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  1. #6406
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    Quote Originally Posted by mberr View Post
    I agree, this improvement had really been a team effort. With Gruden and Carr, itís really a chicken or the egg situation. Gruden is calling the plays, but his system has never worked without a smart, vet QB. Carr had great success in 2016 but regressed massively and Gruden has helped him get rid of bad habits like being scared to throw downfield, being a check down king, and playing like heís hearing footsteps.


    Oh yeah, and itís not even close. Gruden has really only produced 3 good QBs as HC: Gannon, Jeff Garcia for 2 years, and Carr, Carr being the only one that wasnít geriatric. After that, the very distant next best Gruden QB is Chris Simms in the season when he almost died after trying to play through a ruptured spleen and having emergency surgery to get it removed.
    Not sure we can assume grudens system only works with vet QBs. My guess is that the smart QB thing is true. Or at least someone who is a student of the game. But that holds true in general. Iím hoping we get the chance to see gruden with an athletic/dual threat QB.

  2. #6407
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    Feb 2006
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    Quote Originally Posted by FarOutIos View Post
    Yeah, hasnít has many great ones. But not sure that can be attributed to gruden. As we can see, his offense takes a little longer to understand. Not sure that part is a good thing. So Simms was getting to that point until the injury. But I also think that up until now- and even still now to a pint- we really know very little about his coaching effects on an offense or QB. There needs to be consistency to fully understand. As Brady/bill are proving this year, consistency is the key for NFL success.

    Iím really excited to see what he can do next year with ruggs/Edwards getting a year of experience. Weíll need them to live up to the hype.
    At this point in time, Derek Carr is the clear #2 QB Gruden had as a HC... and, frankly, in 2-3 years, Carr might be the clear #1.

  3. #6408
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    Quote Originally Posted by mberr View Post
    I agree, this improvement had really been a team effort. With Gruden and Carr, itís really a chicken or the egg situation. Gruden is calling the plays, but his system has never worked without a smart, vet QB. Carr had great success in 2016 but regressed massively and Gruden has helped him get rid of bad habits like being scared to throw downfield, being a check down king, and playing like heís hearing footsteps.


    Oh yeah, and itís not even close. Gruden has really only produced 3 good QBs as HC: Gannon, Jeff Garcia for 2 years, and Carr, Carr being the only one that wasnít geriatric. After that, the very distant next best Gruden QB is Chris Simms in the season when he almost died after trying to play through a ruptured spleen and having emergency surgery to get it removed.
    You don't know what you are talking about. Carr was never scared to throw it downfield. When he has weapons, he performs well. The fact is, his receiving core was absolute **** after trading away Cooper. Who was he supposed to throw deep to? He had the worst receiving core last year after Tyrell Williams went down too. Look at this year, he actually has receivers that can get separation and go down field. What a difference talent makes.

    Carr played just as good well before Gruden. Saying Gruden "produced" Carr is laughable.

  4. #6409
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    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    A blind dog can find a pork chop once in awhile.
    How is the waxed Pinto doing buddy boy?

  5. #6410
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shred003 View Post
    At this point in time, Derek Carr is the clear #2 QB Gruden had as a HC... and, frankly, in 2-3 years, Carr might be the clear #1.
    Carr >>> Gannon

    Its not even close for me. Gannon had such a better team too. Carr is far more talented and will have the better career by a wide margin when its said and done.

  6. #6411
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    Ladies and Gents

    I present to you my new signature, to honor the most clueless poster here. Enjoy
    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Carr may very well be the worst starting QB in Raiders history. Carr is like a root canal that takes 8 hrs. The Raiders have stuck with this bum going on 7 seasons! All they have to show for it is excuses. I hope Mariorta runs him out of training camp.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Sounds as though Mayock is waxing the Pinto and installing fake leather seat covers and chrome hubcaps before posting it on Craigslist.

  7. #6412
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    Quote Originally Posted by Switch View Post
    Carr >>> Gannon

    Its not even close for me. Gannon had such a better team too. Carr is far more talented and will have the better career by a wide margin when its said and done.
    Bold.

