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  1. #9901
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewing View Post
    Solid point. It would definitely be confusing and annoying. Pass


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  2. #9902
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    Cole and Hampton...I see disaster written all over both of these guys. Cole has a chance but he's not the answer at the guard spot for the Knicks. Might be a good 6th man but not my kind of PG. Hampton, i just don't see anything that says he'll be good.

  3. #9903
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShadyOne View Post
    I donít think thereís necessarily a type he wants. His teams in Minny were not similar to the ones in Chicago. He did have shooters, even Deng and Roses 3pt attempts went up. He just happened to have star players that werenít shooters.

    You need shooters right now. Donít necessarily need to lead the league, but you need to have enough guys that need to be respected. In the end of the day, you need top level players first. Wouldnít be mad with getting something anywhere near the quality of Chicago Rose. Although I wonder how effective/valued he would be
    Rose and Butler werenít above average shooters either especially from behind the arc, itís just the way Thibs like to play why he brought them to Minny also.

    Minny had no above average shooter in my view they were average. Town was the only one near above avg from behind the arc after they moved LaVine for Butler.

    Rose was the only star, Deng was just an all-star and Noah and Butler were developed to be who they turned out to be.

    Canít really say that with Minny he brought in Rose and Taj to speed up the curve for the way he like he run his teams.

    Cole and Hampton arenít afraid to shoot which is what we need, but they come with athleticism. You said we need shooterís and thatís what they are, efficiency is another story they can improve. But Iíll take that over a slow footed shooter with no skill to break down a defense. Why I donít want Hali heís better off going to Atlanta to be a secondary ball handler next to Tre and would have time to shoot. Heís only good when he has space and struggles in all other parts of shooting when covered due to his slow release and its slow and from chest level, that to me is major negative if you want him as focal point right away.

    I just think people need to watch more Thibs coached teams from Chicago and Minny and see what plays he ran the most. Only way to see more shooting from behind the arc is hoping Woodson adds more wrinkles to Thibs style.

    Telling Thibs to play outside in is the same as telling DíAntoni to play inside out. It wonít happen, can only hope he can be flexible. Thibs is a defensive minded coach first who is good at developing players on the defensive end and with the Knicks as an assistant learned to play inside ou and defense first. He was a PG himself before going into coaching.
    ďTwo things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe.Ē
    ― Albert Einstein
    ďI will be the first to admit that I am a pessimist by nature. It is, after all, the wisest way to be. We pessimists have everything to gain, whereas optimists have a fifty-fifty chance of being disappointed.Ē
    ― Tamar Myers
    ďDon't let them drag you down by rumors just go with what you believe in.Ē
    ― Michael Jordan

  4. #9904
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    Quote Originally Posted by justcallmetm View Post
    Rose and Butler werenít above average shooters either especially from behind the arc, itís just the way Thibs like to play why he brought them to Minny also.

    Minny had no above average shooter in my view they were average. Town was the only one near above avg from behind the arc after they moved LaVine for Butler.

    Rose was the only star, Deng was just an all-star and Noah and Butler were developed to be who they turned out to be.

    Canít really say that with Minny he brought in Rose and Taj to speed up the curve for the way he like he run his teams.

    Cole and Hampton arenít afraid to shoot which is what we need, but they come with athleticism. You said we need shooterís and thatís what they are, efficiency is another story they can improve. But Iíll take that over a slow footed shooter with no skill to break down a defense. Why I donít want Hali heís better off going to Atlanta to be a secondary ball handler next to Tre and would have time to shoot. Heís only good when he has space and struggles in all other parts of shooting when covered due to his slow release and its slow and from chest level, that to me is major negative if you want him as focal point right away.

    I just think people need to watch more Thibs coached teams from Chicago and Minny and see what plays he ran the most. Only way to see more shooting from behind the arc is hoping Woodson adds more wrinkles to Thibs style.

