

    Have you really not seen or heard people saying things like that?
    Sure but you are responding to people on here and I see tons mocking those wearing masks and so on as well it isn't just a one way thing and often it's the more extremes pushing any attacks not some norm or anything associated with these conversations. This doesn't seem to make much sense in the way you generalized a group nor get to the claim you made. I know some people out there do some things, that doesn't mean we generalize people in some us vs them fashion (you often say this and both sides when it isn't you making the point FYI).

    You made a comment about this type of group of people LARGELY dismissing the psychological toll on others. I am curious on where/how on here or if it was more just an us vs them thing since they see it different than you?

  14. #1874
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    If the person coming up with the "answer" doesn't have all the data it's not THE answer, it's an educated guess, and there is no expert in this whole situation. Those people don't exist.

    I'm not against the shelter in place, I'm not against the masks, I'm not mad about any of this stuff. I'm just contrarian and pedantic and it bugs me when people say "just" anything in an argument. There is nothing "just" about this situation. We don't know far more than we do know ... and no matter what the "just" people say, the economic impact REALLY matters in the ongoing health impact of this pandemic. It also bugs me that the ongoing and increasing psychological toll being taken on people by this is largely dismissed bu the "just" people.
    You donít think there are experts on pandemic responses?

    You are contrarian, we all know that. But youíre being contrarian for the sake of it here, not for any logical reason. Youíre trying to do the middle, 50/50 proposition again.

    We KNOW a lot more about this than youíre giving us credit for and we have people who KNOW a lot more about how to handle these situations than youíre giving us credit for.

    I think itís fair to say it bugs all of us that because you have a contrarian opinion youíre acting like science is completely in the dark about what is happening and what to do.

  15. #1875
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    You don't think people allow fear to make decisions? Fear of negative PR drives politicians constantly.

    Where did I deny science? What I said was scientific ... we don't have the data yet to have THE answer, we have ideas for tactics and some people have suggested one strategy and some have suggested other strategies.

    Some of that conviction is paper thin, but it feels good so it's pushed hard.

    Fear drives people's decisions on where to live, where to shop, what to drive, what to eat, where to eat and on and on. It's not the only factor, but it is a factor.
    This is the kind of 50/50 nonsense Iím talking about that you always try to push.

    People have suggested one strategy and some have suggested other strategies? You act like both sides are being equally represented. A single country on earth tried it a different way and now itís ďwell there are many different opinionsĒ.

    There are several things from which there is virtual unanimity from by experts and professionals. Itís why the administration had to go searching for Doctors to support their position to open the country up, because the vast majority of medical professionals said it was not a good idea.

    Stop with this both sides crap for everything and save it for when itís actually merited.

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