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View Poll Results: Who would YOU vote for the Hall of Fame?

Voters
13. You may not vote on this poll
  • Barry Bonds

    9 69.23%
  • Roger Clemens

    8 61.54%
  • Curt Schilling

    8 61.54%
  • Larry Walker

    10 76.92%
  • Derek Jeter

    12 92.31%
  • Scott Rolen

    5 38.46%
  • Manny Ramirez

    7 53.85%
  • Andruw Jones

    4 30.77%
  • Todd Helton

    2 15.38%
  • Gary Sheffield

    1 7.69%
  • Andy Pettitte

    2 15.38%
  • Bobby Abreu

    2 15.38%
  • Sammy Sosa

    1 7.69%
  • Jeff Kent

    3 23.08%
  • Jason Giambi

    0 0%
  • Omar Vizquel

    2 15.38%
  • Cliff Lee

    4 30.77%
  • Rafael Furcal

    1 7.69%
  • Eric Chavez

    1 7.69%
  • Josh Beckett

    1 7.69%
  • Brian Roberts

    0 0%
  • Alfonso Soriano

    0 0%
  • Billy Wagner

    3 23.08%
  • Paul Konerko

    1 7.69%
  • Carlos Pena

    0 0%
  • Chone Figgins

    0 0%
  • Raul Ibanez

    0 0%
  • Brady Penny

    0 0%
  • Adam Dunn

    0 0%
  • JJ Putz

    0 0%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Results 46 to 60 of 79
  1. #46
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    47,377
    Boyish smile and a backwards cap = ALL GOOD HERE!

  2. #47
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Phanland
    Posts
    7,244
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    That's not a testament to him.

    Ryan Howard had a .954 OPS before he was traded, and a 1.281 OPS after
    Chase Utley went from a .865 OPS before he was traded, and a .942 OPS after
    Jimmy Rollins went from a .759 OPS, and a .891 OPS after

    The team ERA went from a 4.83 to a 4.36 after he was traded

    They replace Abreu with Dellucci who had a .849 OPS the rest of the year (Abreu for the Yankees had a .926)

    I refuse to believe that Abreu is the reason the team wasn't playing well until after he was traded.
    Obviously, stats improve when winning. Why were they? I think a lot of times things like club atmosphere and leadership is overlooked in this game.

  3. #48
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    57,278
    Quote Originally Posted by thefeckcampaign View Post
    Obviously, stats improve when winning. Why were they? I think a lot of times things like club atmosphere and leadership is overlooked in this game.
    Sure, but I don't think David Dellucci was considered any more likable or a better clubhouse guy than Bobby Abreu who would be considered a good team mate everywhere in his career.

    Phillies fans hated the guy due to perceptions. Not reality.

    That said, the timeline of winning sure did improve when he left. I just don't think it had anything to do with him.

  4. #49
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Phanland
    Posts
    7,244
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    Sure, but I don't think David Dellucci was considered any more likable or a better clubhouse guy than Bobby Abreu who would be considered a good team mate everywhere in his career.

    Phillies fans hated the guy due to perceptions. Not reality.

    That said, the timeline of winning sure did improve when he left. I just don't think it had anything to do with him.
    When the old guard of Rolen and Abreu were out, the younger guys took charge. Both on a statistical end would have improved tremendously if Rolen and Abreu were added, but would the younger players have had their time? I doubt it.

    Why ever fire a manager or bring in a clubhouse guy if none of that matters?

    I didnít hate either Rolen or Abreu, but I do know the buzz around the team instantly changed when Abreu was gone, more so than when they fired Bowa.

    It was the opposite when they brought in Pete Rose.
    Last edited by thefeckcampaign; 11-21-2019 at 03:59 PM.

  5. #50
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    57,278
    Quote Originally Posted by thefeckcampaign View Post
    When the old guard of Rolen and Abreu were out, the younger guys took charge. Both on a statistical end would have improved tremendously if Rolen and Abreu were added, but would the younger players have had their time? I doubt it.

    Why ever fire a manager or bring in a clubhouse guy if none of that matters?

    I didnít hate either Rolen or Abreu, but I do know the buzz around the team instantly changed when Abreu was gone, more so than when they fired Bowa.

