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  1. #1846
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    Didn't seem out of place to me. One person was arguing from a position of loss and the other responded with their basis for perspective.

    This whole thing sucks, but nobody has answers. It's all still just guesses.
    It is and after time everybody is going to start viewing it in a narrowed lens of how it has personally affected them.

    My grandfather is in a very small assisted living house in the suburbs of Minneapolis with 4 people living there. A worker was ill and tested right away and tested positive so obviously based on where he works they tested the 4 people living there right away. 3 of the 4 people living in the house have now been tested positive and the 4th I heard they are going to test again in a few days. I don't know the worker, and you would hope someone who works in a house like this would take it seriously, but you never know. As time goes on people are going to go out more and more, and those working with high-risk people are going to be affected even more.

  2. #1847
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    This whole thing sucks, but nobody has answers. It's all still just guesses.
    You are maybe correct that the whole thing sucks, but, by the same token, it is not just guesses.

    There are answers. The problem is that we donít like the answers.

  3. #1848
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    You are maybe correct that the whole thing sucks, but, by the same token, it is not just guesses.

    There are answers. The problem is that we donít like the answers.
    another problem is we're this far into it and we don't even know all the questions
    gotta love 'referential' treatment

  4. #1849
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    You are maybe correct that the whole thing sucks, but, by the same token, it is not just guesses.

    There are answers. The problem is that we donít like the answers.
    There are no answers. There are projections. There are ideas. Even then not all the ideas suggested are possible. But we don't KNOW which decision is RIGHT. Some options feel better than others but that's a personal perspective. It's going to take decades to be able to get a clearer picture, and even then the "experts" looking back at this will still disagree with decisions made here and there but the disagreements won't be consistent. We'll have dozens or hundreds of studies and papers and books on the subject, but there won't ever be consensus.

    But it's truly alarming to me all the basic things we still don't know now 7 months in. Can you get it again? What is the transmission window?

    The sad thing about all this is that from day 1 it's been the same. Wash your hands, don't touch your face, keep your distance from other people, stay home ... but all of that has been qualified from day 1 with "if you can". And some people couldn't. It's not surprising that fewer people can from one day to the next.

  5. #1850
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pierzynski4Prez View Post
    I'm not trying to equate cancer to Covid by any means here, but the spread of Covid is able to be prevented and is obviously has killed 113k people in just under 3 months (600k/year for Cancer).
    To the bold: No, it's not. It's possible to minimize it, but we do need to understand that at some point everyone is going to be exposed to Corona.

    What we can do is hope to get enough time for the medical researchers to have better treatments, vaccines, or other preventatives. Unfortunately that usually takes a long time.

    If we can get a vaccine close to as effective as the regular flu vaccine we may lose another 100k next year.

    Of course, if you can get it again then the risk will be higher than that ... but we don't know yet.

  6. #1851
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    There are no answers. There are projections. There are ideas. Even then not all the ideas suggested are possible. But we don't KNOW which decision is RIGHT. Some options feel better than others but that's a personal perspective. It's going to take decades to be able to get a clearer picture, and even then the "experts" looking back at this will still disagree with decisions made here and there but the disagreements won't be consistent. We'll have dozens or hundreds of studies and papers and books on the subject, but there won't ever be consensus.

    But it's truly alarming to me all the basic things we still don't know now 7 months in. Can you get it again? What is the transmission window?

    The sad thing about all this is that from day 1 it's been the same. Wash your hands, don't touch your face, keep your distance from other people, stay home ... but all of that has been qualified from day 1 with "if you can". And some people couldn't. It's not surprising that fewer people can from one day to the next.
    There is a general scientific consensus for all of it. People should social distance, wear mask, and not have more than 10 people in a gathering. People shouldn't be going in others' houses unless absolutely necessary.

    Anything aside from those recommendations is wrong- even as data changes in the future.


    That's just how science works. Using the best accepted data at the time , you're right. Even if you're wrong looking back years later.


    Conclusions that differ from the consensus don't have the data to support it

    Garbage in, garbage out. As the data improves, the output improves. Doesnt make the conclusions that experts have now wrong.

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  7. #1852
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    To the bold: No, it's not. It's possible to minimize it, but we do need to understand that at some point everyone is going to be exposed to Corona.

    What we can do is hope to get enough time for the medical researchers to have better treatments, vaccines, or other preventatives. Unfortunately that usually takes a long time.

    If we can get a vaccine close to as effective as the regular flu vaccine we may lose another 100k next year.

    Of course, if you can get it again then the risk will be higher than that ... but we don't know yet.
    Correct, thereís a number of better terms I couldíve used there. Slow the spread is one.

  8. #1853
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    There are no answers. There are projections. There are ideas. Even then not all the ideas suggested are possible. But we don't KNOW which decision is RIGHT. Some options feel better than others but that's a personal perspective. It's going to take decades to be able to get a clearer picture, and even then the "experts" looking back at this will still disagree with decisions made here and there but the disagreements won't be consistent. We'll have dozens or hundreds of studies and papers and books on the subject, but there won't ever be consensus.

