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  1. #4831
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    I think LeBron comes off as whiny and entitled, which is unsurprising. When youíre called ďThe KingĒ since middle school youíre going to be conceited and entitled. Look at Bieber, Brittany Spears, etc.

    Kobe seems like a good guy off the court, assuming he didnít rape anyone. He seems as driven as Jordan but much less of a dick than Jordan.
    Kobe definitely got humbled in the second half of his career. He was all the better for it.

    LeBron just has so many fan and media apologists, that all of his less desirable behaviors are enabled, instead of detracted.

    All the hate Kobe got from the media, ended up working to his advantage in the end. If LeBron would be subject to the same level of scrutiny, he would have been all the better too I would imagine.

  2. #4832
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    Quote Originally Posted by Romeo Naes View Post
    Kobe definitely got humbled in the second half of his career. He was all the better for it.

    LeBron just has so many fan and media apologists, that all of his less desirable behaviors are enabled, instead of detracted.

    All the hate Kobe got from the media, ended up working to his advantage in the end. If LeBron would be subject to the same level of scrutiny, he would have been all the better too I would imagine.
    no one is asking no one to sleep with him we are rating the best players. He can be your worst enemy thatís not the topic. Every top player have to deal with haters.
    Last edited by ldawg; 05-23-2020 at 06:42 PM.

  3. #4833
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    Quote Originally Posted by ldawg View Post
    no one is asking mo one to sleep with him we are rating the best players. He can be your worst enemy thatís not the topic.
    I was just responding to Vlade. No homo here lol. Not that there is anything wrong with it of course.

    However, a good attitude and self reflection does go a long way into shaping your game on the court. Jus sayin.

  4. #4834
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    Quote Originally Posted by Romeo Naes View Post
    Not to defer, but to include more. Phil got Jordan over the hump by having him utilize his teammates more and include them more in the system they were attempting to run. Before that, Jordan's numbers were astronomical. He sacrificed his personal stats for the good of the team and it showed in their domination of the league. Had LeBron had results like that, I or no one in their right minds would ever think to question him or his methods.

    Usage can be very misleading as you well know I'm sure. I know I'm the one who brought it up, but only in the sense to make a point. Not to be taken so literally lol. I get what you're saying though. Love's stats were definitely overrated and he was exposed as a guy putting up great stats on a bad team. He was just not going to be as efficient and effective being mainly a 3&D guy minus the D. He needed to be able to operate closer to the rim, but that is LeBron's area for the most part so everyone else must make adjustments as D-Wade had to as well after the 2011 season by learning to play off the ball more. The point is that everyone else is forced to adjust thier game to the Lebron James system. When it came to guys like Jordan and other all-time greats, it was the other way around, they adjusted their game. Though I imagine they weren't all chasing the ghost who wore #23 in Chicago either though.

    There are plenty of non-bias reporters who felt it left an asterisk as well. For example, Stephen A. Smith has no agenda to tear down LeBron and is even one who most would agree is in his corner for the most part. Stephen A. was very vocal at the time of the suspension of just how tainted the victory would be if Cleveland pulled off the upset which they did end up doing. Maybe Stephen A. knew something we all didn't lol. Anyways, much like when SAS tells the truth, he later recants, so I don't know if he still feels this way or would admit it even if he did. Had LeBron pulled off the victory with no Dray suspension, I wouldn't be able to say **** now would I.

    I also have never been one to add asterisk for a clutch shot from guys like Ray Allen or Kyrie Irving. That is pretty petty and ridiculous if you ask me. Lots of guys were saved by their roll players clutch shots over the years and multiple times too I might add such as Jordan and Kobe. I even add an asterisk to Tim Duncan's 07 title because of the suspension of Amare. That was lame. Duncan has a few other asterisk as well. Had he not, I would most likely have him over Bird on my list. I am fair with the same criticisms across the board. Or at least I try to be. I think it is very unfair to say that anyone who brings up the Draymond Green suspension has to be bias and or therefore have an agenda.
    Jordan was still very dominant similar to Lebron and Lebron has always gotten teammates involved within what their team was doing (in fact he gets criticized plenty for not being aggressive enough scoring wise at times). He didn't have Phil Jackson of course either. MJ lead the league in usage more than Lebron did both RS and playoffs as well, they both need to also get others involved sure but you don't go away from your star for other peoples stats when you know what is the best option here.

