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Thread: Coronavirus

  1. #2491
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    Quote Originally Posted by brett05 View Post
    except that is not how any of this works! Smh
    I used to work in an ER so I still have quite a few friends (nurses, docs, techs) in the hospital. I’ve thrown this at them and while they agree about the ‘misreporting’ or whatever catman is saying, a lot are agreeing the overall is under reported.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack of Blades View Post
    I don't consider Brand New indie. I consider them ****ing awesome and don't belong to a genre.

  2. #2492
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    Quote Originally Posted by brett05 View Post
    It has in this thread

    They might have been. But the articles guess, assume, but do not know about true cause or if COVID accelerated. I guess honesty isn't required in this talk.
    So the US is the only country over reporting deaths from COVID-19? Seriously?

    You have a virus that carries around life threatening complications and its not accelerating the death of those who have other serious illnesses? Okay, sure. If you believe that, I have a bridge that's for sale.

  3. #2493
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    Quote Originally Posted by brett05 View Post
    It's overblown. That's the point and there really is no doubting that
    Terrible statement.

    In any pandemic numbers will always be unreliable to a certain degree. For example, a covid patient can get a severe respiratory infection and his own immune system can become over active and technically be the cause of death. However if we label this a covid death is that necessarily over reporting?

    What you're saying has truth to it, but I think quite going overboard with it and just kinda running with a narrative.

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  4. 07-13-2020, 06:12 PM
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  5. #2494
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    Quote Originally Posted by brett05 View Post
    It has in this thread

    No its not hard to say COVID sped things up. That's a ludicrous statement and for every link you can provided, there is evidence otherwise like Valade posted. People were dying in this country from COVID probably as early as January. Way before testing became readily available.
    They might have been. But the articles guess, assume, but do not know about true cause or if COVID accelerated. I guess honesty isn't required in this talk.[/QUOTE]

    Hey Brett - What is a Covid death in your opinion. Is there such a thing as a Covid death? What does a Covid death look like. Just because the science based reality doesn't jive with your world view on politics doesnt make it not true. Maybe you should question your world view a bit. Oh by the way the scientists say the earth is round also....

  6. 07-13-2020, 06:25 PM
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  7. #2495
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    Quote Originally Posted by brett05 View Post
    They might have been. But the articles guess, assume, but do not know about true cause or if COVID accelerated. I guess honesty isn't required in this talk.
    My articles featured no more assumptions or guesses than your articles and Dr. Brix’s belief.

    If you want honesty from others, you must first display honesty yourself.

  8. #2496
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    It is not overblown. This is for Catman too since he asked for the information.

    I already posted an article with a research scientist from Columbia University saying the numbers are under reported.

    Dr. Fauci, the CDC, and the WHO all believe the numbers are under reported.

    Here’s the associate professor of infectious diseases at Harvard saying it’s under reported:

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.new...lobalData.aspx

    Here’s a leading data and analytics company saying the data shows Covid is u see reported:

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.new...lobalData.aspx

    Here’s the executive director for the State and Territorial Epidemiologists saying it’s under reported:

    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...eath-toll.html

    Here’s researchers at the Yale School of public health saying the numbers are under reported:

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbc...mp/ncna1201441

    Here’s a study published in the Journal of the American Medical Association that says the numbers are under reported:

    https://www.virginiabusiness.com/art...d-study-finds/

    Here is a former top WHO official and Epidemiologist, a Dr. from the College of American Pathologists, and the President of the National Association of Medical Examiners all saying it’s under reported:

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews...%3fid=70385359


    I could keep going. But its pretty clear outside the Trump Administration, the Medical Community strongly believes Covid deaths are underreported.
    I will continue to disagree with you on this subject. Whenever a death is reported to the county coroner, the death certificate is examined closely. In the case of Covid, everyone that was positive with Covid has to have it listed as a contributing factor on the death certificate. In many cases, the patient would have died of the underlying disease process soon anyway, and Covid only pushed them over the top. I continue to say that Covid deaths are likely inflated by at least 20% because of political interests.
    And, by the way, anytime you mention the WHO to me, I automatically discount the story. They have been wrong nearly everytime they give advice on this pandemic. They are now saying that 3 feet is enough distance to stay apart.
    And, by the way, how many of these stories are "Peer Reviewed"?

  9. #2497
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    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    So the US is the only country over reporting deaths from COVID-19? Seriously?

    You have a virus that carries around life threatening complications and its not accelerating the death of those who have other serious illnesses? Okay, sure. If you believe that, I have a bridge that's for sale.
    Iran under reported their death total. North Korea insists they have no cases whatsoever. Russia under reports everything as does China. The only places I really believe the reports are Europe, Australia and New Zealand, and Japan and South Korea. I do not trust reports out of China, nor do I trust Russia to accurately report their totals.

  10. #2498
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    Quote Originally Posted by catman View Post
    I will continue to disagree with you on this subject. Whenever a death is reported to the county coroner, the death certificate is examined closely. In the case of Covid, everyone that was positive with Covid has to have it listed as a contributing factor on the death certificate. In many cases, the patient would have died of the underlying disease process soon anyway, and Covid only pushed them over the top. I continue to say that Covid deaths are likely inflated by at least 20% because of political interests.
    And, by the way, anytime you mention the WHO to me, I automatically discount the story. They have been wrong nearly everytime they give advice on this pandemic. They are now saying that 3 feet is enough distance to stay apart.
    And, by the way, how many of these stories are "Peer Reviewed"?
    1. Earlier you were claiming Covid was being listed as the primary cause of death, now your claim is its being listed as a contributor, something that seems completely justified if in your own words if covid “pushed them over the top”

    2. Fine, let’s completely discount the WHO. In that case I only have the CDC, Columbia University; Harvard University, Director of the State and Territorial Epidemiologists, Yale University, the American Medical Association, the College of American Pathologists, and the National Association of Medical Examiners...

