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  1. #436
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    Quote Originally Posted by lakerfan85 View Post
    Lol @ the pitcher batting 8th.
    It's worth about 2 runs a year.

    I'd rather the lineup start over with Bader or Fowler hitting 9th, and hopefully getting a man on base in front of the leadoff and 2 hitter.

  2. #437
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obabikon View Post
    If Carlson or Edman is legit, and Carp bounces back to form... this is a very good lineup.

    I like the idea of an outfield of O'Neill, Bader, Carlson.... Fowler should be the flex outfielder once Carlson is up.

    With Edman being able to play almost anywhere... we should go ahead and grab a big bat off the bench. Maybe that's Austin Dean.
    Agreed


    If Carpenter is back to 80% of his former self, our lineup is solid with Edman being the rover playing everywhere. Though, we don't have much depth in the middle infield if there is an injury to Wong/DeJong and Edman has to go there. Munoz sucks, and Sosa can't hit. Maybe Urias?

    If Carpenter is a .250/.350/.440 caliber hitter, like he should be, I think we'll be alright.

    Edman can raise the outfield floor. O'Neill, Thomas, Carlson and Williams will all be fighting for playing time in the outfield to steal a job. The best will get a full time job eventually. Bader can hit like he did last year, and still justify playing time because his defense is top of the league elite. Fowler sucks, but we are stuck with him. He's basically a replacement level starter. Which is fine, but it's nothing to be excited about.


    I see playing time as such (assuming relatively decent health)

    C - Molina - 500
    1B - Goldie - 650
    2B - Wong - 600
    SS - DeJong - 600
    3B - Carpenter - 500
    LF - O'Neill - 400
    CF - Bader - 500
    RF - Fowler - 500

    Bench
    C - Wieters - 150
    PH - Ravelo - 150
    OF - Dean - 150
    IF - Munoz - 150
    OF - Thomas - 200
    Util - Edman - 450

    OF - Carlson when he gets called up - 200
    C - Knizner at some point - 100

  3. #438
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    It's worth about 2 runs a year.

    I'd rather the lineup start over with Bader or Fowler hitting 9th, and hopefully getting a man on base in front of the leadoff and 2 hitter.
    It can also kill a scoring chance.

  4. #439
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    Quote Originally Posted by lakerfan85 View Post
    It can also kill a scoring chance.
    Driving a car can kill you, but you still do it, because it is the best alternative.


    Our goal is to get as many wins as possible. That is aided by scoring as many runs as possible.

  5. #440
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    If we look at the team via projections

    Carpenter 3B - .237/.352/.441 - I think this is pretty realistic, and if he does this, he'll be back at the leadoff spot and playing 120+ games, with Edman giving him enough rest to maintain this slash line.

    Goldschmidt 1B - .273/.369/.494 - this isn't the production we were trading and paying for when we acquired him, but it's plenty good and are happy to have it.

    Bader CF - .238/.318/.407 - this is fine at the back end of the lineup with his amazing defense. That's at least a 3 win season. This keeps him a productive player, but we'd certainly like to see an OBP closer to .330 and a slugging closer to .450, but I'm wouldn't be upset with this slash line.

    DeJong SS - .252/.322/.465 - I feel like this is light. I feel like DeJong has .500 slugging written all over him, and more of a .330 OBP. Maybe not this year, but eventually at some point in this contract. With his defense, we can live with this. But we'd certainly like a little more.

    Edman LF - .274/.322/.420 - it's hard to know what he'll do with a full season of playing time. I feel like he was really aided by the juiced ball, more than most players. But I love the player, his versatility, personality, etc. So if this is what he does, while being a 5-6 position player, I'll take it.

    Wong 2B - .266/.347/.409 - this is probably fairly accurate. Though I think a .350-.360 OBP is realistic. Power is hard to judge with him. When heis pull happy, it goes up, but the rest of his profile reduces. When he lets the ball come to him, he has less power, but a better overall profile. But I'll say this is pretty accurate.

    Molina C - .263/.311/.410 - Unfortunately, we'd be happy with this from him at this age. This might even be too optimistic.

    Fowler RF - .235/.336/.399 - Unfortunately, this is money poorly spent at this point. If he hits like this, he won't be in the starting lineup much.

    On the bench
    C - Wieters - .233/.299/.401 - I mean, he's a backup. Whatever he gives you is fine.

    RHPH - Ravelo - .264/.326/.416 - Would replace J-Mart fine, but he isn't scaring anyone.

    OF - Dean - .269.320/.442 - This feels accurate, and if he does this, he could spell some time off for Fowler and Edman, and play plenty. It would make him a better pickup than we realized initially. May even earn him some starts.

    OF - O'Neill - .237/.297/.449 - He can't be a starter and have a sub .300 OBP. It just can't happen, even if he's playing good defense. I feel like O'Neill long term is more of a .260/.330/.500 hitter, but that may not be this year. But I feel like he has what it takes to make those adjustments. I think Hunter Renfroe is his likely future.

