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  1. #3871
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamba42 View Post
    I'm curious, has there ever been such a precipitous drop in play for a QB in their prime like we are seeing with Carson Wentz?

    I know someone tweeted about QBs who have seen their rating plunge but other QBs on that list were old guys at the end of their career. Has there been a QB in their prime fall as quickly as Wentz is this year?

    I mean this is a guy I've been thinking about as a top 10 QB coming into the season with an MVP level season, but he's just been awful this year.
    It's hard to evaluate Wentz this season with everything else that has gone wrong around him.

    This isn't the QB he is, or has ever been.

  2. #3872
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamba42 View Post
    They did play well, but to me it was more about Seattle looking past the Giants (similar to when Dallas almost beat Pittsburgh).
    See I donít think that at all. Anyone can look at film and see that the Giants alphabet been playing really well on defense. I think this is a case of Seattle being extremely overrated. Their defense is terrible. If you can keep Wilson in check and keep him from getting outside the pocket and keep him from being able to throw on the run they can be beat. They play Washington in a couple weeks and donít be surprised if the Seahawks lose to them too. The big question about Seattle/Washington is can the WFT do enough on offense.


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  3. #3873
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamba42 View Post
    I'm curious, has there ever been such a precipitous drop in play for a QB in their prime like we are seeing with Carson Wentz?

    I know someone tweeted about QBs who have seen their rating plunge but other QBs on that list were old guys at the end of their career. Has there been a QB in their prime fall as quickly as Wentz is this year?

    I mean this is a guy I've been thinking about as a top 10 QB coming into the season with an MVP level season, but he's just been awful this year.
    Tony Romo? His decline was due mostly to injury but he fell off the map pretty fast.


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  4. #3874
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.B View Post
    Tony Romo? His decline was due mostly to injury but he fell off the map pretty fast.


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    I don't see the comparison at all tbh. Romo was due to injury and at the end of his career. Wentz is in his prime right now.

  5. #3875
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    Quote Originally Posted by BDawk4Prez View Post
    It's hard to evaluate Wentz this season with everything else that has gone wrong around him.

    This isn't the QB he is, or has ever been.
    Meh, you keep saying this but I'm not buying it. Wentz has a pretty healthy team around him right now and just had one of the worst games of his career.

  6. #3876
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamba42 View Post
    Meh, you keep saying this but I'm not buying it. Wentz has a pretty healthy team around him right now and just had one of the worst games of his career.
    He doesn't, but ok.

  7. #3877
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamba42 View Post
    I'm curious, has there ever been such a precipitous drop in play for a QB in their prime like we are seeing with Carson Wentz?

    I know someone tweeted about QBs who have seen their rating plunge but other QBs on that list were old guys at the end of their career. Has there been a QB in their prime fall as quickly as Wentz is this year?

    I mean this is a guy I've been thinking about as a top 10 QB coming into the season with an MVP level season, but he's just been awful this year.
    I think this has been happening for a long time to be honest.
    The shortened 2017 season looks like the outlier. 2016 was not good but was his rookie year. 2018 wasnít good but he was coming off an injury.
    Last year wasnít great either. They were lucky to be in the worst division.
    After winning the Super Bowl there was a long honeymoon phase where everything was forgiven. Last year winning the division really camouflaged a bad situation.
    Some eagle fans ( not all ) have been exposing you to extreme Wentz propaganda.
    I honestly donít think itís that big of a fall.

  8. #3878
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    Quote Originally Posted by BDawk4Prez View Post
    He doesn't, but ok.
    How not? Everyone was saying before he just needs his weapons back. Well, he's got them back and he's still playing poorly. Ertz is back. Goedert has been back. Sanders has been back. Reagor is back. He has Fulgham he stopped paying attention to.

    The defense has never faced many injuries and have kept them in games all year long. I'm confused about what else the Eagles need for Wentz to succeed. Absolutely no adversity?

    I'm probably a bigger Wentz fan at this point than many Eagles fans in here and think this year is mostly an outlier, but it still merits analysis of what has gone wrong for Wentz in particular this year. I'm confused about what else you think Wentz needs?

  9. #3879
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    Quote Originally Posted by mariner4life View Post
    I think this has been happening for a long time to be honest.
    The shortened 2017 season looks like the outlier. 2016 was not good but was his rookie year. 2018 wasnít good but he was coming off an injury.
    Last year wasnít great either. They were lucky to be in the worst division.
    After winning the Super Bowl there was a long honeymoon phase where everything was forgiven. Last year winning the division really camouflaged a bad situation.
    Some eagle fans ( not all ) have been exposing you to extreme Wentz propaganda.
    I honestly donít think itís that big of a fall.
    Yeah you can't really fault him for his rookie year. Most rookie QBs don't look like Herbert. 2017 may be an outlier, but he was also on his best team as a pro too, so that definitely helps. I disagree about you saying he wasn't good in 2018 or last year. In 2018 he was pretty good and he was pretty good last year (statistically, at least). His teams weren't great really, but he was still good as a player.

