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  1. #2221
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    Except that he won 2 with the team starting more or less from scratch. It was clearly an inept front office, so we can't credit them for winning those titles. Those additional 2 titles show pretty definitively that he could have gone anywhere else and rebuilt from scratch to win a title. If it was the organization, we wouldn't have sucked for 7 years after Kobe tore his achilles...so you are wrong.
    Yup the lakers are the last non super team to win back to back titles. Rockets with Dream and Lakers with Kobe won back to back with the least amount of help in comparison to the other back to back champs.

    Kobe finding a way to win with this lakers team was impressive. They started by maxing out Walton and Kwame. Kobe still found away to win. Outscoring every single Lakers and Celtics player 6 out of 7 games in the Finals is what made the mamba a true GOAT.

  2. #2222
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    Kobe,Pau,Odom,Bynum,Artes HMMMMMMM Nash,Kobe,Pau,Artest,Howard. yes i should sit back and watch the fat cat. Grab the bag of popcorn grab the remote and hope to get lucky.
    Last edited by ldawg; 12-04-2019 at 11:01 AM.

  3. #2223
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bostonjorge View Post
    Yup the lakers are the last non super team to win back to back titles. Rockets with Dream and Lakers with Kobe won back to back with the least amount of help in comparison to the other back to back champs.

    Kobe finding a way to win with this lakers team was impressive. They started by maxing out Walton and Kwame. Kobe still found away to win. Outscoring every single Lakers and Celtics player 6 out of 7 games in the Finals is what made the mamba a true GOAT.
    Well if one want to be technical Green, iggy and Klay are not superstars. So would that put Durant and Curry in Duo category vs super team? Would they not fall in a super talented team like say Kobe/Pau, Bynum, Odom, Artest.

    Would that not put Tim Duncan as the Last of the superstar not to team up with a franchise player from another team?

    If you want to go further back Magic Johnson did not

    Micheal Jordan did not and was a 5 time mvp and mvp in all 6 rings.
    Last edited by ldawg; 12-04-2019 at 11:07 AM.

  4. #2224
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bostonjorge View Post
    Yup the lakers are the last non super team to win back to back titles. Rockets with Dream and Lakers with Kobe won back to back with the least amount of help in comparison to the other back to back champs.

    Kobe finding a way to win with this lakers team was impressive. They started by maxing out Walton and Kwame. Kobe still found away to win. Outscoring every single Lakers and Celtics player 6 out of 7 games in the Finals is what made the mamba a true GOAT.
    Kwame wasn't on any of the Lakers championship teams. He was included in the Pau Gasol trade
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  5. #2225
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    Man, looking back at the Malone Payton team... I didn't realize just how good both of them were the year before they came to LA. Payton missed games, but he still had really really good numbers when he was on the court. Malone was old but he was still a 20-8 guy
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  6. #2226
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkieMark48 View Post
    Man, looking back at the Malone Payton team... I didn't realize just how good both of them were the year before they came to LA. Payton missed games, but he still had really really good numbers when he was on the court. Malone was old but he was still a 20-8 guy
    That team was so talented they made the finals with all kind of issues that season. Injures to Karl and Shaq, chemistry in the triangle, chemistry with each other, Kobe rape trial. But you know some super teams dont qualify to be a super teams since its an opinion thing. I still cant believe a team from the east beat them.

  7. #2227
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iggie View Post
    No and maybe, you never know.
    Which current team could win the Championship in the 2000s post 2005?
    So from 2006 to 2010, which current teams could win it all per season?

  8. #2228
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkieMark48 View Post
    Kwame wasn't on any of the Lakers championship teams. He was included in the Pau Gasol trade
    Lakers still gave max contracts to Walton and Kwame. That was Kobes foundation when he had his team in 1st place in the West. The trade for the non all star Gasol came after the Lakers where in 1st.

  9. #2229
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    Quote Originally Posted by ldawg View Post
    Because the deal was nixed and for non basketball reasons no one wanted to play with old Kobe. So the team fell flat. Go ask another team if 7 years long. Thats the worst patch Lakers had ever or longest without playoffs.
    Why would the CP3 trade matter? Kobe was still a top 2-3 player in 2012 and 2013 (and still no superstars). Kobe then retired in 2016 and we still didn't land LBJ until the 2019 season (2 seasons later). Even then, LBJ only came to the lakers because it's a good business decision, in terms of selling himself after basketball. Clearly it's not as easy to land as a superstar as you think it is, otherwise we would've landed a bunch of them. Before LBJ the last superstar we landed in free agency was Shaq.

    The data simply do not back up the idea that the lakers are a privileged franchise that just go out and sign whoever they want. This position is simply wrong and there's no two ways about it. In the history of the organization, the franchise has had 2 major signings: shaq and LBJ. That's it. Every other superstar this team has had has either been drafted or traded for...and before LBJ, the franchise was unable to land anyone since Pau. That speaks volumes of how much the front office struggled when Kobe was here. That sounds like a far cry from Kobe being in a good situation after Shaq left.