    IF - Munoz - .255/.304/.389 - I strongly dislike Munoz. Wish he wasn't on the roster. But whatever.

    Others
    OF - Carlson - .252/.318/.416 - Out of his half a rookie season, this would be enough for us to believe in his ability to take a starting job in 2021 in a corner outfield position. If he did this, and Fowler did his, Carlson would be the OD RFer in 2021.

    C - Knizner - .262/.317/.410 - This would be enough that he could potentially share playing time with Molina starting in 2021, and we can sign a better minor league free agent to be the 3rd catcher on the 40 man

    OF - Thomas - .244/.308/.420 - I know people like to think he'll be better based on his short sample in the MLB last year, but this is probably fairly realistic. I think he'll be on the Memphis shuttle more than we'd like to admit.


    We have a nice floor and nice depth. The team has the ability to plug and play in a lot of areas. What we lack is upside talent. Goldie is the only hitter who scares anyone, and the rest of our good players are only good because they bring great defense and average hitting to the table.


    My hope is that Carpenter rebounds and that O'Neill can justify full time left fielder work.

    If Carpenter is hitting .250/.350/.440 out of the leadoff spot, Goldie is hitting .270/.370/.500 again in the 3 spot, and O'Neill comes around to a .270/.330/.500 hitter, then our lineup will be fine because we bring great defense and run prevention to the table and we aren't weak anywhere offensively. We can justify that lineup

    1. Carpenter
    2. Wong
    3. Goldie
    4. O'Neill
    5. DeJong
    6. Molina
    7. Fowler and eventually Carlson
    8. Bader

    That could be a decent lineup, if O'Neill and Carpenter can show up.

  6. #441
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    Quote Originally Posted by lakerfan85 View Post
    It can also kill a scoring chance.
    Right, which is measured against the added production of putting a good hitter in front of your best hitters.

    That's accounted for in this.

    Like I said, it's only 2 runs a year. It's not a big boost. But it's also not something LOL at.

  7. #442
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    Right, which is measured against the added production of putting a good hitter in front of your best hitters.

    That's accounted for in this.

    Like I said, it's only 2 runs a year. It's not a big boost. But it's also not something LOL at.
    Then why donít we see more teams doing it? Because itís stupid thatís why.

  8. #443
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    Has Shildt said heís hitting the pitcher 8th this season?

  9. #444
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    Quote Originally Posted by lakerfan85 View Post
    Has Shildt said heís hitting the pitcher 8th this season?
    No... he has not.

    Even if it was more beneficial... I doubt that he would.

  10. #445
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obabikon View Post
    No... he has not.

    Even if it was more beneficial... I doubt that he would.
    So why do you guys think heís going hit the pitcher 8th. I donít recall him ever doing it?

  11. #446
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    And for me, it would only make sense if the leadoff guy was hot like Carp was in the summer of 2018.

  12. #447
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    Quote Originally Posted by lakerfan85 View Post
    Then why donít we see more teams doing it? Because itís stupid thatís why.
    Why don't you see more teams doing it? Probably because they don't like the message it sends to the hitter you bat 9th. You don't have to squeeze every ounce of optimization out of your players all the time.

  13. #448
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    Quote Originally Posted by lakerfan85 View Post
    So why do you guys think heís going hit the pitcher 8th. I donít recall him ever doing it?
    I never said that was the likely lineup, I said that was MY lineup. You can share yours if you like. It's just the most optimized lineup.

    I also wouldn't bat Goldie 3rd

    I think the real life lineup would be

    1. Carpenter 3B
    2. Either Wong or Fowler 2B/RF
    3. Goldie 1B
    4. DeJong SS
    5. O'Neill LF
    6. Wong or Fowler 2B/RF
    7. Molina C
    8. Bader CF
    9. Pitcher

    With Edman roving all over the place taking a players spot in the lineup and defensive position.

  14. #449
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    1. Edman LF
    2. Wong 2B
    3. Goldschmidt 1B
    4. Carpenter 3B
    5. DeJong SS
    6. Molina C
    7. Fowler RF
    8. Bader CF
    9. Pitcher

    Personally, I do not believe O'Neill will be anything more than Grichuk. Obviously Edman will move around but having him and Wong at the top of the lineup gives us that 1-2 OBP punch with speed.

  15. #450
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    I never said that was the likely lineup, I said that was MY lineup. You can share yours if you like. It's just the most optimized lineup.

    I also wouldn't bat Goldie 3rd

    I think the real life lineup would be

    1. Carpenter 3B
    2. Either Wong or Fowler 2B/RF
    3. Goldie 1B
    4. DeJong SS
    5. O'Neill LF
    6. Wong or Fowler 2B/RF
    7. Molina C
    8. Bader CF
    9. Pitcher

    With Edman roving all over the place taking a players spot in the lineup and defensive position.
    My bad. I didnít realize YOU were making out a pretend lineup..

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