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  1. #706
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    Quote Originally Posted by CP_414 View Post
    Just curious, do you guys watch football when the bears (or your team) is out? Hockey/basketball/college sports? It seems like baseball is unique. Iím guessing most football fans watch the playoffs and most nba fans watch even after their team is out. Everyone watches the Super Bowl. Hockey is a regional game like baseball, but the sense I get is that hockey fans really love hockey. It seems like the majority of baseball fans just follow their team and then they are mostly uninterested in everybody else. Did you get more excited about non cubs games in the playoffs when the Cubs were non-contenders?

    Maybe thatís totally wrong. Iím watching the playoffs.
    Myself....I watch football all the time. Primarily because of fantasy, and I bet on the games.

    I don't follow hockey as much as most Hawks fans. Basketball to me is awful. Scoring has no value to it. It just keeps going back and forth. Plus I put NBA hoops in the same category as the WWE, and harness racing.

    I love baseball. But I mostly love the history of the game, going back to Harry Wright, Alexander Cartwright, Al Spalding, etc. I find if fascinating to have learned about the evolution of the sport. The way the rules have changed are mind boggling. However, watching non Cubs games could be painful. The pace is maddening to me. The mound visits......the excessive pitching changes.......the batter constantly stepping out of the box.......the pitcher taking :20 to pitch the friggin ball. Those are my issues with the game. And when the Cubs pitching can't throw a strike, I want to explode!

    When the Cubs are eliminated I lose interest for those reasons, and the fact that I get very upset knowing that I'm watching some other jack off teams instead of the Cubs. It's honestly hard for me.

  2. #707
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    Quote Originally Posted by CP_414 View Post
    But itís not about the Cubs choosing to play that style. It was forced upon them because he had to make pitching changes. The takeaway here is that even with $100 million in your rotation you need to have a really deep bullpen because starters donít pitch deep into games that often anymore. Give me more multi-inning relievers so the bullpen can pitch more innings with fewer different pitchers.

    The Cubs bullpen has been good the last few months. Just use the right ones.
    I think that if a good percentage of pitchers were allowed to get to 120-130 pitches, they would be fine. They did it before, and they did it on every 4th day. Today's pitchers are much better equipped physically and technologically to pitch deep in to games, than the pitchers that actually did it. But it's not happening. The managers hold them back to the point that when they need to go deeper, they can't. They are conditioned to pitch much less than they are actually capable of. To me it's sad. I love seeing a starter go deep in to a game. I hate seeing a starter that's pitching well, get taken out because of some deflated pitch count.

  3. #708
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
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    9,872

    Reds (lulz) at Cubs (81-68) IGT: The Comeback Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by thawv View Post
    I think that if a good percentage of pitchers were allowed to get to 120-130 pitches, they would be fine. They did it before, and they did it on every 4th day. Today's pitchers are much better equipped physically and technologically to pitch deep in to games, than the pitchers that actually did it. But it's not happening. The managers hold them back to the point that when they need to go deeper, they can't. They are conditioned to pitch much less than they are actually capable of. To me it's sad. I love seeing a starter go deep in to a game. I hate seeing a starter that's pitching well, get taken out because of some deflated pitch count.
    I know youíve been told this a million times and you keep ignoring it, but you are wrong about this.

    Todayís pitchers collectively throw harder than ever before, they throw with more spin than ever before. Pitchers from 50 years ago didnít do what these guys do. Its a physical evolution. The athletes are better now. The training is better. The technique is better. Itís not comparable. Pitching strategies from 50 years ago are as relevant as medical strategies from 50 years ago. Some of it is still good, but a lot of **** has changed. Do you want a doctor who hasnít learned anything new in the last 50 years?

    The game today also has way more pitchers with great stuff than it did 50 years ago. There is no reason for a starting pitcher to throw that many pitches today. The more you pitch the less effective you are and with bullpens full of guys throwing 95+ with high spin breaking stuff that fresh reliever is normally a better pitcher than the tired starter who the hitter has seen 3 times. When pitchers go on short rest in the playoffs they generally do worse.

    The teams that embrace the fact that pitchers do worse the more times through the order are doing it right. The present and the future is a high volume of good pitchers in short-medium spurts and the occasional stud who can go deep in games.
    Last edited by CP_414; 09-19-2019 at 05:17 PM.

  4. #709
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    Quote Originally Posted by CP_414 View Post
    I know youíve been told this a million times and you keep ignoring it, but you are wrong about this.

    Todayís pitchers collectively throw harder than ever before, they throw with more spin than ever before. Pitchers from 50 years ago didnít do what these guys do. Its a physical evolution. The athletes are better now. The training is better. The technique is better. Itís not comparable. Pitching strategies from 50 years ago are as relevant as medical strategies from 50 years ago. Some of it is still good, but a lot of **** has changed. Do you want a doctor who hasnít learned anything new in the last 50 years?

    The game today also has way more pitchers with great stuff than it did 50 years ago. There is no reason for a starting pitcher to throw that many pitches today. The more you pitch the less effective you are and with bullpens full of guys throwing 95+ with high spin breaking stuff that fresh reliever is normally a better pitcher than the tired starter who the hitter has seen 3 times. When pitchers go on short rest in the playoffs they generally do worse.

    The teams that embrace the fact that pitchers do worse the more times through the order are doing it right. The present and the future is a high volume of good pitchers in short-medium spurts and the occasional stud who can go deep in games.
    Throwing harder does not necessarily equate to throwing faster. A guy that throws 98 opposed to a guy that throws 91 are using the same amount of stress on their arm.

    Everything you said about the athletes being better is true. That's another reason that I think they can do at the very least what the lesser athletes did.

    My argument isn't that the strategies have changed. They have. I just think that starter should and would go deeper into games if they are allowed to.

    Your last sentence is absolutely true. I just prefer to keep the starter in until he's no longer effective. Not until he starts getting rocked. But there are signs of no longer being effective. He has 4 days to rest. He'll be fine. Another thing to consider is, the more guys that pitch out of the pen, the more chance there is of one of them blowing up.

    Just because that's the way baseball is going, doesn't mean that I have to like it.

    Agree to disagree.

  5. #710
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
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    9,872
    Quote Originally Posted by thawv View Post
    Throwing harder does not necessarily equate to throwing faster. A guy that throws 98 opposed to a guy that throws 91 are using the same amount of stress on their arm.

    Everything you said about the athletes being better is true. That's another reason that I think they can do at the very least what the lesser athletes did.

    My argument isn't that the strategies have changed. They have. I just think that starter should and would go deeper into games if they are allowed to.

    Your last sentence is absolutely true. I just prefer to keep the starter in until he's no longer effective. Not until he starts getting rocked. But there are signs of no longer being effective. He has 4 days to rest. He'll be fine. Another thing to consider is, the more guys that pitch out of the pen, the more chance there is of one of them blowing up.

    Just because that's the way baseball is going, doesn't mean that I have to like it.

    Agree to disagree.
    I believe your first paragraph is wrong. As velocity increases so does the likelihood of Tommy John.

    Nobodyís asking you to like it, but 1970 baseball is dead.

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