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  1. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by petrey10 View Post
    Yeah I understand that the cap is going down. Do any of you feel that they are going to do something to change that? Due to covid. I feel like at some point the NFLPA is going to negotiate something to mitigate what will be a significant drop in income for the players. Thatís a huge number.
    They already have sort of done something. The cap drop should be even more than its projected at, so they've already given in some. They may give a little more yet, but there's probably going to be a pretty decent drop no matter what.

  2. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRNMN View Post
    On a slight side note, in terms of future cap space, it would be huge if both Martin and Barnes can prove to be viable options cutting lose Kirksey at the end of the year would save the team about $5 mil.
    I mean, I think with the way kirksey played and now having some injuries, he would need to be really good not to get cut. Every dime will be needed next year.

  3. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    Every dime will be needed next year.
    it's going to be a bloodbath next year league wide. i think the most obvious cut for Green Bay will be Mason Crosby. correction! he is a free agent next year.

  4. #139
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    At this point, preston Smith is very much on the chopping block. Gary is better for sure.

    But we legit will have to consider all of P Smith, Amos, kirksey, Turner, and Wagner.

  5. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    At this point, preston Smith is very much on the chopping block. Gary is better for sure.

    But we legit will have to consider all of P Smith, Amos, kirksey, Turner, and Wagner.
    I always thought Turner was a 2 year guy with the way his contract was structured. Surprised the Packers didn't draft any sort of tackle this past year. Jenkins may have to move over for Runyan to take a spot if they don't draft a tackle this year.

  6. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by alabastertubby View Post
    it's going to be a bloodbath next year league wide. i think the most obvious cut for Green Bay will be Mason Crosby. correction! he is a free agent next year.
    I think Mason is actually pretty safe. You still have to eat about half of his salary, and if you're getting a decent kicker you saved nothing if you bring in another vet for 2 mil range. If anything Mason may be a potential restructure guy, I think he's a guy who wants to stay in Green Bay and if the team really needed may take a small cut to help things out.

    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    At this point, preston Smith is very much on the chopping block. Gary is better for sure.

    But we legit will have to consider all of P Smith, Amos, kirksey, Turner, and Wagner.

    For sure being gone though I see Kirksey, Wagner, Lowry, and Turner if you cut those 4 guys you get an additional 16 mil in cap space right out the gate. It allows you to place the ERFA tenders on those who need to come back and the RFA tenders on Lancaster and Tonyan. This is a far stretch from affording to bring back Bak and Jones. I'm not seeing much money for Bak or Jones which is likely why we haven't seen an extension yet. They are going to have to franchise tag one of them more than likely, but the other one may be left to walk. I would have to argue Bak makes more sense too. For cap purposes, you can flip Jenkins outside to RT, plug Runyan, and Patrick into the interior. They will have to likely gamble and hope Hanson, Stepniak, or Nijman can fill the other IOL spots. Some restructures will need to happen.

    Restructures are going to be needed and that's going to be the sign of the smart GM's this off-season. Even if they could convince the top 3-4 contracts to take a $-2 mil cut The teams which will remain afloat the best will be the ones who have vet's willing to take a slight 2021 decrease.

    I think Amos would be the hardest to let go of. You still take a $5 mil cap hit by cutting Amos. Much like cutting Crosby you still have to take half the contract and unless you draft a replacement your on the cheap end paying the other half to the replacement player. Of the group would be the most difficult to replace not saying he's the best player on the list, but you have Gary for P. Smith, you have Barnes/Martin/Summers, Patrick/Runyan in place of Turner/Wagner. Amos I don't see anyone taking his spot. On P. Smith his contract isn't ridiculous they may be able to get some draft capital for him. Cap wise you're still taking the 8 mil hit. Or with cap how it's looking they could find another team to swap deals for a productive player of a need spot. The team will need to get crafty with a few spots.

  7. #142
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    To be fair on the Patrick Runyan thing, you essentially have to bring back at least one of Linsley or bak at a minimum. And even then you're super, super shallow there.

    Maybe P has some trade value, but hes been pretty bad this year. Throughout his career his numbers have ebbed and flowed quite a bit, but if his level of play remains the same the rest of the year, he's an easy cut for me. It's more than just the cap savings next year. That will be needed for sure, but clearing all bus cap allows the packers to do what they always do, which is back load deals. Look at Z's deal. Hia average was $16 per year but his cap hit was $7.25 in year one. There's a good chance any Bak extension looks like that in structure.

    And that's a similar arguement I made about nixk perry too. Everyone thought we'd post June 1st him to even the dead money, but the packers philosophy has been to clear that money right away and back load deals. That's where cutting guys like P and Amos pays off. It hurts the team but if it means starting a lesser safety but being able to return a better starter elsewhere, it might be worth it.

