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  1. #3691
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    Apr 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by CP_414 View Post
    It was like August last year when they realized Wick was good and not that much earlier for Ryan. Hopefully it’s a lot quicker this year.
    True, but the guy pulling the trigger on those type of decisions is no longer here.

  2. #3692
    Join Date
    May 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1908_Cubs View Post
    I don't think the rotation looks bad. I don't think it's "great" but it's probably fine. Darvish looked like a TORP last year. Hendricks is a fine #2. Between Quintana and Lester you've probably got a low end 3 and a high end 4 type in both. Neither are good, neither are bad. Alec Mills/Tyler Chatwood/Adbert Alzolay can hold down a 5 spot between them for half a year. If you're in contention, you can easily nail down a SP for fairly cheap.

    Bullpen is a lot more iffy. But with a team who gave a **** this offseason, it didn't have to. Kimbrel is a questionmark but I don't think he's done. Rowan Wick is good. Kyle Ryan is good. There's enough interesting secondary arms on the team that they'll find a few pitchers out of the Weick/Winkler/Adam/Tepera/Underwood who are probably good enough as 6th/7th inning guys. With a little money, you could have added an arm in there, and honestly, it's probably solid. And you've got a guy like Marquez who, especially bullpen-wise, is probably ready by July.

    The team isn't that flawed. With spending some money on this team, there's a winner there. I don't think either are amazing. But both could range from better than average to good.
    Do you honestly think that's a playoff-caliber rotation ?because I don't see it...

    I think Lester and Q continue to decline and Darvish isnt getting any younger himself. Only guy on this rotation I truly trust to give quality consistency is Hendricks. To me that is not nearly enough.

    Add that into the fact that the bullpen looks scary and the offense is the same exact unit last year but with the possibility of no Castellanos? Yeah man really hard for me to get the warm and fuzzies for this club right now it's just not happening.


    The real Pride of the Midwest

  3. #3693
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    May 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by chibears55 View Post
    The names aren't bad, it the ages and consistency that a concern

    Yep.


    The real Pride of the Midwest

  4. #3694
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    Apr 2008
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    9,437
    Quote Originally Posted by turnaround3 View Post
    I'm on the other side on this one.

    I relish the armchair sleuths; they've put murderers in jail, got innocent people released - thousands/millions of manpower hours on reddit of free research is a good, not bad thing - to me. All this guy's doing, and all any of them are doing, are presenting information. It's up to the viewer to decide if it's sufficient for them to make up their mind or not.

    In this case, I think it's more than sufficient. I'm disgusted by Manfred rolling over to the MLBPA on this. I really, really hope there's more to come, because with the gingerly applied slap on the wrist he's so far brought down, he's essentially made a mockery of the game.

    If it were me I'd want lifetime bans for literally everyone involved. Go to war with the association, I don't give a ****. This is a disgrace.
    I posted on here 2 years ago that I thought Houston was cheating somehow. My suspicion was that they were juicing. They still may be. I also thought the SP's were using a foreign substance. I never thought it was this though.

    They basically received little to no punishment here. Five million dollars, and 4 draft choices? Hahaha

    They will likely be able to pay that fine with the money they save hiring a new manager and GM. To me, this kind of penalty encourages cheating. Because at the end of the day, it was worth it.

  5. #3695
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
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    14,935
    Quote Originally Posted by Cubs420 View Post
    Do you honestly think that's a playoff-caliber rotation ?because I don't see it...

    I think Lester and Q continue to decline and Darvish isnt getting any younger himself. Only guy on this rotation I truly trust to give quality consistency is Hendricks. To me that is not nearly enough.

    Add that into the fact that the bullpen looks scary and the offense is the same exact unit last year but with the possibility of no Castellanos? Yeah man really hard for me to get the warm and fuzzies for this club right now it's just not happening.
    So I will answer this differently. I think the rotation is good enough to win the division. Not sure why at 30 Q has to regress. So for me they have 2 solid starters and then Q and Lester as MOR starters. That is fine to win the division. As for the offense, remember NC got here August 1st. They were in first without him. IMO has they kept what they have and did the following they are absolutely a playoff team.
    Sign 2 of Pillar/Japanese centerfielder/Asdrubal/Cozart/Zobrist/etc to strengthen the bench and sign someone like Gio Gonzalez as a fifth starter and then sign the pen arms they signed and you can absolutely win. And once the playoffs start any pitcher can get hot. Those signings would have kept them will below the high LT penalties and given them a solid team.

