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  1. #2356
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewing View Post
    The guy didn't learn to shoot a jump shot til his 30s. The Spurs used to leave him alone at like 18 feet in the finals. What do you think Larry Birds #s would have looked like if anyone defended him like that? How about MJ? You think he would have shot the ball every single play? I do. I think he would have scored 100 points easy
    If he didn't learn a jump shot til his 30's he must have been absolutely phenomenal at scoring other ways, maybe probably completely off the charts in comparison to other players.
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  2. #2357
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkieMark48 View Post
    If he didn't learn a jump shot til his 30's he must have been absolutely phenomenal at scoring other ways, maybe probably completely off the charts in comparison to other players.
    He didn't and he was
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps08-09 Champ View Post
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  3. #2358
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewing View Post
    He didn't and he was
    Hopefully Big Moves sees this
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  4. #2359
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewing View Post
    If Rick Moranis was heavy weight champ I could fight for the title!


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    if boxing went and evolved that way u would have an actual argument/point. instead ur hatred has consumed you yet again chewing

  5. #2360
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkieMark48 View Post
    Should we need to wait and see how far ahead Lebron is in scoring when the shot attempts equal out?... He's still going to pass him in about 1000 less minutes played
    LBJ was more cautious with his shots so that's not surprising. As for the difference in minutes played, that can be more than accounted for by the minutes that came after the achilles injury and those that came while Kobe was playing off of the bench.

  6. #2361
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkieMark48 View Post
    Ok, so theres so many things Kobe was better than Lebron at, but Lebron was slightly better than Kobe but yet sometime next month Lebron is going to pass Kobe in all time points, while shooting a better percentage, in 100 less games, on roughly 2000 less shots, and at the same point he will have close to 3000 more assists with about 300 more turnovers.

    edit add: while having 300 more blocks, 2000 more rebounds, and he just passed Kobe in steals
    No, you would expect the things that LBJ had an advantage in to shake out in just the way that they have. Those are exactly the type of differences you would get after almost 2 decades of basketball. Even though Kobe played 20 seasons, only about 15-16 of those were with kobe being in a star role because he came off the bench and was the 4th option for his first 2.5 seasons and then was a shell of himself the final 3 seasons after he tore his achilles.

  7. #2362
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkieMark48 View Post
    Hopefully Big Moves sees this
    Who said that he wasn't? I never said that LBJ wasn't a great scorer. What I have said is that his numbers are way inflated because of the style he has played his entire career (it's similar to what Harden is going through now, but it was simply to a lesser extent with LBJ in that it wasnt as exaggerated with LBJ).

  8. #2363
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkieMark48 View Post
    If he didn't learn a jump shot til his 30's he must have been absolutely phenomenal at scoring other ways, maybe probably completely off the charts in comparison to other players.
    It was mostly in getting to the basket and he was/is great at scoring in that manner. Of course, it helps that defenders aren't allowed to touch the offensive player anymore, which has led to an exorbitant increase in offensive output. Prime Kobe in the last 5 years would likely put up video game numbers.

  9. #2364
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    Kobe vs Lebron: Who is the better player?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chronz View Post
    if boxing went and evolved that way u would have an actual argument/point. instead ur hatred has consumed you yet again chewing
    I got nothing but love


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    Last edited by ewing; 12-06-2019 at 11:00 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps08-09 Champ View Post
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  10. #2365
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    It was mostly in getting to the basket and he was/is great at scoring in that manner. Of course, it helps that defenders aren't allowed to touch the offensive player anymore, which has led to an exorbitant increase in offensive output. Prime Kobe in the last 5 years would likely put up video game numbers.
    Do you mean he would put up numbers like games Harden?
    Last edited by ldawg; 12-06-2019 at 11:45 PM.

  11. #2366
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    Yeah, but that Miami team was so talented that you could have replaced LBJ with various other stars and they likely still win (e.g., Kobe, Durant, CP3, Dirk, Rose, Melo). That might not have been the case with the Cavs, but Miami was really stacked so they didn't necessarily need LBJ. It's not about LBJ moving around for me, it's about him forming these really stacked teams, which makes the titles mean less (at least in my eyes). With shaq, he could have probably won with a few other stars in 2000 and maybe 2001, but definitely not in 2002. The lakers needed every ounce of how good Kobe was to get past the kings in 02.
    Ive watched every TEAM Bron has been on. The best TEAM Bron has been on, from top to bottom and coaching, is the team he is on right now. And the numbers, the winning all reflect that. Hes not the best version of himself, but the parts around him from top to bottom...(not just the top 3 pieces) are a good deal better. Hes never played on a team with a solid 6-10. Hes never even played with a decent 6th man. Hes never been on a team that can build on or hold leads when hes not on the court. This is the first team to do so. This is his best TEAM, and its not as stacked or as put together as the 00, 01, 02, 03 Lakers.
    Last edited by IKnowHoops; 12-07-2019 at 03:59 AM.

