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  1. #8806
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    Good for you Nick. Some of us don't vote with our pocketbook, although I agree many do. I am not questioning your returns, but as I mentioned above, things were considerably better during Obama's second term than the past 3.5 yrs under Trump watch.

    I do believe housing (foreclosures and evictions), food and basic essentials are on the ballot this year. Far too many have lost jobs and are struggling and hurting. I imagine they have other things on their mind aside from a 401K.

    I also think some of us are focused on other issues, like the environment, alternative energy, sensible gun control, healthcare, climate change, immigration, racism, income inequality, the economy and the ever growing deficit to name but a few. Maybe we should reexamine tax cuts that benefit only a fraction of the populace. Easing of regs that benefit multi nationals but are killing us and our planet. You know little shite like that.
    Last edited by drt1010; 08-28-2020 at 09:19 AM.

  2. #8807
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrzubnyy View Post
    And who said your side was the only view to follow?


    That is the problem with this country. And that problem just branches everywhere and including here.

    People have their own opinions and they should never have to be in lockstep with others and then crucified or looked at differently because of their opinions are not aligned with theirs.

    And Iím Not talking about debating on here. Thst his what this place is for to begin with.

    Every side begins with the center. One goes left one goes right. Other night go further on both sides. The extremes on both sides is one
    thing and people who live on the extreme probably hate the world to begin with. Iím
    Throwing those out because they are obvious.
    Nicky WTF are you talking about? I was discussing Trump lies, fabrications and falsehoods. I was discussing the world of alternative facts. Trump would have us all believe we should deny reality and believe his interpretation.

  3. #8808
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    Quote Originally Posted by drt1010 View Post
    Good for you Nick. Some of us don't vote with our pocketbook, although I agree many do. I am not questioning your returns, but as I mentioned above, things were considerably better during Obama's second term than the past 3.5 yrs under Trump watch.

    I do believe housing (foreclosures and evictions), food and basic essentials are on the ballot this year. Far too many have lost jobs and are struggling and hurting. I imagine they have other things on their mind aside from a 401K.

    I also think some of us are focused on other issues, like the environment, alternative energy, sensible gun control, healthcare, climate change, immigration, racism, income inequality, the economy and the ever growing deficit to name but a few. Maybe we should reexamine tax cuts that benefit only a fraction of the populace. Easing of regs that benefit multi nationals but are killing us and our planet. You know little shite like that.
    Dr, no offense but the issues you mentioned were the same issues back in 2016 and 100 years prior.

    It all boils down to on how that particular candidate persuades voters that are not part of base.


    Trump did better in States that carried more weight, tired of the popular vote argument for who won President, and Hillary did not.

    She basically gave him the rust belt
    And in the end it killed here chances.

  4. #8809
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrzubnyy View Post
    Cherry-picking is also easy to do if you have time to research. Every President can be cherry picked to death with all kinds of issues.

    Peoples opinions need to be respected no matter what side they are on. Again, not talking extremes here. Both sides of extremes are bad IMO.

    All I see in this Country is that we are in the middle of a movement. And it all goes to power grabs! The one who doesnít have the power for a takeover will complain and protest about everything. And that is both sides.

    The last huge movement besides the Civil rights movements in the 60s was the women movement. They wanted more power.

    So again, all of the bickering in this Country is all about POWER and who has that authority to unleash that power.

    It is all about the power grab!


    And everybody who has an opinion is just on tentacles *****ing and moaning with the side that they want to win.

    Currently I do not see a huge change in this Country for another 100 years. The voting population needs to change for a particular side to achieve their ultimate goal.
    OK Nicky.

    All politics are about power. All politicians have an ego. (None as big as Trumpy bear) All political parties want to remain in power and advance their agenda. Question is who do they serve and with whom does their message resonate. Are they serving the many or the few? In this election in particular, are they separating us from one another, drawing up sides based on gender, race, creed, national origin or trying to find similarities, commonality - rather than differences to divide.

  5. #8810
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    And how can anyone even use numbers that were CAUSED BY a purposely shutdown as part of their argument for jobs being lossed?

    Using economic numbers after March-Aug is utterly ridiculous.

  6. #8811
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrzubnyy View Post
    Dr, no offense but the issues you mentioned were the same issues back in 2016 and 100 years prior.

    It all boils down to on how that particular candidate persuades voters that are not part of base.


    Trump did better in States that carried more weight, tired of the popular vote argument for who won President, and Hillary did not.

    She basically gave him the rust belt
    And in the end it killed here chances.
    No offense taken.

