It’s time to move on from Carr

[MackAttack88]

I've outlined it before but I'm going to go over it again. I really get tired of people saying that Carr was great in 2016 but failing to see that he was just as good last season. It is also very easy to see why he struggled in 2017 and 2018.

In 2017 Carr was fine until he suffered multiple injuries. He had both ankle and back injuries that severely limited his mobility. He couldn't move to avoid rushers and often threw balls off of his back foot as he had a difficult time stepping into his throws. The results were that he was TERRIBLE that season...BECAUSE OF INJURIES!

2018 is just as easy to explain. We had the worst receiving core in the league and two rookie tackles that were turnstiles. Yes he checked the ball down regularly...BECAUSE HE HAD TO! He did not have time to do anything but check the ball down or take a sack. Literally those were his two options.

Last season he was healthy and he got good play from his OL. The result was excellent play until we got into the red zone. I can see some of the blame going his way but I would put much more on Gruden's play calling and our overall lack of receiving options. His top two targets were a TE (Waller) that had never even had 100 yards receiving in a season and a rookie receiver (Renfrow) both of whom were still learning there way in this league.

This year he is playing better than ever. He's got more talent at WR and he has shown that he has total command of this offense. I don't think his receivers dropped a single pass during the first four games of the season. Since then there seem to have been 2-3 big drops every game. I could make an argument that he would be the front runner for league MVP if the receivers hadn't started to get the dropsies. He would easily have a couple of hundred more passing yards and a few more touchdowns.

Think about it. If Agholor makes those catches against KC then we would have ended up winning that game. If we win suddenly Carr would be getting praised by everyone in the league for outplaying and beating Mahomes TWICE! PFF gave him the highest grade of the season for any QB, a 96.0. Take away his last throw and every other throw hit its intended target (23 completions, 4 drops, 2 throwaways and a 50/50 ball in the endzone that Edwards had both hands on and was interfered with). The week before he had the highest grade of any QB that week. Drops by Waller and Ruggs made his numbers look mediocre but his actual play was outstanding.

Bottom line, I am not looking for an upgrade at QB because I don't see one. No one is going to show the command of this offense the way that Carr has this season.

[FarOutIos]

Carr is doing great. His “command of the offense” is great. But he is just a very good QB playing great. That’s wonderful.

But I’d like to know what a great quarterback playing great feels like.

If we can upgrade, I’d do it. I think it would be nice to see what grudens ceiling is.

[Proximo]

I don't care if you are pro Carr or not, you have no idea what you are talking about.

Did you even watch him in college? Because clearly you didn't.

When you get rid of your QBs top receivers what did you think was going to happen? The fact that he had to check it down so much last year and the year before was because of the lack of talent. A lot of those throws were designed plays too.

This year he actually has receivers that can go deep. Both Ruggs and Agohol have speed that needs to be respected. Last year, who did we have? Or the year before?

He has been playing for perpetual rebuilds most of his career. Those situations can be career killers for QB’s.

My concern was 2017 and beyond. There was something different with Carr after the Redskins game and it was all mental.

Yes-he now has talent around him now at the skilled posits but it’s been more than that with Derek. He is a different player this season.

But...We are 10 games into the 2020 season. Let’s see how this plays out.

Which has me thinking-WTF has Indy Raider been?


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[mmbt]

Carr is doing great. His “command of the offense” is great. But he is just a very good QB playing great. That’s wonderful.

But I’d like to know what a great quarterback playing great feels like.

Wouldn't have been any better this last game no matter who was in. DC played a near-flawless game. Ignoring the final desperation INT, he had only 7 incompletions all game long. Of those 7:

4 hit the receivers in the hands and were dropped
1 should have been a PI but was on target again
1 was intentionally thrown away

I mean, that's crazy good. The guy was nearly perfectly on target on just about every single throw, even ones where he was under pressure. Aaron Rodgers on his best day is like that, perhaps. It just doesn't get much better than that.

I know Mahomes is getting all the love for the comeback win, but truthfully I thought DC outplayed him for the 2nd time in two meetings ... the difference was KC's pass catchers outplayed ours. Just like in the first game, our receivers made big/tough catches, while KC had a couple drops that could have extended drives and gotten them points.

If we can upgrade, I’d do it. I think it would be nice to see what grudens ceiling is.

No one better is available for trade or via the open market. And the odds of finding an upgrade in the draft are slim. Not that I'm against taking a flyer on a mid round prospect to start grooming. But that's just something you should routinely do every few drafts anyway.

[dbacknick]

Sorry, but I see a dramatic improvement over last year. He's comfortable and confident. Last year he had that lost in the headlights look, not to mention a lot of miscommunication with receivers. You don't see that at all this year. If he finishes the year like this, he will get extended. For you guys who want to upgrade.....to who? Another rookie that will take 2-3 years to learn the system. Sorry, but this thread is no longer applicable.

[mmbt]

Sorry, but I see a dramatic improvement over last year. He's comfortable and confident. Last year he had that lost in the headlights look, not to mention a lot of miscommunication with receivers. You don't see that at all this year.

He's definitely taken a step forward, although I'll say last year wasn't awful by NFL standards ... he had flaws, but he also did some good things. It was definitely a mixed bag though. This year, it's pretty much all good.

The nicest thing though is that he's played his best against some of the best opponents we've faced, like NO and KC twice. In the past he's had some struggles in spotlight games, but now it seems to be the opposite and he's actually stepping up in big moments.