    Telling Thibs to play outside in is the same as telling DíAntoni to play inside out. It wonít happen, can only hope he can be flexible. Thibs is a defensive minded coach first who is good at developing players on the defensive end and with the Knicks as an assistant learned to play inside out. He was a PG himself before going into coaching.
    Maybe they should be more afraid to shoot cause Cole takes awful shots. I watch Cole play and I see no athleticism at all. RJ is kinda athletic and speedy but watching him in EU shows me he's not playing above the rim either. These two would be a disaster especially since neither are play makers. Knicks should stop over thinking it. There are 3 elite level play makers in the top 10....Don't blow it.

  5. #9905
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    Itís weird how people keep preaching taking risks, I choosing players with high upside with risk and people come back with player who are the safe pick who might not have a high upside.

    I just donít understand some in here with the back and forth, it seems like any new article that comes out is a good mind **** to make someone doubt there choices over and over. Iím going by what I see Thibs do as coach over what some might want.

    I havenít changed my mind at all either, Cole(higher upside risk)or Vassell(safe pick) and 27th is Hampton, I just donít see good value down around that area with enough upside. Some people like Jaden McDaniels but he is a weaker worse version of Knox coming out who shot only 22% of the time at the rim and heís 6í10 and didnít take many at the rim. The bottom half of the draft is nothing but risk and development.
    ďTwo things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe.Ē
    ― Albert Einstein
    ďI will be the first to admit that I am a pessimist by nature. It is, after all, the wisest way to be. We pessimists have everything to gain, whereas optimists have a fifty-fifty chance of being disappointed.Ē
    ― Tamar Myers
    ďDon't let them drag you down by rumors just go with what you believe in.Ē
    ― Michael Jordan

  6. #9906
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bivory View Post
    Maybe they should be more afraid to shoot cause Cole takes awful shots. I watch Cole play and I see no athleticism at all. RJ is kinda athletic and speedy but watching him in EU shows me he's not playing above the rim either. These two would be a disaster especially since neither are play makers. Knicks should stop over thinking it. There are 3 elite level play makers in the top 10....Don't blow it.
    They will be gone and Hali isnít elite or even fast. This is where I will stand firm, I canít be convinced this dude can be a primary when he is more of a secondary who needs a Tre at the next level to be good sorry donít see it.

    Rose took awful shoots out of college also most of the fearless ones do.
    Last edited by justcallmetm; 09-20-2020 at 10:23 AM.
    ďTwo things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe.Ē
    ― Albert Einstein
    ďI will be the first to admit that I am a pessimist by nature. It is, after all, the wisest way to be. We pessimists have everything to gain, whereas optimists have a fifty-fifty chance of being disappointed.Ē
    ― Tamar Myers
    ďDon't let them drag you down by rumors just go with what you believe in.Ē
    ― Michael Jordan

  7. #9907
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    Quote Originally Posted by justcallmetm View Post
    Rose and Butler werenít above average shooters either especially from behind the arc, itís just the way Thibs like to play why he brought them to Minny also.

    Minny had no above average shooter in my view they were average. Town was the only one near above avg from behind the arc after they moved LaVine for Butler.

    Rose was the only star, Deng was just an all-star and Noah and Butler were developed to be who they turned out to be.

    Canít really say that with Minny he brought in Rose and Taj to speed up the curve for the way he like he run his teams.

    Cole and Hampton arenít afraid to shoot which is what we need, but they come with athleticism. You said we need shooterís and thatís what they are, efficiency is another story they can improve. But Iíll take that over a slow footed shooter with no skill to break down a defense. Why I donít want Hali heís better off going to Atlanta to be a secondary ball handler next to Tre and would have time to shoot. Heís only good when he has space and struggles in all other parts of shooting when covered due to his slow release and its slow and from chest level, that to me is major negative if you want him as focal point right away.

    I just think people need to watch more Thibs coached teams from Chicago and Minny and see what plays he ran the most. Only way to see more shooting from behind the arc is hoping Woodson adds more wrinkles to Thibs style.