    I apologize and I mentioned again there but as you did say it in what I quoted. Of course people are forced to adjust to Lebron, he is the best player in the league and it benefits the team as the whole given that obvious aspect. When it came to guys like Jordan/Duncan and so on they often had guys who fit being provided from their team. I agree Lebron over does it talent wise but he also wasn't put in great situations. I don't love GM Lebron but we are talking about his overall ability here and specific titles and so on not questioning who to blame that he didn't get Pippen/Phil and so on to start.

    I think people didn't want the suspension but that doesn't mean we ignore everything that actually happened either. I bet most didn't want Klove injured. The year before Klove/Kyrie. This stuff always happens but we never ignore what actually happened on the court, unless we have an agenda to do so.

    Alright we just disagree about handing out asterisks for things we didn't like/injuries and so on. I know some who do so with Lakers rings, KG injury and the Kings stuff and so on. I just don't do it or think it makes sense.

  5. #4835
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    Quote Originally Posted by Romeo Naes View Post
    Not to defer, but to include more. Phil got Jordan over the hump by having him utilize his teammates more and include them more in the system they were attempting to run. Before that, Jordan's numbers were astronomical. He sacrificed his personal stats for the good of the team and it showed in their domination of the league. Had LeBron had results like that, I or no one in their right minds would ever think to question him or his methods.

    Usage can be very misleading as you well know I'm sure. I know I'm the one who brought it up, but only in the sense to make a point. Not to be taken so literally lol. I get what you're saying though. Love's stats were definitely overrated and he was exposed as a guy putting up great stats on a bad team. He was just not going to be as efficient and effective being mainly a 3&D guy minus the D. He needed to be able to operate closer to the rim, but that is LeBron's area for the most part so everyone else must make adjustments as D-Wade had to as well after the 2011 season by learning to play off the ball more. The point is that everyone else is forced to adjust thier game to the Lebron James system. When it came to guys like Jordan and other all-time greats, it was the other way around, they adjusted their game. Though I imagine they weren't all chasing the ghost who wore #23 in Chicago either though.

    There are plenty of non-bias reporters who felt it left an asterisk as well. For example, Stephen A. Smith has no agenda to tear down LeBron and is even one who most would agree is in his corner for the most part. Stephen A. was very vocal at the time of the suspension of just how tainted the victory would be if Cleveland pulled off the upset which they did end up doing. Maybe Stephen A. knew something we all didn't lol. Anyways, much like when SAS tells the truth, he later recants, so I don't know if he still feels this way or would admit it even if he did. Had LeBron pulled off the victory with no Dray suspension, I wouldn't be able to say **** now would I.

    I also have never been one to add asterisk for a clutch shot from guys like Ray Allen or Kyrie Irving. That is pretty petty and ridiculous if you ask me. Lots of guys were saved by their roll players clutch shots over the years and multiple times too I might add such as Jordan and Kobe. I even add an asterisk to Tim Duncan's 07 title because of the suspension of Amare. That was lame. Duncan has a few other asterisk as well. Had he not, I would most likely have him over Bird on my list. I am fair with the same criticisms across the board. Or at least I try to be. I think it is very unfair to say that anyone who brings up the Draymond Green suspension has to be bias and or therefore have an agenda.
    I think Jordan got over the hump once pippen matured and phill put a system in place to move the ball. Jordan trusted no one. Thatís why I said way back give Lebron a better coach the results would be different.

  6. #4836
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    Quote Originally Posted by Romeo Naes View Post
    I was just responding to Vlade. No homo here lol. Not that there is anything wrong with it of course.

    However, a good attitude and self reflection does go a long way into shaping your game on the court. Jus sayin.
    Who had a worst attitude than Kobe and mj? Most guys liked playing with Lebron itís the pressure that comes along with playing with a great player that the issue. Kyrie is just wacky. Bosh and Love think they are better that they are.

  7. #4837
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    Quote Originally Posted by IKnowHoops View Post
    I donít think people are pro Bron and anti Kobe, I think people are pro statistical data and anti opinion when it comes to ranking players, and all the statistical data points to Lebron in a landslide
    In your unbiased opinion, as of right now who had a better career, LBJ or Kobe? Let's say LBJ were to never play another game, do you think he had a better career then Kobe?