And while we couldn't stop KC's offense, they sure as hell couldn't stop ours. Go look at their scores, opponents are not exactly lighting it up against them. Yet over 8 quarters have you seen any signs that they can stop our offense? I haven't. Coming into the season KC fans were yapping about how their team owns DC, but right now I guarantee you that they are hoping like hell that they don't have to face Carr a 3rd time this year.

[dbacknick]

He's definitely taken a step forward, although I'll say last year wasn't awful by NFL standards ... he had flaws, but he also did some good things. It was definitely a mixed bag though. This year, it's pretty much all good.

The nicest thing though is that he's played his best against some of the best opponents we've faced, like NO and KC twice. In the past he's had some struggles in spotlight games, but now it seems to be the opposite and he's actually stepping up in big moments.

And while we couldn't stop KC's offense, they sure as hell couldn't stop ours. Go look at their scores, opponents are not exactly lighting it up against them. Yet over 8 quarters have you seen any signs that they can stop our offense? I haven't. Coming into the season KC fans were yapping about how their team owns DC, but right now I guarantee you that they are hoping like hell that they don't have to face Carr a 3rd time this year.

No doubt. And if the situation was reversed on Sunday, we finish on top. Just wish the D can get just a little bit better. One extra stop in a game would make a world of difference.

[FarOutIos]

Sorry, but I see a dramatic improvement over last year. He's comfortable and confident. Last year he had that lost in the headlights look, not to mention a lot of miscommunication with receivers. You don't see that at all this year. If he finishes the year like this, he will get extended. For you guys who want to upgrade.....to who? Another rookie that will take 2-3 years to learn the system. Sorry, but this thread is no longer applicable.

I’ve thought this thread was done a while ago. And have always defended carr to the haters. But, I’m not gonna rush to call him the goat. Seems like we’re always quick to rush to extremes. He’s a good quarterback playing great.

It’s obviously tough to get your hands on a great quarterback. Normally you’ll need a top 5 pick at least. And I realize we may not get that chance anytime soon. But... if we do get that chance. I’d take it. Even if it costs a couple draft picks to move up. I’d like a decade of winning. Not a couple borderline years.

[Proximo]

Sorry, but I see a dramatic improvement over last year. He's comfortable and confident. Last year he had that lost in the headlights look, not to mention a lot of miscommunication with receivers. You don't see that at all this year. If he finishes the year like this, he will get extended. For you guys who want to upgrade.....to who? Another rookie that will take 2-3 years to learn the system. Sorry, but this thread is no longer applicable.

I agree. The tangibles have always been there. It’s the intangibles that have taken him to the next level.


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[Megatron]

Carr is doing great. His “command of the offense” is great. But he is just a very good QB playing great. That’s wonderful.

But I’d like to know what a great quarterback playing great feels like.

If we can upgrade, I’d do it. I think it would be nice to see what grudens ceiling is.

Do you think Carr would be great if he got to throw to Tyreek Hill, Kelce, Watkins and Hardman? Instead of Waller, agholor, Ruggs, renfrow? Would the team be better with jones instead of Hankins? Etc?

THe reason I point this out is last year Mahomes threw up more 50-50 balls than any other qb in the nfl. And most of the time his wrs would help him out.

I know he wasn’t a beast for throwing to a wiiiiiide open kelce for the td. More of a crap d that gave it to him.

[Proximo]

Do you think Carr would be great if he got to throw to Tyreek Hill, Kelce, Watkins and Hardman? Instead of Waller, agholor, Ruggs, renfrow? Would the team be better with jones instead of Hankins? Etc?

THe reason I point this out is last year Mahomes threw up more 50-50 balls than any other qb in the nfl. And most of the time his wrs would help him out.

I know he wasn’t a beast for throwing to a wiiiiiide open kelce for the td. More of a crap d that gave it to him.

I get what you are saying but do you remember the great receiving corps the Raiders had in the late 1980’s early 1990’s?

Willie Gault, Mervyn Fernandez, James Lofton, Tim Brown.

Jay Schroeder still sucked never utilized that talent effectively.

I know the lack of talent has hurt Derek but it’s not always a definitive factor.


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[Shred003]

Do you think Carr would be great if he got to throw to Tyreek Hill, Kelce, Watkins and Hardman? Instead of Waller, agholor, Ruggs, renfrow? Would the team be better with jones instead of Hankins? Etc?

THe reason I point this out is last year Mahomes threw up more 50-50 balls than any other qb in the nfl. And most of the time his wrs would help him out.

I know he wasn’t a beast for throwing to a wiiiiiide open kelce for the td. More of a crap d that gave it to him.

This is the real issue.

The Raider defense has been terrible for years. How bad, you wonder?

If you take the Raider D and compare it to average, the Raiders have given up more yards and points than average in almost every season of Carr's career.

Not to get into the weeds, but Carr would almost certainly have a winning record if the Raider defense was merely AVERAGE his entire career.

Don't get me started on Carr's career if he had a top-10 defense bailing him out.

[suffer2peace]

Wouldn’t that fact just solidify the notion that Carr isn’t any better for us than the others we’ve had at the position in the past 20 years?

-Stork


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You still think the Raiders should move on from Carr?

[Switch]

Mayock and Gruden are polishing a turd hoping someone takes the bait. Hopefully it's a 2nd and a 3rd rounder for the eyeliner wearing, phantom rush fearing pseudo-GOAT.

Lol

[Switch]

It’s most certainly a team effort...that includes Carr who is making $20M and is CHOOSING to quit rather than compete.

Let’s liquidate him, increase our assets in both draft capital and cap space and use it to bring in talented guys who are willing to compete.

This isn’t difficult.

Carr couldn’t lead the ‘72 Dolphins anywhere.

-Stork


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Old man stork hope you are doing well