    3. How many of your anecdotes are peer reviewed? Was Dr. Brix’s statement about over reporting peer reviewed?

    Also, to clear up any confusion, you’re not disagreeing with me, your disagreeing with all of 2.

  11. #2499
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    1. Earlier you were claiming Covid was being listed as the primary cause of death, now your claim is its being listed as a contributor, something that seems completely justified if in your own words if covid “pushed them over the top”

    2. Fine, let’s completely discount the WHO. In that case I only have the CDC, Columbia University; Harvard University, Director of the State and Territorial Epidemiologists, Yale University, the American Medical Association, the College of American Pathologists, and the National Association of Medical Examiners...

    3. How many of your anecdotes are peer reviewed? Was Dr. Brix’s statement about over reporting peer reviewed?

    Also, to clear up any confusion, you’re not disagreeing with me, your disagreeing with all of 2.
    No, I said that according to the medical director of my facility, Covid is listed as a "contributing" factor, but on the coroner's report, it is listed as the primary factor. A patient with underlying heart, lung, kidney or liver disease would have died anyway, but Covid pushed them over the edge faster than they would have died (I'm talking about weeks or months, not years earlier). As I said, one of the 5 had a stroke a week before she contracted Covid. She was going to be put under hospice care prior to being infected. Her death was anticipated to be imminent. Covid didn't cause her death, but the official report was that she died of Covid. Another was in hospice for kidney failure and he had been refusing to go to dialysis for several weeks prior to contracting Covid. Again, his death was listed as Covid, but he actually died because he had been refusing to go to dialysis. Still another was a lady that never recovered from Influenza A that she had contracted a month or so prior to contracting Covid. Her family was very upset when her death certificate listed Covid as the primary cause of her death. She was another that was going to be placed on hospice care.
    These are just a few real world examples of the over stating of Covid deaths.
    Again, I will say that Covid is a real threat to human health and everyone should do everything that the CDC advises us to do. They have been right every time they give us advice.
    You may continue to disagree with me if you wish. I am not in any way discounting the severity of this disease, I am just saying that the death rate in the US is over-reported for whatever reason.
    Have a nice day.

  12. #2500
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    Quote Originally Posted by koldjerky View Post
    I used to work in an ER so I still have quite a few friends (nurses, docs, techs) in the hospital. I’ve thrown this at them and while they agree about the ‘misreporting’ or whatever catman is saying, a lot are agreeing the overall is under reported.


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    The overall case number is under reported. I completely agree with that. There are a lot of false negative tests and asymptomatic carriers out there. When I was tested, my daughter (an ICU Dr.) said that she hoped that my test was positive so I could stay home where I wouldn't infect anyone. She said a false positive in this case was far better than a false negative and I agree. It's much better to think that you have this disease and stay home until you are re-tested and allowed to leave quarantine than to have a false-negative, think you are OK and go around spreading the disease.

  13. #2501
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    By the way @valade16, the most recent article you posted agrees with my that there is a distinct possibility that our death figures are too high.
    From the June 23 article:
    "For ‘all causes’ of excess deaths, the estimated number ranged from 68,774 cases to 92,742 cases. For ‘all causes excluding COVID-19,’ the estimated number of excess deaths ranged from 21,462 cases to 40,097 cases. Excess deaths reported are based on observed number of deaths relative to two different thresholds. The lower value of excess deaths was generated by comparing observed counts to the upper bound of a 95% confidence interval. Specifically, a model was used to generate a set of expected values for each jurisdiction in the US. The higher value of estimated excess deaths was generated by comparing observed counts to the average expected number of deaths.”

    Nanthida Nanthavong, MPH, Epidemiologist at GlobalData"

    And, by the way, the other articles are all from April and May. The data is a bit old, but I agree that our death count might have been under reported at that time.

  14. #2502
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    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    So the US is the only country over reporting deaths from COVID-19? Seriously?
    Never said it once. You are struggling staying on topic my friend.

    You have a virus that carries around life threatening complications and its not accelerating the death of those who have other serious illnesses? Okay, sure. If you believe that, I have a bridge that's for sale.
    No one said it can't. You are strawmanning something severe here.

  15. #2503
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    Numbers way overreported in Florida.

    Folks, there's no way to deny it that the numbers are overreported. None.

    https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/fo...ovid-19-report

  16. #2504
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    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    Terrible statement.

    In any pandemic numbers will always be unreliable to a certain degree. For example, a covid patient can get a severe respiratory infection and his own immune system can become over active and technically be the cause of death. However if we label this a covid death is that necessarily over reporting?

    What you're saying has truth to it, but I think quite going overboard with it and just kinda running with a narrative.

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    You say I am wrong and then right in the same response.
    The numbers are off, as much as 25%. That's overblown. That's the facts. The narrative would be those saying way more and those saying way less.

  17. #2505
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    Quote Originally Posted by zookman65 View Post

    Hey Brett - What is a Covid death in your opinion. Is there such a thing as a Covid death? What does a Covid death look like. Just because the science based reality doesn't jive with your world view on politics doesnt make it not true. Maybe you should question your world view a bit. Oh by the way the scientists say the earth is round also....
    You are not worth the time for an honest response.
    Last edited by brett05; 07-14-2020 at 10:48 AM.

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