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  1. #11701
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    Did California handle the pandemic better than Florida? Not sure you can make that statement with certainty, given the difference in demographics and population density in the states.

  2. #11702
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Take away all the reasons California did better and did they really do better? OK, if that's your argument, people shouldn't have argued Florida did better to begin with.

    Also, Florida's age can be used to discuss the death total, but when it comes to case totals age is irrelevant since people of all ages are equally susceptible to contracting it (just older people are more likely to suffer or die from it).

    In that regard, California blows Florida out of the water. California is 16th in cases per 1 million, Florida is 33rd. Florida has fully 13,000 more cases per 1 million people than California.

    California handled the pandemic way better than Florida did.
    1) I took none away. I did provide context which you forgot probably on purpose because you'd not have a point.

    2) I'd love to see that. As we age our immune systems deteriorate as well. But I'm open to you being correct on this point. Post when you have time that evidence.

    The two handled it differently almost 180 degrees and yet are very, very similar.
    My Ignore List: bklynny67, nastynice, OhSoSlick, spliff(TONE), zmaster52

  3. #11703
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    Quote Originally Posted by catman View Post
    Did California handle the pandemic better than Florida? Not sure you can make that statement with certainty, given the difference in demographics and population density in the states.
    thank you
    My Ignore List: bklynny67, nastynice, OhSoSlick, spliff(TONE), zmaster52

  4. #11704
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Also, Florida's age can be used to discuss the death total, but when it comes to case totals age is irrelevant since people of all ages are equally susceptible to contracting it (just older people are more likely to suffer or die from it).
    That is unequivocally untrue. People with degraded immune systems are absolutely more likely to contract any disease than those with normal immune systems.

  5. #11705
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    Dec 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by brett05 View Post
    1) I took none away. I did provide context which you forgot probably on purpose because you'd not have a point.

    2) I'd love to see that. As we age our immune systems deteriorate as well. But I'm open to you being correct on this point. Post when you have time that evidence.

    The two handled it differently almost 180 degrees and yet are very, very similar.
    2):

    https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-pers...ovid-19-spread

    "A study published today in Pediatrics found that children in two states were just as likely as adults to become infected with COVID-19 within their households"

    https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/heal...re-at-risk-too

    according to the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), over the summer, in the United States, people under age 30 accounted for more than 20% of COVID-19 cases and were seen as more likely to transmit the virus than others.

    https://journals.plos.org/plosone/ar...l.pone.0242587

    Our results are contrary to previous findings that adolescents are less susceptible than older adults. Prevalence of COVID-19 for adolescents and for youth was significantly greater than for older adults (p < .00001), as was percentage observed percentage expected (p < .005).



    Let me guess, this is the part where you ignore everything I just posted?

  6. #11706
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    Quote Originally Posted by catman View Post
    Did California handle the pandemic better than Florida? Not sure you can make that statement with certainty, given the difference in demographics and population density in the states.
    I can make the statement. I can certainly refute Fingerbang and DBroncismo's earlier contention that Florida handled it better than California.

    California successfully kept their case number far lower than Florida's while having a better economy while doing so.

  7. #11707
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    You didn't address the major point I was making. The demographics and population density in the states are not comparable, so the statement you made is only an opinion. Young people have better outcomes from Covid than old people. People in densely populated areas are more likely to be infected. California has lower population density, overall than Florida does. California has a lower average age than Florida.
    Perhaps the outcome in California was simply good fortune?

  8. #11708
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    Quote Originally Posted by catman View Post
    You didn't address the major point I was making. The demographics and population density in the states are not comparable, so the statement you made is only an opinion. Young people have better outcomes from Covid than old people. People in densely populated areas are more likely to be infected. California has lower population density, overall than Florida does. California has a lower average age than Florida.
    Perhaps the outcome in California was simply good fortune?
    California's density overall may be lower, but California has denser areas than Florida does:

    https://www.governing.com/archive/po...ities-map.html

    Persons per square mile:

    San Francisco, CA 18,581
    Miami, FL 12,645
    Long Beach, CA 9,348
    Los Angeles, CA 8,484
    Oakland, CA 7,528
    Anaheim, CA 7,043
    Pasadena, CA 6,185
    San Jose, CA 5,808
    Hollywood, FL 5,533
    Coral Springs, FL 5,467
    Ft. Lauderdale, FL 5,141
    Sacramento, CA 5,058
    Fresno, CA 4,663
    San Diego, CA 4,326
    St. Petersburg, FL 4,227
    Tampa, FL 3,326
    Orlando, FL 2,707
    Gainseville, FL 2,147
    Tallahassee, FL 1,904
    Jacksonville, FL 1,179


    And considering the vast majority of Californian's live in these cities, more Californian's actually live in higher density areas than Floridian's do.