    I think most are also under rating King's importance. His injury history is scary, but yesterday partially shows why he's vital. Out backups at CB stink and we are scared to leave them on an island. It's part of the bend but don't break philosophy. I don't like jt, but part of me gets it, especially after seeing Jackson's PI on Miller. Jackson tackled well yesterday for sure, but showed his limitations in coverage. Having bad corners limits what we do defensively so much.
    Last edited by crewfan13; 10-19-2020 at 11:13 AM.

  8. #143
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    It's hard to say because he's been phenomenal, but Jones feels like the one who should go. RB 2nd contracts almost never age well, and we spent an early pick on his replacement. Williams has been improved this year. So I wonder if we let Jones walk and bring back Williams much cheaper.

    I know that's going to be an unpopular opinion, but drafting a RB in the 2nd then paying your current RB a big money deal doesn't seem like a smart move.

  9. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    To be fair on the Patrick Runyan thing, you essentially have to bring back at least one of Linsley or bak at a minimum. And even then you're super, super shallow there.

    Maybe P has some trade value, but hes been pretty bad this year. Throughout his career his numbers have ebbed and flowed quite a bit, but if his level of play remains the same the rest of the year, he's an easy cut for me. It's more than just the cap savings next year. That will be needed for sure, but clearing all bus cap allows the packers to do what they always do, which is back load deals. Look at Z's deal. Hia average was $16 per year but his cap hit was $7.25 in year one. There's a good chance any Bak extension looks like that in structure.

    And that's a similar arguement I made about nixk perry too. Everyone thought we'd post June 1st him to even the dead money, but the packers philosophy has been to clear that money right away and back load deals. That's where cutting guys like P and Amos pays off. It hurts the team but if it means starting a lesser safety but being able to return a better starter elsewhere, it might be worth it.

    I think most are also under rating King's importance. His injury history is scary, but yesterday partially shows why he's vital. Out backups at CB stink and we are scared to leave them on an island. It's part of the bend but don't break philosophy. I don't like jt, but part of me gets it, especially after seeing Jackson's PI on Miller. Jackson tackled well yesterday for sure, but showed his limitations in coverage. Having bad corners limits what we do defensively so much.
    What will be difficult is getting Bak close to the number he is looking for. Linsley will also want a decent pay day too. If you franchise Bak I think that's a $14 mil hit which is managable if Bak, but tagging players is often messy. No matter what they do on the OL they are going to be pretty shallow.

    All the better if they can trade P. Smith because cut or trade him you're still taking a $8 mil cap hit. They will need as much space to fill need spots. So even getting a few lower round picks in return could have some value to save cap, a ton of future space, and fill out the bottom of the roster on the cheap. Keeping in mind Alexander and Davante will be looking for new deals in 2022 dropping P. Smith isn't a horrible idea.

    However, I don't see much pay off on cutting Amos. Cutting Amos you wouldn't be getting a lesser safety it could be a significantly lesser safety unless they take as safety high in the draft. Other spots on the roster you see a clear replacement. On the King point, if King cannot be retain there is no way you can let Amos go IMO. I don't think you can honestly pencil Jackson in to start at CB. I would actually be shocked if Jackson is not considered to be cut, that would be I think almost $2 mil in cap space for a guy who needs a new scene.

    I will be hard to let King go, if they can get him to agree closer to the $10 mil mark finding a way to make that happen would be worth looking into. But if his agent is looking at the Trae Waynes deal as a base for his deal the Packers certainly can't afford him at $15 mil.

    On a side note: LaFleur may want to consider what MM waited too long to do and look for a new DC if things don't shape up soon. Even in the 4 wins the defense hasn't been all too dazzling. Not saying Pettine is all the problem, but if they don't make a signifcant run this year that has to be on the mind of the FO and LaFleur. I'm venturing to guess his seat is warm at a minimum with the assistants being shifted last off season. We have defensive players, but we don't have a defense. The amount of talent isn't translating to results.

    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    It's hard to say because he's been phenomenal, but Jones feels like the one who should go. RB 2nd contracts almost never age well, and we spent an early pick on his replacement. Williams has been improved this year. So I wonder if we let Jones walk and bring back Williams much cheaper.

    I know that's going to be an unpopular opinion, but drafting a RB in the 2nd then paying your current RB a big money deal doesn't seem like a smart move.
    I would agree I'm not sure Jones is back either largely because the cap situation could get ugly. How they have been handling Dillon seems more like they are controlling the miles on Dillon's legs while giving him some seasoning for next year. I know a lot of people have criticized the use of Dillon, but if this is the case then I see no issue with it. Also, there have been multiple reports of them using the success of Jones/Williams to develop Dillon as a receiver. Certainly wouldn't have an issue on going with Williams/Dillon. Jones may be a hard decision to let walk, but RB isn't the hardest position to find replacements when as you mention many teams are hesitant to give RB's a second contract.