    But it's truly alarming to me all the basic things we still don't know now 7 months in. Can you get it again? What is the transmission window?

    The sad thing about all this is that from day 1 it's been the same. Wash your hands, don't touch your face, keep your distance from other people, stay home ... but all of that has been qualified from day 1 with "if you can". And some people couldn't. It's not surprising that fewer people can from one day to the next.
    Yes there are still things we donít know and there are some things for which we donít have answers, but youíre making it sound like we donít know anything and everything is a guess. That is just not true.

    There are some things we do know and some steps that we do know are effective. You really think we have zero idea how to ha duke this or that every decision is a projection?

    As if weíre like ďWe have NO idea if telling everyone to social distance and stand six feet apart is better than to tell everyone to French kiss everyone they see. We just have no idea which one will minimize transmissionĒ.

    Címon. Thereís much wwe do know, even if thereís much we donít.

  9. #1854
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    To the bold: No, it's not. It's possible to minimize it, but we do need to understand that at some point everyone is going to be exposed to Corona.

    What we can do is hope to get enough time for the medical researchers to have better treatments, vaccines, or other preventatives. Unfortunately that usually takes a long time.

    If we can get a vaccine close to as effective as the regular flu vaccine we may lose another 100k next year.

    Of course, if you can get it again then the risk will be higher than that ... but we don't know yet.
    Yes it is. Everyone dies. We take precautions to try and avoid dying. Now there risk and rewarded that go along with that. This is the same thing


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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps08-09 Champ View Post
    My dick is named 'Ewing'.

  10. #1855
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    Quote Originally Posted by blams View Post
    There is a general scientific consensus for all of it. People should social distance, wear mask, and not have more than 10 people in a gathering. People shouldn't be going in others' houses unless absolutely necessary.

    Anything aside from those recommendations is wrong- even as data changes in the future.


    That's just how science works. Using the best accepted data at the time , you're right. Even if you're wrong looking back years later.


    Conclusions that differ from the consensus don't have the data to support it

    Garbage in, garbage out. As the data improves, the output improves. Doesnt make the conclusions that experts have now wrong.
    Did you read what I wrote? You started by saying something very similar to my last paragraph, but left out a very important part.

    And yes, more data doesn't necessarily make the conclusions that experts have now wrong, but it might. As more factors are considered the conclusions will likely wander some.

    The WHO said asymptomatic people transmitting Corona were "very rare" then they said it might be as high as 40% ... they said these two things a day apart. We really still don't know what reality is. The data we have keeps changing and not always in the same direction.

  11. #1856
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Yes there are still things we donít know and there are some things for which we donít have answers, but youíre making it sound like we donít know anything and everything is a guess. That is just not true.

    There are some things we do know and some steps that we do know are effective. You really think we have zero idea how to ha duke this or that every decision is a projection?

    As if weíre like ďWe have NO idea if telling everyone to social distance and stand six feet apart is better than to tell everyone to French kiss everyone they see. We just have no idea which one will minimize transmissionĒ.

    Címon. Thereís much wwe do know, even if thereís much we donít.
    Again, did you read the last paragraph?

    Wash your hands, don't touch your face, keep your distance, stay home.

  12. #1857
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewing View Post
    Yes it is. Everyone dies. We take precautions to try and avoid dying. Now there risk and rewarded that go along with that. This is the same thing
    You are saying it's possible to prevent the spread of Corona? To just stop it cold? This is a power you have? Or are you saying if we all kill ourselves (or enough of us do) we will stop people getting infected?

    We don't have a means to stop it since we can't really live without anybody coming into contact with other people. We can minimize the risk, but I already said that.

  13. #1858
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    Again, did you read the last paragraph?

    Wash your hands, don't touch your face, keep your distance, stay home.
    So youíre saying your last paragraph contradicts your first one?

    Are all those measures things we know will reduce the transmission or things we will project will reduce transmission?

  14. #1859
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    we do need to understand that at some point everyone is going to be exposed to Corona.
    So is this an answer? Because it sounds more like a guess that you're sharing because it supports what you WANT to believe.

  15. #1860
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    Quote Originally Posted by blams View Post
    There is a general scientific consensus for all of it. People should social distance, wear mask, and not have more than 10 people in a gathering. People shouldn't be going in others' houses unless absolutely necessary.

    Anything aside from those recommendations is wrong- even as data changes in the future.


    That's just how science works. Using the best accepted data at the time , you're right. Even if you're wrong looking back years later.


    Conclusions that differ from the consensus don't have the data to support it

    Garbage in, garbage out. As the data improves, the output improves. Doesnt make the conclusions that experts have now wrong.

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    Bingo.

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