  8. #4838
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    Quote Originally Posted by McAllen Tx View Post
    In your unbiased opinion, as of right now who had a better career, LBJ or Kobe? Let's say LBJ were to never play another game, do you think he had a better career then Kobe?
    Iíd rather have Kobeís career simply for the rings. But Iíd rather have Kevin McHaleís career than Karl Maloneís because he won 3 rings and Malone is unquestionably better than McHale.

  9. #4839
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    He articulated his point, that there are a ton of posters on here who said they dislike Kobe and like LeBron without ever proving it.

    Iím not going to spend time disproving something he couldnít spend time proving.
    Yeah, I donít remember to many posters saying things like that myself. Maybe like 3 people insinuated something like this, but the other 20-30 just think Bron is better and donít like him more than Kobe for any other reason than they just think heís better. Generally speaking, the better a player is, the more respect you show to his game and what he brings to the table. I think thatís where it starts and ends for most people who like Bron over Kobe. Iím a Bron fan and I like Mike because heís Mike. I donít argue Bron over Mike because Imo it could go either way. Mike was/is the man. I grew up in that era, I patented my own game after his. And ther is no denying his dominance on the league. Bron has brought a similar dominance. Kobe in my opinion did not bring that kind of dominance. Many games he was a beast, some times he hurt the team with his play. To many times he hurt his team with his play and was not the high positive impact player that Bron and Mike showed with eye test and with statistical data to back it up.

  10. #4840
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    Quote Originally Posted by McAllen Tx View Post
    In your unbiased opinion, as of right now who had a better career, LBJ or Kobe? Let's say LBJ were to never play another game, do you think he had a better career then Kobe?
    I def think Lebron had the better career. Remember, Iím into statistics. And if you look at best years of basketball statistically incorporating efficiency into everything as well, Lebron has probably 5-7 years better than Kobeís beat year when it comes to regular season, and probably 10 years of best playoff stats over Kobeís best year. So yes. Kobe has 2 more rings, Bron has 4mvp to Kobes 1 Mvp and 3 finals MVP to Kobeís 2. Now again. The stats back up what I am saying here. Itís not an opinion of who was better statistically, this is what the stats say.

  11. #4841
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Iíd rather have Kobeís career simply for the rings. But Iíd rather have Kevin McHaleís career than Karl Maloneís because he won 3 rings and Malone is unquestionably better than McHale.
    But we're not comparing McHale and Malone. We're comparing Kobe and LBJ and IKH brings up LBJs stats so then championships should also come into play.

  12. #4842
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    Quote Originally Posted by McAllen Tx View Post
    But we're not comparing McHale and Malone. We're comparing Kobe and LBJ and IKH brings up LBJs stats so then championships should also come into play.
    But the career you had doesnít make you a better player. Being a better player makes you a better player. Robert Horry had an unquestionable better career than say Al Horford, but Horford is just a way better player.

    Iíd rather have Kobeís career for the simple fact Iíd have rather been drafted and developed on a team with Shaq than Zydrunas Ilgauskas. But as for who is the better basketball player, itís LeBron.

  13. #4843
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    Quote Originally Posted by McAllen Tx View Post
    In your unbiased opinion, as of right now who had a better career, LBJ or Kobe? Let's say LBJ were to never play another game, do you think he had a better career then Kobe?
    It depends on what you mean. Lebron career is as successful as Kobe however Kobe playing in Lakers had more exposure making him more popular worldwide. Your playing for an iconic franchise. Even with That Lebron will still go down as the better player.
    Last edited by ldawg; 05-23-2020 at 08:58 PM.

  14. #4844
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    But the career you had doesnít make you a better player. Being a better player makes you a better player. Robert Horry had an unquestionable better career than say Al Horford, but Horford is just a way better player.

    Iíd rather have Kobeís career for the simple fact Iíd have rather been drafted and developed on a team with Shaq than Zydrunas Ilgauskas. But as for who is the better basketball player, itís LeBron.
    We're comparing alphas but you bring up a role player fortunate to be on great teams. When comparing alphas championships IMO hold more weight then individual stats.

    Unless you're saying Kobe was a role player.

  15. #4845
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    Quote Originally Posted by McAllen Tx View Post
    We're comparing alphas but you bring up a role player fortunate to be on great teams. When comparing alphas championships IMO hold more weight then individual stats.

    Unless you're saying Kobe was a role player.
    he was just making an example.

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