  10. #2230
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYKalltheway View Post
    Which current team could win the Championship in the 2000s post 2005?
    So from 2006 to 2010, which current teams could win it all per season?
    07 spurs, 09 and 10 lakers, 08 Celtics. I would put my money on those 3 teams ahead of any team that has won a title in the past decade (08 lakers and 10 Celtics also likely beat most if not all teams in the past decade).

  11. #2231
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    Kobe team was full of non All Stars when he started winning. Before the championships. Gasol had zero all NBA, zero playoff wins and zero all stars. Odom zero all stars and injured Bynum zero all stars. Heat, Warriors team was filled to capacity with all NBA players let alone all stars.

    Let me put in perspective. Bosh before going to Miami, made more all stars then Gasol, Odom and Bynum combined before they ended up in LA. Bosh made a all NBA team in Toronto. Bosh even won a playoff game. Gasol never reached Bosh level of success before the Lakers.
    Last edited by Bostonjorge; 12-04-2019 at 11:57 AM.

  12. #2232
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    Quote Originally Posted by ldawg View Post
    Well if one want to be technical Green, iggy and Klay are not superstars. So would that put Durant and Curry in Duo category vs super team? Would they not fall in a super talented team like say Kobe/Pau, Bynum, Odom, Artest.

    Would that not put Tim Duncan as the Last of the superstar not to team up with a franchise player from another team?

    If you want to go further back Magic Johnson did not

    Micheal Jordan did not and was a 5 time mvp and mvp in all 6 rings.
    Gasol, Odom and Bynum where not franchises players. Gasol is not getting his jersey retired in Memphis because he never accomplished anything for Memphis. He won zero playoff games. Green, Iggy and Klay accomplishments in 1 season trump anything Gasol, Odom and Bynum combined did before 2009. Green by himself has more all stars, all nba teams and MVPís then all 3 combined. Iggy has more all NBA teams and MVPís. Klay more all stars and more all NBA teams. So if Warriors are a duo(which is ridiculous) then what does that make the Lakers?

  13. #2233
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    Quote Originally Posted by ldawg View Post
    Kobe,Pau,Odom,Bynum,Artes HMMMMMMM Nash,Kobe,Pau,Artest,Howard. yes i should sit back and watch the fat cat. Grab the bag of popcorn grab the remote and hope to get lucky.
    I really don't understand why you keep mentioning Bynum. He did not play in the 09 run and then was not very good in the 10 run because he was badly injured and was playing limited minutes. Artest wasn't here for the 09 run either and was a role player once he arrived, as this was later in his career. Odom never made a single all-star game and wasn't really an all-star caliber player most of the years he was with the lakers. You're also ignoring that Nash and Howard were traded for. That wasn't luck, that was the franchise using their assets to acquire players...which turned out to be horrible trades that didn't work in our favor. I also don't understand how you keep missing my point...it's not about joining a good team or a good franchise. It's about joining a super stacked team. There is a big difference. If on top of those players, Kobe also had Melo, for example, then it would be similar to what LBJ had.
    Last edited by Big Moves03; 12-04-2019 at 12:21 PM.

  14. #2234
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Moves03 View Post
    Why would the CP3 trade matter? Kobe was still a top 2-3 player in 2012 and 2013 (and still no superstars). Kobe then retired in 2016 and we still didn't land LBJ until the 2019 season (2 seasons later). Even then, LBJ only came to the lakers because it's a good business decision, in terms of selling himself after basketball. Clearly it's not as easy to land as a superstar as you think it is, otherwise we would've landed a bunch of them. Before LBJ the last superstar we landed in free agency was Shaq.

    The data simply do not back up the idea that the lakers are a privileged franchise that just go out and sign whoever they want. This position is simply wrong and there's no two ways about it. In the history of the organization, the franchise has had 2 major signings: shaq and LBJ. That's it. Every other superstar this team has had has either been drafted or traded for...and before LBJ, the franchise was unable to land anyone since Pau. That speaks volumes of how much the front office struggled when Kobe was here. That sounds like a far cry from Kobe being in a good situation after Shaq left.
    It maters because they were not able to dip in the nba talent pool instead got forced to the draft.

  15. #2235
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    Quote Originally Posted by ldawg View Post
    It maters because they were not able to dip in the nba talent pool instead got forced to the draft.
    Yeah, but they were trading for cp3. It's not like they went out and signed somebody. There is a big difference when you give up assets to acquire a player versus when you go out and sign someone. For example, if this laker team had signed AD and kept everyone they had they would be unstoppable right now. My point was that superstars don't just flock to LA.

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