    But beyond that, they've already done studies and found that states that did more stringent measures such as California experienced better covid outcomes and in general a better economy than states that took a more relaxed approach like Florida.

    So the idea that it could be good fortune or coincidence seems farfetched when the data is telling us this was to be expected based on their responses.

  9. #11709
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    May 2020
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    2):

    https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-pers...ovid-19-spread

    "A study published today in Pediatrics found that children in two states were just as likely as adults to become infected with COVID-19 within their households"

    https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/heal...re-at-risk-too

    according to the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), over the summer, in the United States, people under age 30 accounted for more than 20% of COVID-19 cases and were seen as more likely to transmit the virus than others.

    https://journals.plos.org/plosone/ar...l.pone.0242587

    Our results are contrary to previous findings that adolescents are less susceptible than older adults. Prevalence of COVID-19 for adolescents and for youth was significantly greater than for older adults (p < .00001), as was percentage observed percentage expected (p < .005).



    Let me guess, this is the part where you ignore everything I just posted?
    Thanks. Shall we look at this in detail or just accept it by ignoring issues that look to be there in your examples?
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  10. #11710
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    Quote Originally Posted by brett05 View Post
    Thanks. Shall we look at this in detail or just accept it by ignoring issues that look to be there in your examples?
    I mean, I knew you were going to ignore them anyway.

    Regardless of whether you believe there's a difference in contraction rates by age, that doesn't explain how massive the discrepancy is. California is 16th, Florida is 33rd. Not to mention if you look at other older states and younger states you see the other older states managed to have very low covid case rates and California did better than many of the youngest states:

    Oldest states (covid case rates):

    Maine (4th)
    West Virginia (10th)
    Vermont (2nd)
    Delaware (38th)
    Montana (25th)

    youngest states (covid case rates):

    Utah (48th)
    Alaska (11th)
    Texas (22nd)
    Georgia (27th)
    Colorado (14th)
    North Dakota (50th)


    So if case rates were based on age, how come all the other old states managed to have lower case rates than Florida and how come California managed to have lower case rates than most of the younger states too?

  11. #11711
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    I see you avoided my question
    My Ignore List: bklynny67, nastynice, OhSoSlick, spliff(TONE), zmaster52

  12. #11712
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    Quote Originally Posted by brett05 View Post
    I see you avoided my question
    I did not, we can go into it. I'm saying your question doesn't really matter. California did better than other younger states and Florida did worse than other older states so your attempt at saying the numbers are what they are because of the age of the state is untrue.

  13. #11713
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    I did not, we can go into it. I'm saying your question doesn't really matter. California did better than other younger states and Florida did worse than other older states so your attempt at saying the numbers are what they are because of the age of the state is untrue.
    How, exactly, are you defining better and worse?
    gotta love 'referential' treatment

  14. #11714
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiteWolf View Post
    How, exactly, are you defining better and worse?
    I'd define doing better as being lessening the cases and deaths of covid and/or lessening the negative economic impact of covid. But that's off the top of my head.

  15. #11715
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    I'd define doing better as being lessening the cases and deaths of covid and/or lessening the negative economic impact of covid. But that's off the top of my head.
    But, for example, you were comparing Florida and California...the per capita GDP of California is nearly 60% higher than that of Florida, so exactly how would one compare? Especially after also looking at the higher percentage of 18-64 yr olds in California vs Florida.

    And lessening the cases? Based on what data, overall performance?

    There's just so much that would go into a comparison that may not make it apples and oranges, but at least Red Delicious vs crabapples...
    gotta love 'referential' treatment

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