    Historically, whenever I've gotten too bullish on Carr, his performance fell off a cliff. Hopefully this time it's just constant improvement.

    I can say, for certain, Derek Carr has a "losing record" because he's been the QB of a team with a HISTORICALLY bad defense for the past 7 seasons.

  8. #6413
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    Quote Originally Posted by Switch View Post
    Carr >>> Gannon

    Its not even close for me. Gannon had such a better team too. Carr is far more talented and will have the better career by a wide margin when its said and done.
    Lets see him become an All Pro, win a few playoff games and lead the team to the Super Bowl before you start with this nonsense.

    If you want to keep running around the playground saying I told you so we might have to sit you down for nap time.
    Last edited by Proximo; 11-24-2020 at 06:18 PM.

  9. #6414
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shred003 View Post
    Bold.

    Historically, whenever I've gotten too bullish on Carr, his performance fell off a cliff. Hopefully this time it's just constant improvement.

    I can say, for certain, Derek Carr has a "losing record" because he's been the QB of a team with a HISTORICALLY bad defense for the past 7 seasons.
    When Carr has talent around him, he performs very well. This year is a good example of that.

    I've already said it before and I'll say it again, If I was Derek Carr I would have wanted out a long time ago. This franchise has been absolute dog **** the last 2 decades. They have failed him since the day he was drafted. Had he started his career with a decent franchise, it would be a completely different story. He would have those playoff wins and "winning record"
    Last edited by Switch; 11-24-2020 at 06:48 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Carr may very well be the worst starting QB in Raiders history. Carr is like a root canal that takes 8 hrs. The Raiders have stuck with this bum going on 7 seasons! All they have to show for it is excuses. I hope Mariorta runs him out of training camp.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Sounds as though Mayock is waxing the Pinto and installing fake leather seat covers and chrome hubcaps before posting it on Craigslist.

  10. #6415
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    Quote Originally Posted by Switch View Post
    Ladies and Gents

    I present to you my new signature, to honor the most clueless poster here. Enjoy
    He honourably ate his words already switch. Maybe target the others. Many of the Carr hater club havenít even posted this season guess that tells you enough about them. Whereís Mr Iíll fight everyone at the park and Mr tired of wasting money on games in KC. They must be loving this season they donít feel the need to post. Enjoy guys Derek says these wins are for you

    Now the tough part of the season itís money time.

  11. #6416
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    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Lets see him become an All Pro, win a few playoff games and lead the team to the Super Bowl before you start with this nonsense.

    If you want to keep running around the playground saying I told you so we might have to sit you down for nap time.
    The only nonsense is you. Surround Carr with the talent Gannon had and you have your playoff games and all pros and superbowl. Its that simple.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Carr may very well be the worst starting QB in Raiders history. Carr is like a root canal that takes 8 hrs. The Raiders have stuck with this bum going on 7 seasons! All they have to show for it is excuses. I hope Mariorta runs him out of training camp.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Sounds as though Mayock is waxing the Pinto and installing fake leather seat covers and chrome hubcaps before posting it on Craigslist.

  12. #6417
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inspector View Post
    He honourably ate his words already switch. Maybe target the others. Many of the Carr hater club havenít even posted this season guess that tells you enough about them. Whereís Mr Iíll fight everyone at the park and Mr tired of wasting money on games in KC. They must be loving this season they donít feel the need to post. Enjoy guys Derek says these wins are for you

    Now the tough part of the season itís money time.
    Funny how they disappear right? Lol

    At least Prox is sticking around. I'll give him that. But he's still clueless
    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Carr may very well be the worst starting QB in Raiders history. Carr is like a root canal that takes 8 hrs. The Raiders have stuck with this bum going on 7 seasons! All they have to show for it is excuses. I hope Mariorta runs him out of training camp.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Sounds as though Mayock is waxing the Pinto and installing fake leather seat covers and chrome hubcaps before posting it on Craigslist.

