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  1. #7441
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    Quote Originally Posted by spliff(TONE) View Post
    You certainly echoed the same sentiment.
    I don't think I did.

  2. #7442
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    The venn diagram of ideas and what conservatives might talk about and what liberals talk about has a lot of overlap. If a conservative says we need to pay our teachers more does that make paying teachers well a conservative viewpoint?

    How do I express that the pandemic sucks? It sucks. I thought we all knew that.
    How about you answer your own question but use common sense?

    The Venn Diagram of people who talk about the ancillary effects possibly being worse the Covid safety precautions is a massive conservative circle, a small liberal circle, and a small overlap.

    Furthermore, Liberals in such a conversation are more likely to argue against the notion the ancillary benefits are worse than the safety measures.

    This is not that hard: itís a fairly conservative belief.

  3. #7443
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    No, not nobody knows anything, but we don't know that the decisions being made by our leaders are really the best decisions. The situation is more complex than anyone can know what is "the" right answer.

    It's not both sides, I wasn't talking about political parties or viewpoints, you were.
    No, we donít know if these decisions are the absolute best, but we do know if theyíre better than other, worse decisions.

    Like not doing anything for example. Whether our current approach is the best decision, itís far better than literally doing nothing. You know who else now agrees? Sweden.

  4. #7444
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    How about you answer your own question but use common sense?

    The Venn Diagram of people who talk about the ancillary effects possibly being worse the Covid safety precautions is a massive conservative circle, a small liberal circle, and a small overlap.

    Furthermore, Liberals in such a conversation are more likely to argue against the notion the ancillary benefits are worse than the safety measures.

    This is not that hard: itís a fairly conservative belief.
    Again, I didn't say the "worse than covid" part. That was you who brought that up and assigned it to me.

  5. #7445
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    No, we donít know if these decisions are the absolute best, but we do know if theyíre better than other, worse decisions.

    Like not doing anything for example. Whether our current approach is the best decision, itís far better than literally doing nothing. You know who else now agrees? Sweden.
    I didn't advocate doing nothing, so, okay.

  6. #7446
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    Again, I didn't say the "worse than covid" part. That was you who brought that up and assigned it to me.
    You just asked the question...

    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    I didn't advocate doing nothing, so, okay.
    You just said we wonít know if that was the better strategy until many years later. Iím saying we know itís a bad strategy today.

  7. #7447
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    I don't think I did.

  8. #7448
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    But it was those things coupled with unusually low numbers that while possible, were still abnormal. It was a totality if evidence.

    It seems you are trying to argue we were stupid for believing as we did when it turned out we were right.

    I think you are so conceited you believe we were right and you were wrong because we made a lucky guess, as opposed it realizing we correctly interpreted the very obvious evidence in a way you did not.

    I reiterate, why do I get the feeling you still donít believe Chinaís numbers were wrong...
    That totality of evidence is fine if you want to say you think china is lying. But that's not what that convo was, you guys said it as fact, and when I asked on what basis are you making this accusation, you had none except what you mentioned above. Laughable basis. It's funny, I'm gonna laugh.

    I expanded on that by pointing out that this whole china lying story is only a story because the US is trying to assign blame for their **** up. And the actual data set china gave us was a very good data set for us to use, our govt just so happens to be incompetent and now trying to pass the buck.

    Your reasoning was stupid then and its stupid now in the context of people taking it as factual evidence and attacking someone asking them to corroborate what's facts is based upon.

    People pointed out particular inconsistencies not realizing those inconsistencies are very normal in a pandemic, as america ourselves had the very same inconsistencies and potential over/under reporting.

    If it's about being right or wrong, go ahead and take it, I'll give it to you. Makes no diff to me.

    Let me ask you one question. What numbers would not.have been unusually low? What general threshold would have been numbers that you find believable?

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  9. #7449
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    One of the benefits of the Chinese style of government is that when they say lock down, you say how high. Americans think it's our ****ing birth right to go out and intentionally ignore common sense and get people killed because of our freedumz. Hell that's literally what we've spent several days/pages arguing. You've been trying to say forever how going into a church is an essential service despite the fact that businesses that offer services that literally encourage congregation is what's killing people.
    Well yes, of course an authoritarian govt will have a significantly swifter response than a democracy. I dont blame america for not responding at chinas level, that's not a reasonable expectation. But i do blame America for absolutely sleep walking thru this thing.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  10. #7450
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    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    That totality of evidence is fine if you want to say you think china is lying. But that's not what that convo was, you guys said it as fact, and when I asked on what basis are you making this accusation, you had none except what you mentioned above. Laughable basis. It's funny, I'm gonna laugh.

    I expanded on that by pointing out that this whole china lying story is only a story because the US is trying to assign blame for their **** up. And the actual data set china gave us was a very good data set for us to use, our govt just so happens to be incompetent and now trying to pass the buck.

    Your reasoning was stupid then and its stupid now in the context of people taking it as factual evidence and attacking someone asking them to corroborate what's facts is based upon.

    People pointed out particular inconsistencies not realizing those inconsistencies are very normal in a pandemic, as america ourselves had the very same inconsistencies and potential over/under reporting.

    If it's about being right or wrong, go ahead and take it, I'll give it to you. Makes no diff to me.

    Let me ask you one question. What numbers would not.have been unusually low? What general threshold would have been numbers that you find believable?
    You are trying to mock us for how stupid we were for believing what was factually true, while talking about how much smarter you are for believing things that were not.

    I mean, what more needs to be said? You are so conceited and arrogant even being Glaringly factually wrong Is further proof of your brilliance.

    If being wrong is evidence of your intelligence, no wonder you think youíre the smartest person ever given how frequently you are wrong.

  11. #7451
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    Quote Originally Posted by spliff(TONE) View Post
    Lmao, finally someone says it!

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  12. #7452
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    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    Well yes, of course an authoritarian govt will have a significantly swifter response than a democracy. I dont blame america for not responding at chinas level, that's not a reasonable expectation. But i do blame America for absolutely sleep walking thru this thing.
    America being wrong is further proof of its brilliance! In fact, they were so wrong, itís obvious they had the best response. Chinaís response was the right one, and thatís why they are stupid.

  13. #7453
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    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    Well yes, of course an authoritarian govt will have a significantly swifter response than a democracy. I dont blame america for not responding at chinas level, that's not a reasonable expectation. But i do blame America for absolutely sleep walking thru this thing.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    And fighting on the side of the sleep walkers is extremely dangerous BTW. Fighting efforts to fight COVID is extremely dangerous.

  14. #7454
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    Yeah, we are a long long way from proving what is/was the right path in all these situations. We'll never really know we'll just get hundreds of books explaining/blaming it away over the next several years.
    There is no right path.

    The nation should decide what level of spread they find acceptable, and that is going to be an arbitrary call. Then they should enforce things to that level.

    But you have basically balance the economy and the virus. There's really no right answer as to what that balance point should be. There are probably some wrong ones, lol, but any right answer at the end of the day is arbitrary.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  15. #7455
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    You are trying to mock us for how stupid we were for believing what was factually true, while talking about how much smarter you are for believing things that were not.

    I mean, what more needs to be said? You are so conceited and arrogant even being Glaringly factually wrong Is further proof of your brilliance.

    If being wrong is evidence of your intelligence, no wonder you think youíre the smartest person ever given how frequently you are wrong.

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