  12. #2367
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    Quote Originally Posted by IKnowHoops View Post
    Ive watched every TEAM Bron has been on. The best TEAM Bron has been on, from top to bottom and coaching, is the team he is on right now. And the numbers, the winning all reflect that. Hes not the best version of himself, but the parts around him from top to bottom...(not just the top 3 pieces) are a good deal better. Hes never played on a team with a solid 6-10. Hes never even played with a decent 6th man. Hes never been on a team that can build on or hold leads when hes not on the court. This is the first team to do so. This is his best TEAM, and its not as stacked or as put together as the 00, 01, 02, 03 Lakers.
    I disagree that this is LBJ's best team (at least talent wise, depth you might be right) and that he's never had a decent 6th man. The 2013 heat had an excellent roster and Ray Allen was an excellent 6th man. Battier was also an excellent player off the bench. I also disagree that those laker teams were all that stacked. Outside of Shaq and Kobe, those teams didn't have that much talent. The third best player on those teams was probably rick fox. Those teams were shaq and Kobe and good, solid role players, but those role players weren't crazy talented. Ray Allen alone was better than every player on those laker teams not named shaq or Kobe.

  13. #2368
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    Quote Originally Posted by ldawg View Post
    Do you mean he would put up numbers like games Harden?
    No, I mean that what Harden does is merely an extension of what LBJ has done his whole carer in terms of dominating the ball. it's the next logical progression. Harden just has the ball more than LBJ, but both dominated the ball a lot and as a result have put up inflated numbers compared to former players who did not dominate the ball to that extent.

  14. #2369
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    This entire post is ridiculous. Wade was not more productive than kobe at any stage, really. What you've shown over and over again is that you have no idea how to interpret analytics (and have no business being allowed near any type of data) but that won't stop you from forming these absurd positions. I'll give you one thing, you are easily the biggest blowhard in here. Your takes are absurd and as others have pointed out you are basically a troll.
    Its not ridiculous, its quite factual. Ill side with the quantifiable methods employed by those in the business over your archaic/unsubstantiated takes. Your personal opinion is irrelevant, wake me up when you FINALLY have objective evidence.

    Wade couldn't win a 3-peat with shaq and couldn't win a 3-peat with prime LBJ and prime Bosh playing in a horrible conference, but somehow he would be able to do it in the far tougher West with prime Shaq (who most of have ahead of LBJ) and no 3rd star?
    You lack contextual understanding of a players career, Wade was on the downslope of his prime and by the end of his run with Bron was shadow of his former self, no **** he couldnt win at the same rate as he did when he won as his teams ONLY star (Unless you consider that version of Shaq a star, IDK but that kind of shows you how much more productive Wade was to win with a sidekick below most of Kobe's sidekick years).

    Being in the West isn't as tough when you have the games most dominant force. Just check how great the Lakers played without Kobe or when he was sitting down, so long as Shaq was around the team would contend on some level. I'd rather have a team that could play at an elite level without me than be in the East on a team that needed more from you. Shaq and Bron have similar peaks, most have Bron ahead (I dont) due to longevity, that has no bearing on this discussion.


    These positions are outright laughable. But you have to keep your nonsense narrative about kobe. Remember when you used to make these same absurd posts about kobe and then fell silent after kobe won a title without Shaq? I guess you still haven't gotten over how monumentally wrong you were lol
    Actually I was right about Kobe, its why they missed the playoffs, lost in R.1 for 3 years before he requested a trade. Feel free to deliver facts next post, lol remember when you couldn't even defend your take that Miami was favored to win the chip in 99, LMFAO. At least ur learning now, maybe teach me a thing or two.

  15. #2370
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    Quote Originally Posted by ldawg View Post
    wade prime was shorter than Kobe but when he was prime he was right there with him. Wade got banged up early. Dirick Rose was going to be a top notch pg in this era to but injuries done him in. Tmac grant Hill are two others that may have surpass Kobe. Shaq taking the beating help prolonged Kobe career. I think having Shaq and Phil in a system would of helped wade as well.
    IDK, sometimes players just have bad luck. I think Wade just not having that surgery in College is all he needed but yes, having support that can play so well in your absence (such as what Kobe expierenced when he was on a team that could win at such a high level without him) should alleviate the burden of carrying a franchise significantly. Prolly helps stay healthy but not a gaurantee.

    Kobe always valued longevity tho, its why he had such a weird career in terms of peak performances. In 2003 he had his finest season ever, I remember my friends and I joking that getting punked in the post by Corliss Williamson angered him to the point that he came in the next season jacked. He was significantly stronger and bulkier that year. He ended the year with serious knee pain and some kind of shoulder injury. Kobe shed the weight and played around that shape for the rest of his career, he just had his best season but he knew it wasn't sustainable for him so he developed his skill game. Wade was never going to age as well as that but he had a decent run in his decline, he remained the kind of player to elevate his game/team come playoffs.

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