  13. #6418
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    Iíve been wrong about Carr also. More than his actual play was the fear that I perceived him playing with. I could see it on his face and in his body language. It showed in his eagerness to throw away the ball, even on fourth down. Iím seeing none of that this year. Nothing but determination on his face and the will to win in his body language. Heís always looking to make a play now, and if he canít throw it, he takes off and runs. I thought he was broken and unable to get his mojo back. I love it, and who doesnít love a good comeback story?
    I donít think itís as simple as having better players around him. No matter the caliber of players around him, the QB should still try to make the play. At least, thatís what I want to see from any QB. Something snapped in Carr this season. I think he hit his low point and, instead of curling up in a ball, he stood up and fought his way back. This is, of course, all my clueless opinion. But, itís better to be clueless than classless, like some of us.

  14. #6419
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    Apr 2019
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    Quote Originally Posted by FarOutIos View Post
    Yeah, hasnít has many great ones. But not sure that can be attributed to gruden. As we can see, his offense takes a little longer to understand.
    Meh, Jeff Garcia picked it up in 1 off season. I think itís gotta be sense QBs that love to study and vet QBs that already know how to read defenses well and not get tricked. Obviously, Iím talking about a regular QB, Iím sure a young Rodgers or Manning could master the offense.

    Quote Originally Posted by Switch View Post
    You don't know what you are talking about. Carr was never scared to throw it downfield. When he has weapons, he performs well. The fact is, his receiving core was absolute **** after trading away Cooper. Who was he supposed to throw deep to? He had the worst receiving core last year after Tyrell Williams went down too. Look at this year, he actually has receivers that can get separation and go down field. What a difference talent makes.

    Carr played just as good well before Gruden. Saying Gruden "produced" Carr is laughable.
    lol you are so sensitive you even lash out at people who are pro-Carr. Whatís wrong with saying Carr used to be a check down king? It was his knock ever since coming out of college. He surpassed it in 2016, then regressed, then surpassed it again this year.

    Youíre saying the new WRs this year elevated his game? Agholor has more yards than Ruggs and Edwards combined. Agholor is not a #1 receiver, maybe a #2 if he keeps playing like he has this year. No, itís that there been a focus on the deep passing game, thatís why Renfrow has had so many big plays this year. Heíll, even Ingold is getting targeted deep. IDK how anyone can deny this.

  15. #6420
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    Quote Originally Posted by mberr View Post
    Meh, Jeff Garcia picked it up in 1 off season. I think itís gotta be sense QBs that love to study and vet QBs that already know how to read defenses well and not get tricked. Obviously, Iím talking about a regular QB, Iím sure a young Rodgers or Manning could master the offense.



    lol you are so sensitive you even lash out at people who are pro-Carr. Whatís wrong with saying Carr used to be a check down king? It was his knock ever since coming out of college. He surpassed it in 2016, then regressed, then surpassed it again this year.

    Youíre saying the new WRs this year elevated his game? Agholor has more yards than Ruggs and Edwards combined. Agholor is not a #1 receiver, maybe a #2 if he keeps playing like he has this year. No, itís that there been a focus on the deep passing game, thatís why Renfrow has had so many big plays this year. Heíll, even Ingold is getting targeted deep. IDK how anyone can deny this.
    I don't care if you are pro Carr or not, you have no idea what you are talking about.

    Did you even watch him in college? Because clearly you didn't.

    When you get rid of your QBs top receivers what did you think was going to happen? The fact that he had to check it down so much last year and the year before was because of the lack of talent. A lot of those throws were designed plays too.

    This year he actually has receivers that can go deep. Both Ruggs and Agohol have speed that needs to be respected. Last year, who did we have? Or the year before?
    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Carr may very well be the worst starting QB in Raiders history. Carr is like a root canal that takes 8 hrs. The Raiders have stuck with this bum going on 7 seasons! All they have to show for it is excuses. I hope Mariorta runs him out of training camp.
    Quote Originally Posted by Proximo View Post
    Sounds as though Mayock is waxing the Pinto and installing fake leather seat covers and chrome hubcaps before posting it on Craigslist.

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