    It was the opposite when they brought in Pete Rose.
    I mean


    C - Lieberthan
    1B - Howard
    2B - Utley
    SS - Rollins
    3B - Rolen
    LF - Burrell
    CF - Rowand/Victorino
    RF - Abreu

    Would have been the best lineup in baseball by 2007.

    But Abrham Nunez/Pedro Feliz would play third and Jayson Werth would come along (though if they moved on from Burrell and not Abreu, they could have kept it together).


    It would more than anything, depend on the financials of the team. But that team probably wins some World Series' more than just 08.

    Cliff Lee, Cole Hamels, Roy Oswalt, Roy Halladay joining the rotation at various times 08-10

    Jesus what a team that could have been.

    I don't think Abreu can be blamed. This isn't basketball where one player is every thing. Abreu is a complimentary player who needs other 4-6 win players around him to make a team a studdly team. He isn't an 8 win MVP player, he's a perennial All-Star though.

    I get what you mean, but the mood/feeling often times seems to be unfounded. But maybe that is the case here. Abreu never did play in a World Series, and only appeared in one LCS, and he had a miserable .516 OPS in it.

  6. #51
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    26,108
    Quote Originally Posted by thawv View Post
    I actually agree with this theory
    So do i. It wouldn't bother me if they said, I dont know if you did, or you didnt, but everyone from this time period was aware of the cheating and no one did ****.

    Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk
    Last edited by Jamiecballer; 11-21-2019 at 10:36 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  7. #52
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    205
    If I know you stuck a needle in your butt to increase your helmet size, you don't get in. Sounds crass, but it's what I believe.

  8. #53
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    37,470
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    I don't see why anyone would assume Junior didn't take PED's
    I never understood this either. He seems to always get a free pass. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if he took steroids, or if he didn't.

  9. #54
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    9,440
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    I don't see why anyone would assume Junior didn't take PED's
    I agree 100%. There is a lot of tell tale signs that he was juicing. I think he was on and off throughout his career

  10. #55
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    57,278
    I love how much more advanced the general posters on this forum are, that someone can say something so blasphemous like 'I don't see why anyone would assume Junior didn't take PED's' about one of the most loved baseball players of all time, and most posters actually agree with it.

    Try saying that on a general sports forum and see what happens to you.

  11. #56
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    9,440
    There is a lot of intelligent baseball people on this site

  12. #57
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    La Puente, CA
    Posts
    14,233
    This place was dumber when there were more posters (10+ years ago).

    Future Hall of Shamers:
    (1) B.A.L.C.O. Barroids (2) Mark McJuicer (3) Jose Chem-seco (4) Rafael Palmeiroids (5) Ken Chem-initi (6) Jason Gi-andro (7) Ryan Fraud (8) Muscle Melk (9) Woman-Ram (10) Shammy Sosa (11) Roger Clear-mens (12) A-Roid (13) Ryan HGHoward

  13. #58
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Phanland
    Posts
    7,244
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    I love how much more advanced the general posters on this forum are, that someone can say something so blasphemous like 'I don't see why anyone would assume Junior didn't take PED's' about one of the most loved baseball players of all time, and most posters actually agree with it.

    Try saying that on a general sports forum and see what happens to you.
    I have no leads if he did. I think thatís where the difference lies. Could he have? Of course. You never know someone is committing a crime until they get caught. He could have just been someone who was really slick at it.

    I think the skinny body as much as his smile is what gives Griffey a pass.

  14. #59
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Phanland
    Posts
    7,244
    Quote Originally Posted by dodgerdave View Post
    This place was dumber when there were more posters (10+ years ago).
    I think people have had more time to think about it. Everyone on here is 10 years older for the most part too. There were many blind defenders of their childhood heroes here back then even when there were proven facts be it denial or saying it doesnít matter.

    Personally, I cannot see the amount being all that much more than the 8% or so that were initially tested supposedly in secret; not to the amount where many of the defenders use it to justify letting those caught or strongly suspected pass by.

  15. #60
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    San Francisco, CA
    Posts
    39,087
    Eric Chavez, Josh Beckett, and Paul Konerko with votes. Yikes.

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