  10. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRNMN View Post
    What will be difficult is getting Bak close to the number he is looking for. Linsley will also want a decent pay day too. If you franchise Bak I think that's a $14 mil hit which is managable if Bak, but tagging players is often messy. No matter what they do on the OL they are going to be pretty shallow.

    All the better if they can trade P. Smith because cut or trade him you're still taking a $8 mil cap hit. They will need as much space to fill need spots. So even getting a few lower round picks in return could have some value to save cap, a ton of future space, and fill out the bottom of the roster on the cheap. Keeping in mind Alexander and Davante will be looking for new deals in 2022 dropping P. Smith isn't a horrible idea.

    However, I don't see much pay off on cutting Amos. Cutting Amos you wouldn't be getting a lesser safety it could be a significantly lesser safety unless they take as safety high in the draft. Other spots on the roster you see a clear replacement. On the King point, if King cannot be retain there is no way you can let Amos go IMO. I don't think you can honestly pencil Jackson in to start at CB. I would actually be shocked if Jackson is not considered to be cut, that would be I think almost $2 mil in cap space for a guy who needs a new scene.

    I will be hard to let King go, if they can get him to agree closer to the $10 mil mark finding a way to make that happen would be worth looking into. But if his agent is looking at the Trae Waynes deal as a base for his deal the Packers certainly can't afford him at $15 mil.

    On a side note: LaFleur may want to consider what MM waited too long to do and look for a new DC if things don't shape up soon. Even in the 4 wins the defense hasn't been all too dazzling. Not saying Pettine is all the problem, but if they don't make a signifcant run this year that has to be on the mind of the FO and LaFleur. I'm venturing to guess his seat is warm at a minimum with the assistants being shifted last off season. We have defensive players, but we don't have a defense. The amount of talent isn't translating to results.



    I would agree I'm not sure Jones is back either largely because the cap situation could get ugly. How they have been handling Dillon seems more like they are controlling the miles on Dillon's legs while giving him some seasoning for next year. I know a lot of people have criticized the use of Dillon, but if this is the case then I see no issue with it. Also, there have been multiple reports of them using the success of Jones/Williams to develop Dillon as a receiver. Certainly wouldn't have an issue on going with Williams/Dillon. Jones may be a hard decision to let walk, but RB isn't the hardest position to find replacements when as you mention many teams are hesitant to give RB's a second contract.
    I'll start at the bottom and work up a bit here too. As for Dillon, Williams took a legit jump this year. I don't think we saw that coming. I expected Dillon to take over Williams role by mid season. Maybe not as a pass blocker, but at least as a rusher. Williams has legit been solid enough that he will likely hold off Dillon. I could see Dillon get some more burn as the season wears on, but barring injury, I expect Williams to out touch Dillon almost every week. So it's hard to criticize the Dillon usage, not that you were.

    As for Amos, last year I would have agreed. This year, I'm not sure the guys we have are huge downgrades. I really think he's been quite bad this year. He's had some terrible run fills at times this year. More than once, including a big jones run on Sunday, he was late to fill against the run to the point where he never even lays a hand on the runner. He's getting torched in one on ones vs guys like gronk who looked washed up until yesterday.

    I think you can find that type of production for cheaper. If he bounces back, maybe it's a different story, but hes struggled.

    Pettine should be on the hot seat. He never makes adjustments. If the initial plan doesn't work, we're screwed. I think part of the problem with our defense is that we're too studs and duds. We have some really talented guys. Clark, jaire and Z are really good. King and Gary are pretty good too. But the rest kind of stink. Even with P and Amos playing well last year, we still have some below average to flat out bad guys playing alot of snaps. Pettine needs to be better, but there's times where kind of get his struggles though too. When Dean Lowry and Tyler Lancaster are getting blown up and you don't have much for run defenders behind them, there's not a ton you can do.

    I give Barnes a ton of credit for lookinf solid as a udfa. I'm cautiously optimistic on Martin. But it just compounds the DL problem when our ilbs are consistently below average too. And that impacts everything. We get hyper conservative and play zone against any decent TE or pass catching RB because of those struggles in the middle of the field too. And guys like Will Redmond and Raven Greene aren't exactly Derwin James stepping into that sub LB role either. I know every defense has weak points, but ours just seem to stack up and compound each other as opposed to offsetting each other.

  11. #146
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  12. #147
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    I haven't seen anything official but, have seen some writers mention Robert Foster is being signed to Washington's active roster.

  13. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by PackerBum9786 View Post
    I haven't seen anything official but, have seen some writers mention Robert Foster is being signed to Washington's active roster.
    Looks like that is true.

    Packers now only have 2 WR on practice squad. Reggie Begelton and Juwan Winfree.
    Last edited by ugottabjoshinme; 10-21-2020 at 10:09 AM.

  14. #149
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    I was beginning to wonder why he wasn't added to the main roster. But dont blame him he goes there now basically the Washington #2 a chance he wouldn't get here. It was one of those moves you hope you could stash long enough, but is what it is

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