    Telling Thibs to play outside in is the same as telling DíAntoni to play inside out. It wonít happen, can only hope he can be flexible. Thibs is a defensive minded coach first who is good at developing players on the defensive end and with the Knicks as an assistant learned to play inside ou and defense first. He was a PG himself before going into coaching.
    Going to have to be flexible, or we are in trouble. I donít think the old model will work. You donít need to go small, or bomb 3 after 3 all the time. But you need your best players to be able to play that way if needed, so they canít be taken out of the game

    Unfortunately, we wonít be fortunate enough to have multiple allstar level players to allow us to dictate play for the forseeable future. Going to have to build a bit differently

  8. #9908
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    I like RJ Hampton allot he's very aggressive and not afraid to take it into the paint. But at that late Clippers pick I prefer Kira Lewis.

  9. #9909
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    Quote Originally Posted by justcallmetm View Post
    They will be gone and Hali isnít elite or even fast. This is where I will stand firm, I canít be convinced this dude can be a primary when he is more of a secondary who needs a Tre at the next level to be good sorry donít see it.

    Rose took awful shoots out of college also most of the fearless ones do.
    Will there be a better basketball player than Hali available 8? Not likely according to many big boards, and certainly not many PG's. He may need a "Tre" or primary to play with but Cole, RJ, and Kira aren't Tre in their wildest wettest dreams. Get the best player available who can help this team win in many ways.

    Listen, I can understand the doubters on Scrubb cause he's out of left field but even most "professional" draft boards have Hali rated pretty high. Why are we NOW gonna buck the system and drop lower and take a player playing the same position, rated lower by most pro's?

    I think that will definitely be a mistake. Just look at the playoffs. There are plenty of guys who didn't spend their careers being the lead ball handler, and are now running offense, and even bringing the ball up on occasion. Yokic comes to mind. Don't overthink it. Guys don't pick up full court anymore fellas. It's a transition, layups, and 3's game.

    Speed sometimes only means that you're going no where fast. DSj was a victim of this it seems.
    Last edited by Bivory; 09-20-2020 at 10:44 AM.

  10. #9910
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    The problem with this draft is that everyone will be overanalyzed due to how long this process has been drawn out. For example, Iím much more open to drafting Cole now than I was 6 months ago.

  11. #9911
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bivory View Post
    Will there be a better basketball player than Hali available 8? Not likely according to many big boards, and certainly not many PG's. He may need a "Tre" or primary to play with but Cole and RJ aren't Tre in their wildest wettest dreams. Get the best player available who can help this team win in many ways.

    Listen, I can understand the doubters on Scrubb cause he's out of left field but even most "professional" draft boards have Hali rated pretty high. Why are we NOW gonna buck the system and drop lower and take a player playing the same position, rated lower by most pro's? I think that will definitely be a mistake. Just look at the playoffs. There are plenty of guys who didn't spend their careers being the lead ball handler, and are now running offense, and even bringing the ball up on occasion. Yokic comes to mind.

    Don't overthink it.
    We need ballhandlers/shooters, end of story. Whether itís primary, secondary, whatever, you need them. If Hali ends up a secondary type guy, so what. He would fit next to anyone then. Teams love those kinds of players. Makes it a bit easier to find the other guy to play next to him, donít need a do-it-all type

    Also leaves open the ability for RJ to prove heís a point-type. I donít think he is, but canít hurt to see if itís true

  12. #9912
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShadyOne View Post
    Going to have to be flexible, or we are in trouble. I donít think the old model will work. You donít need to go small, or bomb 3 after 3 all the time. But you need your best players to be able to play that way if needed, so they canít be taken out of the game

    Unfortunately, we wonít be fortunate enough to have multiple allstar level players to allow us to dictate play for the forseeable future. Going to have to build a bit differently
    When it comes to drafts itís usually where I stand pat. Once I like someone thatís it, I only see Cole or Vassell @8 unless some miracle happens that someone drops but I doubt it. Bottom half is crap shoot and I prefer to draft more guards with upside.