  6. #3696
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    Aug 2006
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    55,273
    Quote Originally Posted by Cubs420 View Post
    Do you honestly think that's a playoff-caliber rotation ?because I don't see it...

    I think Lester and Q continue to decline and Darvish isnt getting any younger himself. Only guy on this rotation I truly trust to give quality consistency is Hendricks. To me that is not nearly enough.

    Add that into the fact that the bullpen looks scary and the offense is the same exact unit last year but with the possibility of no Castellanos? Yeah man really hard for me to get the warm and fuzzies for this club right now it's just not happening.
    Why wouldn't it be "playoff caliber"? It's absolutely playoff caliber. It was playoff caliber last year. The issue with the team isn't the rotation, hell, it's probably the thing I'm most confident in right now. I think it's absolutely fine. Darvish/Hendricks is a fine 1/2. Lester/Quintana are a fine 3/4. I mean, look at what the Brewers have been trotting out for the last two years. Their strength was the bullpen, but if that garbage pile was "playoff caliber" (because it literally made the playoffs), then ours was, too. It's not 2019 Nationals good, but one does not need to be 2019 Nationals good in the rotation to be playoff caliber.

    Realistically, this wasn't a bad team last year. It was an 84 win team that had the worst pythag luck (tied) in the league at -6. They lost Baez (with no real replacement other than a kid who barely saw AA time), they had a slightly banged up team (Hamels was never right in the 2nd half, Kimbrel wasn't, Strop's injury seemed to have killed him), and with a week to go were right in the thick of things before the wheels just came crashing off. They didn't have to do a ton to remain a playoff caliber team. Would it have been flawed? Would it have had potential variance issues? All true. But it doesn't mean they couldn't have been in the thick of the division again, and then the playoffs are always a crapshoot.

    The amount of flaws the team had last year is greatly overblown by the fandom. I don't want to paint this team as some world beater (it wasn't), but it's not nearly as bad as some liked to have pretended it to have been, either. Yeah, today it's not the greatest, but that's because they have literally refused to do anything to help the MLB team all offseason. The bullpen is iffy, but has some interesting arms. The rotation is pretty good. It could have been a good team. They've basically torpedoed that at this juncture and barring the Bryant/Arenado trade scenarios, I think it'll remain that way.
    Last edited by 1908_Cubs; 01-17-2020 at 10:20 AM.

  7. #3697
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    Jun 2004
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    44,606
    Quote Originally Posted by rcal10 View Post
    So I will answer this differently. I think the rotation is good enough to win the division. Not sure why at 30 Q has to regress. So for me they have 2 solid starters and then Q and Lester as MOR starters. That is fine to win the division. As for the offense, remember NC got here August 1st. They were in first without him. IMO has they kept what they have and did the following they are absolutely a playoff team.
    Sign 2 of Pillar/Japanese centerfielder/Asdrubal/Cozart/Zobrist/etc to strengthen the bench and sign someone like Gio Gonzalez as a fifth starter and then sign the pen arms they signed and you can absolutely win. And once the playoffs start any pitcher can get hot. Those signings would have kept them will below the high LT penalties and given them a solid team.
    Gio signed with CWS. They really had a great offseason.

  8. #3698
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    Aug 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by WOwolfOL View Post
    Gio signed with CWS. They really had a great offseason.
    Not nearly as big of a fan of their offseason as others. Don't like Kuechel. Don't like the Abreu contract. Think they're going to be a defensive nightmare. And it's not a "I don't like the White Sox" thing, because truly, couldn't care less about the White Sox and don't get into the whole Chicago rivalry thing. Honestly, just don't really like their offseason that much.

