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  1. #2266
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    Quote Originally Posted by likemystylez View Post
    rights are being infringed on by a government who is in place to make our lives easier. Not sure how you dont believe that. Its obvious to anyone that we do not have all the freedom that we did 3 months ago- im not sure how that needs to be proven???? I thought even the people in favor of the lock down believed that to be true
    RR noted our rights are infringed on often but that doesn't mean people can go do whatever they want just because they don't like it this time/the way it is done this time. You also still have yet to prove that these are unlawful and so on.

    Not sure how this isn't obvious to everyone else, when there are rules in place and you go against them you might get punished and receive backlash for doing so especially if it is during a pandemic and the rules are to protect society as a whole.

  2. #2267
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chronz View Post
    you can most definitely break unlawful orders. putting others at risk? we used to do that daily without draconian measures, what's the threshold for when ur willing to live with risk again?
    That's the trillion dollar question.
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  3. #2268
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    Quote Originally Posted by mngopher35 View Post
    RR noted our rights are infringed on often but that doesn't mean people can go do whatever they want just because they don't like it this time/the way it is done this time. You also still have yet to prove that these are unlawful and so on.

    Not sure how this isn't obvious to everyone else, when there are rules in place and you go against them you might get punished and receive backlash for doing so especially if it is during a pandemic and the rules are to protect society as a whole.
    ok so was it wrong of the jews to hide in the sewers when the nazis came to pick them up? LOL- when people are being oppressed and their lives are being destroyed by these "rules".... im not sure if its lawful to break the rules, but its completely understandable.

  4. #2269
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    Quote Originally Posted by likemystylez View Post
    ok so was it wrong of the jews to hide in the sewers when the nazis came to pick them up? LOL- when people are being oppressed and their lives are being destroyed by these "rules".... im not sure if its lawful to break the rules, but its completely understandable.
    Yes, I specifically remember talking about Jews and Nazis and how comparable that is to right now...

    RR I really hope you are here and reading this stuff and understand why people have posted some things they have on this forum lol. It has been in response to extreme BS like this, these are the responses you get when you ask someone to defend a claim they made.

  5. #2270
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    Quote Originally Posted by likemystylez View Post
    1) when your views are the same as our constitutions and the views that our founding fathers built this country on..... its an essential right. Have the government take you to court.

    2) When companies like facebook, youtube, and twitter are openly saying they are going to delete anti lockdown content- and the government is good with that.... RED FLAGS SHOULD GO UP IN EVERYONES EYES regardless of where you are on this.

    3) Sanctuary cities protect illegal immigrants who have broken the rules and allow them to be set free after violent crimes. Victims of these crimes are not allowed to sue the city for allowing the illegals to stay without coming into the country legally. (BTW- the illegals are not following any constitutional right)
    1.) You're absolutely right. Supreme courts often don't want to take cases like this. While their job isn't to "make" legislation but to interpret law, their interpretation is absolutely a form of legislation as it becomes the law of the land. It's best for the state to take you to court and a civil liberties attorney can make his case. Unfortunate in the Dallas woman's case, the judge told her to bend a knee and get off with no jail time or gtfo and serve a week in the can.

    2.) We may disagree on this. I believe Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, etc... are on the wrong side of history when it comes to selective censoring, HOWEVER, it's their right as a private corporation. Personally I'm against them censoring but I can't argue it's their right to dictate their terms. If I had a company or even my own firm, I'd sure as hell want to run it how I want.