    But Iím not expecting to be a playoff team or any good, I just see it as another run to the lottery they way it should be. Expecting anything more is expecting disappointment. Rose isnít Myers from GSW, Rose is trying to bring his own kind while Myers already had the pieces in place before he got there and had Jerry West helping him the whole time.
    Last edited by justcallmetm; 09-20-2020 at 10:51 AM.
    ďTwo things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe.Ē
    ― Albert Einstein
    ďI will be the first to admit that I am a pessimist by nature. It is, after all, the wisest way to be. We pessimists have everything to gain, whereas optimists have a fifty-fifty chance of being disappointed.Ē
    ― Tamar Myers
    ďDon't let them drag you down by rumors just go with what you believe in.Ē
    ― Michael Jordan

  13. #9913
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bivory View Post
    Will there be a better basketball player than Hali available 8? Not likely according to many big boards, and certainly not many PG's. He may need a "Tre" or primary to play with but Cole, RJ, and Kira aren't Tre in their wildest wettest dreams. Get the best player available who can help this team win in many ways.

    Listen, I can understand the doubters on Scrubb cause he's out of left field but even most "professional" draft boards have Hali rated pretty high. Why are we NOW gonna buck the system and drop lower and take a player playing the same position, rated lower by most pro's?

    I think that will definitely be a mistake. Just look at the playoffs. There are plenty of guys who didn't spend their careers being the lead ball handler, and are now running offense, and even bringing the ball up on occasion. Yokic comes to mind. Don't overthink it. Guys don't pick up full court anymore fellas. It's a transition, layups, and 3's game.

    Speed sometimes only means that you're going no where fast. DSj was a victim of this it seems.
    Hali is not a PG, in college yeah in the NBA hell no. I donít think Hali will make any improvement you see a playmaker and I see a shot form that canít create enough separation or time to get off unless he has time and space. I donít mind Scrubb but he will there in the 2nd round.

    https://www.nbadraft.net/situational...se-haliburton/

    This is the easiest way it can be viewed on how people debate on Hali
    Last edited by justcallmetm; 09-20-2020 at 10:55 AM.
    ďTwo things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe.Ē
    ― Albert Einstein
    ďI will be the first to admit that I am a pessimist by nature. It is, after all, the wisest way to be. We pessimists have everything to gain, whereas optimists have a fifty-fifty chance of being disappointed.Ē
    ― Tamar Myers
    ďDon't let them drag you down by rumors just go with what you believe in.Ē
    ― Michael Jordan

  14. #9914
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    Quote Originally Posted by justcallmetm View Post
    Hali is not a PG, in college yeah in the NBA hell no. I donít think Hali will make any improvement you see a playmaker and I see a shot form that canít create enough separation or time to get off unless he has time and space. I donít mind Scrubb but he will there in the 2nd round.

    https://www.nbadraft.net/situational...se-haliburton/

    This is the easiest way it can be viewed on how people debate on Hali
    Look past creating space: Hali is going to help tremendously when it comes to assisted shots. Check out this article. It talks about the importance of assists and the corner 3 and why players are more likely to make it, not because of the distance being so much shorter, but because "More than 90 percent of corner three-point shots are assisted, while shots above the break are assisted at a rate just above 70 percent.Mar 29, 2019"...

    It explains that mid-range shots are less likely to be assisted and are usually contested, making it a less efficient shot. Winning it all is about making the game easier for one another.

    https://theconversation.com/data-rev...2070%20percent.


    I don't want my players shaking and baking, after dribbling 5 or 6 times, then taking a contested shot unless they're elite and I believe Hali is more of an elite distributor than Cole, Kira, or RJ are elite scorers.

  15. #9915
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShadyOne View Post
    We need ballhandlers/shooters, end of story. Whether itís primary, secondary, whatever, you need them. If Hali ends up a secondary type guy, so what. He would fit next to anyone then. Teams love those kinds of players. Makes it a bit easier to find the other guy to play next to him, donít need a do-it-all type

    Also leaves open the ability for RJ to prove heís a point-type. I donít think he is, but canít hurt to see if itís true
    We need play makers, ball handlers who can shoot. Hali and Scrubb...Lock it up..lol

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