    Now you are talking strategy, earlier we were talking issues. A little different. You are correct in your assessment. Trump worked the areas he needed to win. Clinton may have taken certain things for granted and got a little lazy. Also I will go to my grave believing the Comey letter was the difference !

  7. #8812
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrzubnyy View Post
    And how can anyone even use numbers that were CAUSED BY a purposely shutdown as part of their argument for jobs being lossed?

    Using economic numbers after March-Aug is utterly ridiculous.
    I didn't if you are referring to numbers I quoted above. They were a 3.5 yr average from when he took office.

  8. #8813
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    Quote Originally Posted by drt1010 View Post
    Nicky WTF are you talking about? I was discussing Trump lies, fabrications and falsehoods. I was discussing the world of alternative facts. Trump would have us all believe we should deny reality and believe his interpretation.
    How come when Obama said 2+2=5 people didnít disagree with that? But when Trump says it then it is all a lie?

  9. #8814
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    Oh and Nick talking about job numbers. How is it Trump is allowed to claim he added 10M last month, when the reality is he lost 30M the previous 4 months and the number reflects people returning TO WORk at their old job?!

  10. #8815
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrzubnyy View Post
    How come when Obama said 2+2=5 people didnít disagree with that? But when Trump says it then it is all a lie?
    Nick please don't even go there. I will bury you in 10 pages of Trump lies, distortions, fabrications and blatant untruth. This man's entire reputation is a lie, based on pretense. He lives to lie. He creates a fantasy that he sells based on lies and more recently "alternative facts." He's a snake oil salesman....a good one. He's a facade as phony and glitzy as his brass edifice at Trump tower.

    Your claim is a prime example of something I mentioned yesterday, "whataboutism" a close ally of false equivalence.
    Last edited by drt1010; 08-28-2020 at 09:58 AM.

  11. #8816
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    Quote Originally Posted by brett05 View Post
    True, however way ahead of projections.
    https://www.whitehouse.gov/articles/...-expectations/

    And you are right you did not, flimflammann did by saying he's lost 50K as has all his co-workers. That's not on the President, that's on him and them. I know of no one that hasn't made lots of money. I also don't know anyone over the age of 30 that doesn't have a retirement fund. (Just saying)
    Brett, my 401k May drop more then your because I have a larger balance saved, I am lucky, I can save the maximum allotted per year and have a 5 percent match from my employer. Performance on 401ks depend on allotments. I am aware of drops and losses that is routine. However, under Trump the market has been more volatile then anything we saw under Obama and Clinton. Every coworker and friend has told me the same thing. You know itís true, the facts are on my side. You live in a world of alternate facts such is the level of your adoration of Trump. Yet, I am not alone, multiply me by millions of people, many of whom voted for Trump. Just do a internet search under ď Trump and 401k ď itís more bad news then good, and that was pre Covid. But your good at believing what he wants you to believe like his innaugauration was the most attended in history. Again telling was how Trump Jr and lots of Republican Congressman dumped millions in stocks while the admin was telling people what a great opportunity they will have to buy low....grifters always seem to find their marks.
    Last edited by flimflamman; 08-28-2020 at 11:01 AM.

  12. #8817
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    Jun 2009
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    Brett had you or RRZ provided proof I would have joined you on the front lines, I would have recanted everything I have said and joined your squad. That would have been something you could have celebrated and enjoyed, but you didnít.

  13. #8818
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    Cherry picking and bias exists on both sides RRZ. But even if letís say people have an agenda against Trump does not excuse a Trump supporter of being critical given the facts, unvarnished. You could certainly believe the President is being treated unfairly at times and still evaluate the President and find him lacking. When you simply use the argument that he is being unfairly then you enter the realm of a person who has put on his own blind fold and ear plugs to prevent honest appraisal of Trump. Which is in fact what you have done. Trump has nothing to stand on, people desperate to hold onto a reason to justify voting for him are using the hell out of the economy, which is fine if your wealthy but if your middle class no so much. That is if, the economy is infact the only thing that matters. RNC fear tactics, what did anyone think of Trumps speech at the RNC . Talk about Sleepy Don in front of his socially un distanced crowd.
    Last edited by flimflamman; 08-28-2020 at 01:43 PM.

  14. #8819
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    May 2007
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    62,133
    ....BuT wHaT aBoUt ObAmA?

  15. #8820
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    Dec 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by spliff(TONE) View Post
    ....BuT wHaT aBoUt ObAmA?
    What about her e-mails!

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