    3.) Damn straight. A lot of people on the left who want things to remain closed indefinitely and condemn peaceful protestors who refuse to stay locked down don't really give a s--t about sanctuary cities. The difference is that an individual citizen is going against something that is perceived as unconstitutional while an entire city government is disobeying FEDERAL law which 100% is constitutional. Just remember the people telling you now that "the Dallas woman should obey the law" and remind them to be just as obedient when it comes to sanctuary cities.
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  6. #2271
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    Quote Originally Posted by mngopher35 View Post
    Whether or not the feeding your kids aspect is true all of the others stuff is much more than that and a major issue. You are choosing to believe and run with the narrative that helps push your political beliefs but either way everything else is the actual issue with this story and what can't be ignored or propped up (the how it was handled overall, not just profiting but the making a show/tearing up orders and the crowds affecting those nearby and not practicing safe procedures and so on). I don't know 100% either way if $ or family or politics and so on are for sure the reasoning but what they did cover was the way it was handled clearly political, gaining money, breaking orders, tearing them up and creating/not breaking up crowds affecting those nearby and so on based on. Also it covered how she had been eligible for the loan as well, why not take advantage of that if it's a key issue? Anyways though my point isn't I know her intent (it's kinda that you don't either though), it is that I can see all the actions and so on were bad either way.
    But you're focusing on details that are irrelevant to her case. I understand your skepticism of her motives, I'll go far as to say it's fair to think she's a greedy b-tch, but I don't believe her motive was ultimately to be able to earn money to feed her kids "because it supports my political beliefs". I strive to always be consistent with my ideology. There are so many things I'm personally against, but fight for others to have that right. I'm personally against drugs and alcohol, but I think people should have the right to smoke weed all day and/or get drunk daily so long as they aren't driving or endangering anyone else.

    At the end of the day, her motives, her being political about it (I agree she absolutely wanted recognition for this) is irrelevant to her case. She wasn't jailed for her gofundme or ripping up an order, she was arrested for not closing shop after she was served an order which about 1/2 the population of the US views as an infringement of her rights.
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  7. #2272
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redrum187 View Post
    But you're focusing on details that are irrelevant to her case. I understand your skepticism of her motives, I'll go far as to say it's fair to think she's a greedy b-tch, but I don't believe her motive was ultimately to be able to earn money to feed her kids "because it supports my political beliefs". I strive to always be consistent with my ideology. There are so many things I'm personally against, but fight for others to have that right. I'm personally against drugs and alcohol, but I think people should have the right to smoke weed all day and/or get drunk daily so long as they aren't driving or endangering anyone else.

    At the end of the day, her motives, her being political about it (I agree she absolutely wanted recognition for this) is irrelevant to her case. She wasn't jailed for her gofundme or ripping up an order, she was arrested for not closing shop after she was served an order which about 1/2 the population of the US views as an infringement of her rights.
    Yes she was arrested for a specific action was always the point. All the extra reasoning and her attitude can help explain why a judge may go overboard and see her in contempt for the defiance mentioned.

    As I have stated from the start of people have proof these are unconstitutional share it but no one ever has.


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  8. #2273
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    Quote Originally Posted by mngopher35 View Post
    I never said you couldn't argue that these are, you need to provide proof though and just defending bad actions by saying the words is not proof. So provide the actual evidence all these orders are unconstitutional and then explain why that can't be done right now by those objecting if that is the case.
    Well, we have proof. The problem isn't that there isn't any proof, it's that citizens can't pick and choose which cases the supreme courts listen to. People think the executive branch is the most powerful, I think it's the judiciary.
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  9. #2274
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chronz View Post
    truth doesn't hide from criticism. it stands tall on it's own. lies however, they require complete censorship.

    think of it this way, what YouTube deleted a few months back, holds true today so it's no longer censored like before. free yourself from ur mental shackles and welcome all arguments. dont be such a Sheeple that u need big brother to protect u from critical thinking
    It's the internet. When inaccurate potentially deadly information is passed by ignorant people it's a threat. A lesson that you as an American should know better than anyone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  10. #2275
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    Quote Originally Posted by likemystylez View Post
    your ignorance of the concept of freedom of speech is disgusting man..... the right to question the government is something you dont want to take away from people. And again- the lock down is also jeopardizing peoples lives.