  9. #3699
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    Jul 2007
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    14,935
    Quote Originally Posted by WOwolfOL View Post
    Gio signed with CWS. They really had a great offseason.
    I realize that. Just suggesting that if the FO was allied to allocate the $30M they are saving what the Cubs could have done to compete. I completely agree with 1908 that the fan base exaggerates when it talks like this team needs so much. As he said, it has flaws. But manly some depth and the team is solid.

  10. #3700
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    Jul 2018
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    4,720
    Quote Originally Posted by rcal10 View Post
    Except the Rockies have to also have a high price on Arenado. Of course Theo is going to go in high. I think it was reported about 6 months ago now (JK, more like 2 weeks ago) the Cub gave the Braves a list of 4 guys and said they can pick 3 to give back. The list had Anderson/Wright/Riley/Waters, I believe. I would say that is going in high.
    What I'm saying, Rockies will be high, so I hope they go high and stick to it and don't cave in to a return less then the Rockies, for the sake of moving him and his salary..

  11. #3701
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    Jul 2018
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stratos View Post
    Lester had a 3.72 ERA before all-star break, 5.35 ERA after. He had a 4.33 ERA in 2017 and 3.32 ERA in 2018. He could bounce back a bit in 2020, who knows. Same with Q.
    That proves my point of consistency [emoji2369]
    It not there

  12. #3702
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    Dec 2010
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    27,027
    Quote Originally Posted by Cubs420 View Post
    Do you honestly think that's a playoff-caliber rotation ?because I don't see it...

    I think Lester and Q continue to decline and Darvish isnt getting any younger himself. Only guy on this rotation I truly trust to give quality consistency is Hendricks. To me that is not nearly enough.

    Add that into the fact that the bullpen looks scary and the offense is the same exact unit last year but with the possibility of no Castellanos? Yeah man really hard for me to get the warm and fuzzies for this club right now it's just not happening.
    I reject your insistence that Q and Lester have "continuously declined." Lester was substantially better in 2019 than 2018. He performed much closer to his 2017 self. As for Quintana, his ERA was high, but likewise, a much better FIP than 2018. Looking at his career, I think it's fair to say 2018 was more of an outlier/bad year than an indication of a serious decline. Both performed like MORP type pitchers in a playoff caliber rotation.
    Last edited by La_bibbers; 01-17-2020 at 11:59 AM.

  13. #3703
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    Nov 2014
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    11,123

    2019-20 Offseason Thread 2.0: Winter Meetings Edition

    Listening to Hoyer on 670 right now it sounds almost like Bryant has already been traded. I’m
    sure someone will tweet the quotes soon, but listening to him it just feels completely inevitable.

    Obviously nothing will be official until the grievance is over.
    Last edited by CP_414; 01-17-2020 at 12:37 PM.

  14. #3704
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    May 2012
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    1,023
    Quote Originally Posted by CP_414 View Post
    Listening to Hoyer on 670 right now it sounds almost like Bryant has already been traded. I’m
    sure someone will tweet the quotes soon, but listening to him it just feels completely inevitable.

    Obviously nothing will be official until the grievance is over.
    Any place to find transcripts?

  15. #3705
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    Nov 2014
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    2019-20 Offseason Thread 2.0: Winter Meetings Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by jfoley89 View Post
    Any place to find transcripts?
    I’m sure they’ll post audio later. Brett frequently writes up these interviews, too so he might have something. Theo is on at 2 if anyone wants to hear him avoid the same questions while they wait on the grievance.

    Jed was talking in the past tense about keeping this group together, said they are past the point of extending everyone, “wouldn’t comment” about extending KB specifically but basically said “we’ve tried, it’s not a secret that we’ve tried.” Talked about how when you have a bunch of prearb players you can be aggressive to add to them but when they are in arb you can’t do as much. He said the offseason is just starting for them and they expect to be active, but the implication is that doesn’t start until the grievance is done. Lots of stuff about David Ross and lots about the Astros, too.

    The hosts are talking about it now and their takeaway was the same as mine. It was all in the past tense and KB is “so gone.”
    Last edited by CP_414; 01-17-2020 at 12:54 PM.

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