    There is something odd about this year.

  10. #3880
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamba42 View Post
    How not? Everyone was saying before he just needs his weapons back. Well, he's got them back and he's still playing poorly. Ertz is back. Goedert has been back. Sanders has been back. Reagor is back. He has Fulgham he stopped paying attention to.

    The defense has never faced many injuries and have kept them in games all year long. I'm confused about what else the Eagles need for Wentz to succeed. Absolutely no adversity?

    I'm probably a bigger Wentz fan at this point than many Eagles fans in here and think this year is mostly an outlier, but it still merits analysis of what has gone wrong for Wentz in particular this year. I'm confused about what else you think Wentz needs?
    Ertz's first game back. He's back, but certainly not healthy if you watched the game.
    Goedert has been our best receiver for weeks.
    Sanders is criminal misused.
    Reagor is getting acclimated.
    Fulgham has lost snaps to Alshon.

    The biggest issue is the OL. It's terrible.

  11. #3881
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamba42 View Post
    Yeah you can't really fault him for his rookie year. Most rookie QBs don't look like Herbert. 2017 may be an outlier, but he was also on his best team as a pro too, so that definitely helps. I disagree about you saying he wasn't good in 2018 or last year. In 2018 he was pretty good and he was pretty good last year (statistically, at least). His teams weren't great really, but he was still good as a player.

    There is something odd about this year.
    What's odd about this year? It's the worst situation talent wise and OL play he has dealt with.

  12. #3882
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    Maybe we want to blame the line. That's my first thought. According to PFR (https://www.pro-football-reference.c...g_advanced.htm), Wentz has been blitzed the second most of all NFL QBs and hit the most. On the other hand, he has the 6th most time in the pocket and while he has been blitzed second most, he has only been hurried the 10th most, which indicates that his line is at least doing a decent job of dealing with the blitzes.

    Other NFL QBs are doing better with less time in the pocket and being hurried at a much higher %.

    To me, Wentz has been shook. There is something mentally off with him this year where he has become both worse at reading the field and afraid to pull the trigger on throws. He still shows really good accuracy sometimes, but for whatever reason he has completely lost his pocket awareness which leads to him holding on to the ball for far too long and taking even more hits (which shakes him even more).

  13. #3883
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamba42 View Post
    Yeah you can't really fault him for his rookie year. Most rookie QBs don't look like Herbert. 2017 may be an outlier, but he was also on his best team as a pro too, so that definitely helps. I disagree about you saying he wasn't good in 2018 or last year. In 2018 he was pretty good and he was pretty good last year (statistically, at least). His teams weren't great really, but he was still good as a player.

    There is something odd about this year.
    A Steelers podcast was talking about it because they were asked on buying cheap and they gave a quite insightful answer:
    1 - Last year ended with him going out of the game with a concussion and between McCown playing well and the questions of toughness he likely was a little down on himself.
    2 - FA comes around and all the moves were about the defense with the FOís answer for the offense being ďget healthyĒ. Kinda gets the feeling of ďIím not that important.Ē
    3 - Come draft night they seemingly pass up opportunities for top end WR talent, but still take a WR, just not what everyone said they and he needs.
    4 - Then the second night comes. Again offensive talent on the board, and they take a QB. Because the GM liked him and regretted passing up a QB in the past.
    5 - There was no offseason for Wentz to get in there and work on the things he needed to. It seems like he did other things in the extended time off.
    6 - Brooks gets hurt and instead of looking for a replacement via trade or street FA; they turn to a 38/39 recently retired guy that was already done.
    7 - Dillard gets hurt and instead of bringing in a FA or moving someone up or trading for someone; they pay Peters more to move to a spot he already proved he was done at.

    Basically you boil down to it looks from the outside in like Wentz is being set up to fail for some reason because they arenít showing him the support necessary. They give him ok not great prospect talent. They bring in old faithfuls, not whatís best out there.

    All of that without getting to coaching issues.


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  14. #3884
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamba42 View Post
    I'm curious, has there ever been such a precipitous drop in play for a QB in their prime like we are seeing with Carson Wentz?

    I know someone tweeted about QBs who have seen their rating plunge but other QBs on that list were old guys at the end of their career. Has there been a QB in their prime fall as quickly as Wentz is this year?

    I mean this is a guy I've been thinking about as a top 10 QB coming into the season with an MVP level season, but he's just been awful this year.
    Brett favre in 1999 had almost identical stats to wentz this year

  15. #3885
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamba42 View Post
    Yeah you can't really fault him for his rookie year. Most rookie QBs don't look like Herbert. 2017 may be an outlier, but he was also on his best team as a pro too, so that definitely helps. I disagree about you saying he wasn't good in 2018 or last year. In 2018 he was pretty good and he was pretty good last year (statistically, at least). His teams weren't great really, but he was still good as a player.

    There is something odd about this year.
    Besides 2017 heís always been pretty meh.
    Not great not bad. You add dysfunctional surroundings to an average QB and this is an obvious result.

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