    Have you always lived in Canada? or are you an American who moved there?
    You misunderstand freedom of speech and how it relates to technology. Nobody is denying your freedom of speech. Facebook does not offer to be your conduit to spreading dangerous lies that endanger the public safety of us all. But by all means climb up atop your house and use that right to free speak it from the rooftops.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  11. #2276
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    Quote Originally Posted by mngopher35 View Post
    Yes she was arrested for a specific action was always the point. All the extra reasoning and her attitude can help explain why a judge may go overboard and see her in contempt for the defiance mentioned.

    As I have stated from the start of people have proof these are unconstitutional share it but no one ever has.


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    No one has had the opportunity is a better way to put it.

    Let me ask you a question... Do you think when/if life gets back to normal (pre covid-19 with no restrictions), and a similar virus to covid-19 spreads globally... will people be willing to lock down just as easily as we did in March or will people will be more skeptical/unwilling to do so?

    I want to know your opinion. My opinion... I think the majority of people aren't going to do it so willingly next time, unless it's a virus exponentially worse than covid-19.

    An unrelated question for you as well. Do you ever listen to Joe Rogan's podcast? If so, what do you think of him?
    Last edited by Redrum187; 05-20-2020 at 10:56 PM.
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  12. #2277
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    This should put your freedom of speech argument to rest. From the first result in Google:

    While*freedom of speech*is one of our fundamental rights, there are*limitations. ... As a general rule,*limitations*on*free speech*preclude*speech*that is harmful to others, threatening, or generally repulsive and reviled.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  13. #2278
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    This should put your freedom of speech argument to rest. From the first result in Google:

    While*freedom of speech*is one of our fundamental rights, there are*limitations. ... As a general rule,*limitations*on*free speech*preclude*speech*that is harmful to others, threatening, or generally repulsive and reviled.

    Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk
    Very true, but there is a gray area when it comes to "repulsive and reviled". I think country and rap music is repulsive and vile (I'm not even kidding either), but I'd never argue a ban on those genres (as much as I'd love one).

    My mom gasps every time someone says the "f word" in a movie. It's ridiculous. She thinks those words are repulsive and reviled.

    There are things we universally agree we do NOT have the right to voice out (physical threats, "bomb" or "fire" on a plane, etc...) but then others society doesn't agree on because they are so damn subjective. Political ideology shouldn't be something that should be censored... it is though.

    These rules don't apply to private institutions, nor do I think they should. If I'm upset that PSD censors my "profanity" then I'm free to not use their site. No one is making me come here. Likewise, many conservatives complain about Facebook censoring them... yet they LIVE on Facebook...
    Last edited by Redrum187; 05-20-2020 at 11:04 PM.
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  14. #2279
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redrum187 View Post
    Well, we have proof. The problem isn't that there isn't any proof, it's that citizens can't pick and choose which cases the supreme courts listen to. People think the executive branch is the most powerful, I think it's the judiciary.
    No, what we have is months of people saying it goes against my rights, is unlawful etc and when questioned they have always backed away and been unable to defend that like styles/chronz above and often those similar arguments recycled.


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  15. #2280
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    This should put your freedom of speech argument to rest. From the first result in Google:

    While*freedom of speech*is one of our fundamental rights, there are*limitations. ... As a general rule,*limitations*on*free speech*preclude*speech*that is harmful to others, threatening, or generally repulsive and reviled.

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    LOl when you are fighting for a way of life that has worked out for everyone in this country for the last 400 years.... LOL im not sure you are putting people danger. Mother nature created corona. The reasonable course of action should not be to lock everyone down and destroy life as we know it.

    There are problems on the other side, and even if you think any body leaving their home for anything non essential is a disaster that will cause deaths. The people wanting to protest this are doing it because they are suffering, they are having their lives taken from them. LOL you could argue that this is exactly when you want to have the right to challenge the government and speak out against it.

    LOL you really expect everyone to just lay down and give up their kids growing up in a normal society? Give up their family business? Give up so many experiences in life?

    Especially when there have ben states that have opened and we are not seeing the huge spikes that are overwhelming the system. There needs to be a sustainable balance, and that isnt everyone being locked down forever (or until they find a vaccine that may never exist)

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